Messages

91

Beer Recipes / Saison de Noel

« on: November 02, 2012, 05:22:41 AM »

U don't like wlp 566?

I'll chime in here.. i'm not a fan of 566 at all.

Because?  I've only ever used that and DuPont, the latter of which may have good flavors, but process-wise it was a Disaster for me.

92

General Homebrew Discussion / Question for experienced homebrewers who still bottle condition

« on: November 01, 2012, 08:47:13 AM »

Bottles about 2.5 weeks ago

93

General Homebrew Discussion / Question for experienced homebrewers who still bottle condition

« on: November 01, 2012, 08:04:54 AM »

Ok I have been brewing for almost 3 years and have had MAJOR improvements in my process and my beer, and have won a few comps.  Added temp control, adequate/healthy yeast pitches from starters, and nice long primary ferments.  I recently started kegging occasionally (only occasionally because I live in the city and don’t have room for a dedicated serving fridge) and noticed something.
 
I kegged my first lager, an Oktoberfest fermented @ 50 degrees (~3 weeks), lagered at 35 degrees for 4 weeks, but also bottled/primed about a gallon of it and allowed for natural carbonation in the bottle (still doing this with the majority of my brews, again given the absence of a serving fridge and using my spare fridge for a ferment chamber)
 
The O fest tasted GREAT out of the keg.  A touch caramelly (maybe too much Vienna), but otherwise, great aroma, rich malt character, and clean/dry finish.  I grabbed a 22oz  bottle of the bottle-conditioned O-fest to take to my brothers house, which we had with a steak last night.  The bottle conditioned version had a slight cidery/astringent/sherry ‘edge’ in the aroma (not so much in the taste).  My brother couldn’t pick it up, but perhaps because I was expecting the beer I had out of the keg, I definitely caught something weird an unpleasant that I have noticed in other beers I’ve made, particularly those that are bottle-conditioned.
 
There is an off-chance I poured some yeast in the glass.  There is also an off chance my bottles were not GLEAMINGLY clean (typically, I triple/quad rinse HEAVILY after emptying a bottle and store them uncapped prior to sanitizing only before re-use…I know it’s a bit of a dice roll, but I feel like I am dislodging any gunk, then rinsing away anything else with my ‘after-use’ cleaning of bottles).
 
My question is, has anyone ever experienced off-flavors from the priming sugar itself (I use corn sugar dissolved in boiling water), or conducted a side-by-side to taste a kegged beer vs. a bottle-conditioned beer?  Usually, I will add the cooled simple syrup ON TOP of the racked beer prior to filling bottles, trying to minimize splashing.  I do this because I want to know my exact volume to properly measure priming sugar weight (sans trub).  Also, I am somewhat lax in CLEANING bottling wands, racking canes, hosing, etc., but typically soak in sanitizer for 30 minutes or so prior to use.  I know, I know, you can’t sanitize a turd and all that.
 
So it is likely there is an issue for me at packaging, and I need to discipline myself to clean AND sanitize everything.
 
Sorry for the long post, but just trying to pinpoint this and see if anyone else has had bottle-conditioning issues.

94

General Homebrew Discussion / Passed my bjcp online entrance!

« on: October 30, 2012, 07:39:49 PM »

Was originally planning on taking it and failing just to get some recon on the exam, but I guess since i read ray Daniels in the bathroom at work and listen to jamil on the way to work, I could futz my way through the questions!  Hopefully taking the tasting portion in feb, any pointers appreciated!

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Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Wyeast 3711 French Saison

« on: October 30, 2012, 04:07:14 PM »

WLP 566.  Attenuates well and doesn't have the stalled fermentation issue of WLP 565 (Dupont).  I did a BGSA/Saison blend last year that went from the 1.10 range down to about 1.008 with it.  Have heard good things about wy3711 though. 

96

All Grain Brewing / Re: Too much caramunich, doh!

« on: October 28, 2012, 11:38:05 AM »

I may actually enter this.  Excellent saisony/orange/corainder nose, nice tartness from the pureed cranberries.  Was thinking i may need to add extract as well, but I don't think so.  Gorgeous color too.

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Yeast and Fermentation / Post a pic of your Pellicle!

« on: October 27, 2012, 06:34:35 PM »

Terrifying.  Simply terrifying.  Like the series premiere of the walking dead.  Terrifying I a way that I love.

98

All Grain Brewing / Too much caramunich, doh!

« on: October 27, 2012, 06:32:04 PM »

Wow.  Tried a sample after being on the cranberries for 5 days.  Wow.  Excellent.

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Beer Recipes / Saison de Noel

« on: October 27, 2012, 06:30:56 PM »

U don't like wlp 566?

100

Ask the Experts / Re: Ask the Experts: Mitch Steele on IPA

« on: October 27, 2012, 05:36:13 PM »

Some of the best IPA's I've had are not overly bitter (at least to my palette).  Conversely, some of the WORST ones I've had ARE overly bitter!  To me, the real genius of an IPA lies in linking up a substantial, complex (yet background) malt profile with a layered, pleasant, and aggressive hop profile.  Just an example, and I know it is marketed as an APA, but Dale's is a great example of this.  If googled, you can find dozens of amateur video reviews of this beer, relishing its 'hoppiness'.  While it is 'hoppy', I think the reason it sells so well, drinks so well, and INTRODUCES so many people to the category so well, is that its malt background balances out a great hop bouquet.   

Are there any key processes or malts that brewers (particularly on a homebrew scale) could/should play with to get these types of results?  Melanoidin?  Biscuit?  Base of Marris Otter?

Great job on the "Enjoy By" IPA btw!

Cheers-

101

General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Holy Hell....its hot-side aeration

« on: October 19, 2012, 04:34:34 PM »

Do you taste the off flavor in the green beer at bottling time?
A little O2 when bottle conditioning can't be that bad, since the yeast will scavenge it.

not really.  Its almost like it happens in the bottles.

102

General Homebrew Discussion / Holy Hell....its hot-side aeration

« on: October 19, 2012, 07:07:13 AM »

I’ve never really known what recirculating means.  Is this just taking a mash paddle and stirring it in the opposite direction of the coils?  Wait, that’s whirlpooling.  My wort is sitting in the boil kettle during chilling.  How do I recirculate without buying/building more gear?
 
This twist in my process came from me wanting to simplify process and equipment.  I read a lot about no-chill brewing, and thought I might try it.  Then a guy over @ HB Chatter was telling me about this ‘partial chill’ method, and that he got great results.  I do have to say that clarity has not been a problem with this method, and it allows me to pitch cold, especially for lagers.
 
The people that claim HSA is a myth (and I listened to the Brew Strong episode where Dr. Charlie Bamforth) discusses it) are partially correct.  Typically for homebrewers, the ‘hot side’ process ends at flameout.  The boil will drive off most of the compounds that form as a result of oxygenating/aerating hot wort.  However, with my partial chill-process, my ‘hot side’ goes a little longer, and there is POST BOIL activity on the hot side….so I probably need to be a little more careful about aerating since it is post boil….AND since it is above 80 degrees and aldehydes can still form.
 
The reality is, it’s a pretty simple fix in hooking up a sanitized hose to the valve to transfer from the kettle to the fermenter.
 
@jeffy, this beer was bottled barely a week before my sampling.  So it could just be ‘green beer’.  But the flavor is something I recognize in old and young beer of mine.
 
@ Redbeerman, really not hating on plate chillers, but in my little rowhouse, it almost seems to be more trouble than its worth.  My IC will chill it in 20 minutes or so, and for the hassle of sanitizing the chiller and pump, hooking it all up, only to have my wort drip out a bit too warm and have to adjust flow, I will just stick to the
 
Finally, HEEEERE IS THE WEIRD THING…I just pulled a pint of my Oktoberfest last night, which has been conditioning in the keg for about 4 weeks.  This flavor is not present.  (FYI, I only keg occasionally since I don’t have a dedicated serving fridge, but have 2 kegs and a CO2 tank)….And the beer was done with my weird partial chill method and vigorous dumping.  Maybe I could be getting oxidation at bottling?
 
Bottling process is this:
-rack to bottling bucket, figure out final volume of beer
-calculate desired volumes CO2, dissolve appropriate weight of corn sugar in water, ADD THIS to the beer in the bottling bucket (I try to do it gently, but there is some splashing…I do it this way because I can’t be totally sure of final volume in the primary fermenter, as I will leave trub, etc. behind).
-bottles:  fill each with a few grains of oxy clean and water, let sit for a few hours or overnight; spray each with carboy/bottle sprayer/blaster thingy, spray each with star san, let sit for another 10-15 minutes, drain
-fill with bottling cane
 
I don’t CO2 purge the bottles.

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General Homebrew Discussion / Holy Hell....its hot-side aeration

« on: October 17, 2012, 07:27:30 PM »

So I have been trying to pinpoint a flavor that is coming through in the majority of my beers.  Some people, BJCP-certified in my club even, can't pick it up.  But I know it.  Well.  And haven't really been able to pinpoint it. 

After tasting my latest IPA experiment, I noticed it AGAIN.  Its a somewhat cardboard, tart, papery off flavor. 

When my boil is complete, I have been immersion chilling, as for a 5 gallon batch, my plate chiller is just not worth the trouble.  Until recently, I would cool it down to pitching temp or near it with the immersion.  Lately, I've been partial chilling below 140 to stave off DMS, then placing in the fermenting fridge to get the beer exactly to pitching temp (albeit a bit more slowly).  In both methods though, I have been directly dumping out of the kettle into the fermenter, sometimes a bit vigorously.  I will leave as much trub as I can behind (I don't whirlpool), but after my wort has chilled to pitching temp, I will vigorously dump into a new clean, sanitized fermenter before pitching, and decant off the trub. 

Either way though, aldehydes are forming from introducing the beer to too much oxygen when its above 80 degrees right?  (it is rare that I will chill with my IC below 80...usually more like 100-110). 

Has anyone else made this mistake, or corrected it and noticed improvement??

I need to read How to Brew all over again....I spent my first 10 batches boiling with the lid ON because I had it in my head that I didn't want to lose volume (this is before Ray Daniels schooled me that the TOTAL GRAVITY in the pot cannot change!!  Ie, no you are not losing WORT with boil off!!)

104

Beer Recipes / Re: Saison de Noel

« on: October 15, 2012, 06:41:38 PM »

Whatever you do , do NOT use the Dupont yeast (WLP 565, not sure of the WY equivalent), unless you want to repitch US-05 or champagne yeast when it stalls on you. 

I have had fantastic results when using "saison II" or WL 566.  Not sure if the WY strain above is the equivalent or not, but it is a great attenuator and gives excellent saison characteristics without corainder or other adjunct additions. 

With that much munich, you might consider mashing even lower.  Jamil suggests 148 to get it as dry as possible (to his point, I have had many saisons that are simply not dry enough).  75 min mash is a good idea as you state. 

Jamil also says it is a good idea to pitch good, healthy, viable yeast, but do not overpitch (he suggests making the starter the morning of your brew day), so you can get some growth. 

Good luck!  Hops, etc. look great!

105

CO / BJCP Lessons?

« on: October 15, 2012, 04:23:29 PM »

It's not purely dedicated to what you are looking for, but The Brewmasters Table is a GREAT read that goes through the taste profile, history, and FOOD PAIRINGS of most BJCP styles.  A great thing to do as well if u do not have any structured live tastings is to print out a copy of the BJCP style guidelines and a bottle of one of the commercial examples of a particular style, and read it as you taste. 

One more rec: download The jamil shows podcasts where he goes through how to brew the styles.  Great notes on flavor profiles, etc.