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Other than Brewing => The Pub => Topic started by: gmac on February 06, 2012, 09:18:50 PM

Title: My Back's Killing me
Post by: gmac on February 06, 2012, 09:18:50 PM
My back is killing me.  All I did was get out of bed the other day  Seriously.  That's it. 
I've missed two planned brew days so far.  If this keeps up, I'll be buying beer soon.
What do you suggest for lower back pain?
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: morticaixavier on February 06, 2012, 10:13:39 PM
All right I voted kilt, you knew I would. but I have been told by very authoritative sounding drunks in bars that beer is an excellent muscle relaxant. The only thing you have to remember is just because it stops hurting doesn't mean you aren't hurt anymore. A couple beers. some good rest on a comfortable mattress (I love my memory foam mattress couldn't live without it) and some very light stretching. very light at first until it starts to work. don't bounce and don't push past the very edge of (as my yoga instructor use dto put it) 'interesting.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: punatic on February 06, 2012, 10:15:35 PM
My wife is a massage therapist.  When I get a sore back the first thing she suggests is the "ice and rice" treatment.  It has cured me more times than I can count.  

Ice & Rice treatment consists of alternating an icepack for 10 minutes, nothing for ten minutes, heatpack for ten minutes, nothing for ten minutes, repeat...

I use a soft/flexible blue ice pack wrapped in a towel for the ice part.  The rice part of the treatment is pretty cool.  It is a DIY microwave heatpack:

Take a clean tube sock, fill it 3/4 full with uncooked white rice, then tie a knot in the open end of the sock to keep the rice in.

The heating time for the rice sock depends on the size of your sock and the power of your microwave oven.  Experiment to find the heat level you are comfortable with.  Mine is 2 minutes 30 seconds,  but my wife likes it at 3 minutes even.

Hope this helps.

If it doesn't you might try a combination of massage and chiropractics.  The two combined are very good for pain relief.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: euge on February 06, 2012, 10:58:13 PM
Where is the pain? In the lumbar or thoracolumbar region?

Try drinking a lot of water for a few days. Many liters. Whenever I hear of idiopathic back pain the kidneys spring immediately to mind. And bear in mind that beer has a lot of calcium oxalate in it which is the primary mineral in calculi. It might not be back strain is all I'm saying. Drink that water.

And how did you get out of bed? Backflip? ;D
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: theoman on February 07, 2012, 01:51:23 AM
Been there. I've had back problems on and off for a while. The last time it went was the worst. I went to the doc, got some good drugs and once I was able to move again, I went to Dr. Google and found this guy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNN3K2qj-L0

A few days of these stretches, especially the "90/90" stretch, saved my life. I now stretch nearly every day and do regular core strengthening exercises. I haven't had a problem in months.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: gmac on February 07, 2012, 09:56:16 AM
Where is the pain? In the lumbar or thoracolumbar region?
Not sure which is which so it's mostly lower back, opposite the navel.  I'm sort of hunched over and twisted to the right slightly.  I can bend right a bit but not left at all and down very well.  I'll try the water but I think this is likely muscular.  

Take a clean tube sock, fill it 3/4 full with uncooked white rice, then tie a knot in the open end of the sock to keep the rice in.


I thought you were going to say" tie a knot in the open end of the sock and have your wife beat you soundly with the rice."  I'll try the hot rice method first but this stage, the beating may actually be an option.

And how did you get out of bed? Backflip? ;D
Picture a walrus hauling out on an ice flow, that gives you an idea of my normal, non-injured gracefulness.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: morticaixavier on February 07, 2012, 10:37:25 AM
sounds like it's time for a new mattress.

try this, but be careful

lay on your back on the floor with your knees up and fingers interlocked behind head as if you were going to do a situp or crunch. first just try to relax your back. You will be amazed at how much this hurts. your back will spasm and try to stay tense, just breath through it and let it relax. once you get to the point where you can let your back muscles relax (they won't want to becuase they think it will hurt) VERY GENTLY lift your head. use your hands to do this keep all the muscles in your back and neck relaxed. just lift your head so your chin moves a little towards your chest. this will stretch all the muscles down the centre of your back and shoulders. release your head GENTLY back to the ground and try to let your back relax again. repeat each morning.

another thing to do is when you wake up, before you get out of bed, lay on your back with both legs out straight. lift one knee up towards your chest and hug it with both arms. hold for a little and then do the other leg. If you do this every morning you will be much less likely to hurt yourself getting out of bed.

it's not that crazy to hurt yourself getting out of bed. if you have been in the same position for several hours your muscles have gotten very used to that position and a change can be a major jolt.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: denny on February 07, 2012, 10:47:57 AM
Go see a doctor!  Geez...asking for medical advice from a beer forum?
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: euge on February 07, 2012, 11:23:50 AM
Go see a doctor!  Geez...asking for medical advice from a beer forum?

They will prescribe muscle relaxers which go extremely well with beer. ;D By all means go and see a Physician.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: tom on February 07, 2012, 11:26:57 AM
One study showed that MDs, DCs and a pamphlet on back care were all equally effective.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: phillamb168 on February 07, 2012, 11:39:05 AM
Have you tried changing the mash temp?

---

What does it feel like? A few years ago I suddenly developed a pinched nerve in my lower back, just by walking up two stairs. That was about the most horrible piercing take-your-breath-away pain I've ever felt. See a doctor, for reals.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: jeffy on February 07, 2012, 11:43:54 AM
I hurt my lower back sorting 218 beers Friday afternoon just because I was stooping and sorting them all on the floor.  Stupid, I know, but it never affected me until I became as old as I am now.  Getting old sucks.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: denny on February 07, 2012, 11:57:26 AM
Getting old sucks.

STOP IT!  I hit 60 a week from today!   :o
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: tschmidlin on February 07, 2012, 11:59:48 AM
Getting old sucks.

STOP IT!  I hit 60 a week from today!   :o
Won't this be your 7th or 8th "60th" birthday? ;D
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: euge on February 07, 2012, 12:01:46 PM
Getting old sucks.

STOP IT!  I hit 60 a week from today!   :o
Won't this be your 7th or 8th "60th" birthday? ;D

Yeah...!? Denny? 8)
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: punatic on February 07, 2012, 12:11:18 PM
Getting old sucks.

It beats the snot out of the alternative!
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: tschmidlin on February 07, 2012, 12:11:58 PM
Getting old sucks.

It beats the snot out of the alternative!
Staying young?
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: weithman5 on February 07, 2012, 12:22:53 PM
One study showed that MDs, DCs and a pamphlet on back care were all equally effective.

i can't emphasize that pamphlet enough.  i see oodles of patients with hurt backs. most of them are no big deal as long as there is no nerve involvement (shooting pains, weakness, loss of control of bowel or bladder)  it does help to have a physician check this out to make sure (promoting my business a bit ;D)   most back injuries can be treated with mild exercises and prevented with exercises like yoga, pilates, swimming etc. 

but do not lay around.. inactivity is the enemy when it comes to your back.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: denny on February 07, 2012, 12:26:05 PM
Getting old sucks.

STOP IT!  I hit 60 a week from today!   :o
Won't this be your 7th or 8th "60th" birthday? ;D

Yeah...!? Denny? 8)

Hey, you guys, it's bad enough as it is!
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: weithman5 on February 07, 2012, 12:30:14 PM
according to your tag line denny, life is just beginning ::)
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: bluesman on February 07, 2012, 12:34:38 PM
Getting old sucks.

It beats the snot out of the alternative!
Staying young?

I think he meant being 6 feet under.  :-\
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: bluesman on February 07, 2012, 12:36:26 PM
Getting old sucks.

STOP IT!  I hit 60 a week from today!   :o
Won't this be your 7th or 8th "60th" birthday? ;D



Yeah...!? Denny? 8)

Hey, you guys, it's bad enough as it is!

Hey...Happy Early Bday Denny....not trying to rush it or anything but... ;D

What are you brewing for this fine occasion?
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: punatic on February 07, 2012, 12:41:07 PM
Getting old sucks.

It beats the snot out of the alternative!
Staying young?

Yeah, right.

Shh... don't tell anybody, but every day spent in Hawaii is not deducted from your total.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: bluesman on February 07, 2012, 12:45:04 PM
Getting old sucks.

It beats the snot out of the alternative!
Staying young?

Yeah, right.

Shh... don't tell anybody, but every day spent in Hawaii is not deducted from your total.

....you only wish  :)
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: denny on February 07, 2012, 01:19:01 PM
according to your tag line denny, life is just beginning ::)

I guess I'll find out...I hope so!
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: denny on February 07, 2012, 01:20:12 PM
Hey...Happy Early Bday Denny....not trying to rush it or anything but... ;D

What are you brewing for this fine occasion?

Haven't decided what to brew yet.  Guess I'd better decide and get some yeast going!
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: tschmidlin on February 07, 2012, 01:28:47 PM
Hey...Happy Early Bday Denny....not trying to rush it or anything but... ;D

What are you brewing for this fine occasion?

Haven't decided what to brew yet.  Guess I'd better decide and get some yeast going!
Rather than brew something that is 1.060, brew something 1.120, for the next 60 years :)
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: denny on February 07, 2012, 01:38:27 PM

Rather than brew something that is 1.060, brew something 1.120, for the next 60 years :)

60 more years?  I dunno if I can stand that!

Graham, be sure to let us know what happens with your back.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: bluesman on February 07, 2012, 01:45:13 PM
Hey...Happy Early Bday Denny....not trying to rush it or anything but... ;D

What are you brewing for this fine occasion?

Haven't decided what to brew yet.  Guess I'd better decide and get some yeast going!
Rather than brew something that is 1.060, brew something 1.120, for the next 60 years :)

Yea...maybe some Old Stoner.

gmac....I would let the doctor make the call on your situation.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: corkybstewart on February 07, 2012, 02:15:25 PM
I hurt my back about 10 years ago bending over to pick my socks up off the floor.  I went to a chiropractor and felt amazing after that first visit.  The next day I went again and was barely able to climb in my truck so I never went back.  Very light exercise and lots of treadmill time fixed me in about a week and the injury never came back
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: gmac on February 07, 2012, 02:24:35 PM
Go see a doctor!  Geez...asking for medical advice from a beer forum?

Hey, at least I put it in the Pub and not in All-Grain, even though I'm an all-grain brewer... ;)

First of all, I thought the AHA knew everything.  I was more intrigued in what people suggested simply because I'm skeptical of all of them. But, today it was bad enough that I went to a massage therapist on the advice of a friend and after she was done she suggested I see a chiropractor because it was beyond her ability to do much (I think she was a therapist, it said "Massage" in neon lights over her door.  Funny place for a doctor, out by the airport though...)  So anyway, I went to a chiropractor too and he cracked some stuff and pulled some stuff and now my wallet is appreciably lighter.  Luckily my work covers at least some of this stuff.  If this doesn't help after a few days then I'll go see my doctor but I hate seeing her for something like this (because the real reason for all this is because I need to lose 75 lbs).  Plus now that I'm over 40 I'm afraid of what other tests she may want to do.

They both suggested cold therapy with some ice for 20 mins at a time so I'm alternating between 20 mins outside and 20 ounces inside.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: morticaixavier on February 07, 2012, 02:36:45 PM
Go see a doctor!  Geez...asking for medical advice from a beer forum?

Hey, at least I put it in the Pub and not in All-Grain, even though I'm an all-grain brewer... ;)

First of all, I thought the AHA knew everything.  I was more intrigued in what people suggested simply because I'm skeptical of all of them. But, today it was bad enough that I went to a massage therapist on the advice of a friend and after she was done she suggested I see a chiropractor because it was beyond her ability to do much (I think she was a therapist, it said "Massage" in neon lights over her door.  Funny place for a doctor, out by the airport though...)  So anyway, I went to a chiropractor too and he cracked some stuff and pulled some stuff and now my wallet is appreciably lighter.  Luckily my work covers at least some of this stuff.  If this doesn't help after a few days then I'll go see my doctor but I hate seeing her for something like this (because the real reason for all this is because I need to lose 75 lbs).  Plus now that I'm over 40 I'm afraid of what other tests she may want to do.

They both suggested cold therapy with some ice for 20 mins at a time so I'm alternating between 20 mins outside and 20 ounces inside.

doesn't your governemnt cover all that stuff?
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: jeffy on February 07, 2012, 02:38:46 PM
Go see a doctor!  Geez...asking for medical advice from a beer forum?

Hey, at least I put it in the Pub and not in All-Grain, even though I'm an all-grain brewer... ;)

First of all, I thought the AHA knew everything.  I was more intrigued in what people suggested simply because I'm skeptical of all of them. But, today it was bad enough that I went to a massage therapist on the advice of a friend and after she was done she suggested I see a chiropractor because it was beyond her ability to do much (I think she was a therapist, it said "Massage" in neon lights over her door.  Funny place for a doctor, out by the airport though...)  So anyway, I went to a chiropractor too and he cracked some stuff and pulled some stuff and now my wallet is appreciably lighter.  Luckily my work covers at least some of this stuff.  If this doesn't help after a few days then I'll go see my doctor but I hate seeing her for something like this (because the real reason for all this is because I need to lose 75 lbs).  Plus now that I'm over 40 I'm afraid of what other tests she may want to do.

They both suggested cold therapy with some ice for 20 mins at a time so I'm alternating between 20 mins outside and 20 ounces inside.

doesn't your government cover all that stuff?

Yeah, that's what I thought, too.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: weithman5 on February 07, 2012, 02:39:01 PM
Go see a doctor!  Geez...asking for medical advice from a beer forum?

Hey, at least I put it in the Pub and not in All-Grain, even though I'm an all-grain brewer... ;)



so the solution is to grab some beer (what ever you can get across the border ;D) and come see me.   :o
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: richardt on February 07, 2012, 02:44:27 PM
IMO, most people who have problems with their "backs" also tend to have problems with their "fronts" (i.e., big flabby bellies).

Prevention is key:  Strengthen the core.  You don't need equipment or go to a gym to do this.

I learned this tidbit from a guy who has a degree in exercise physiology and has played pro baseball:  
DON'T do squats to strengthen the legs and hips--Your back and upper body is not designed for it.  
Instead, do one-legged squats with 1/2 the weight (place the other foot up on a chair or bench behind you).
The leg and hip muscles will get the same (or even better) workout.

For example, instead of squatting 300 pounds (and risking back injury), squat 150 pounds with one leg.  
If you can do that, then squat 155 pounds with one leg (instead of squatting 310 pounds, etc.)
Exercise smarter, not harder.  Save the back.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: gmac on February 07, 2012, 02:55:24 PM

doesn't your government cover all that stuff?

Yeah, that's what I thought, too.
[/quote]

Sigh...the many misunderstanding of the Canadian health care system.  Neither massage therapy nor chiropractic care are covered by our system, at least not in Ontario( nor is homeopathy, acupuncture, voodoo etc).  That's part of the reason for my skepticism.  Family doctor and hospital care etc are covered.  My employers insurance plan does cover some of this, not sure how much cause I've never looked into it before but most employer insurance plans have a yearly cap. 

IMO, most people who have problems with their "backs" also tend to have problems with their "fronts" (i.e., big flabby bellies).

To be honest, my middle's not that great either.  But, joking aside you're right.  Trouble is, it's not that easy to lose that big flabby belly.  Trust me, I've tried (and lost it and found it again).
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: corkybstewart on February 07, 2012, 03:29:42 PM
Go see a doctor!  Geez...asking for medical advice from a beer forum?



doesn't your governemnt cover all that stuff?
There's a lot of misinformation about what nationalized single payer health plans cover.  They  really are about like our decent private insurance plans over here with copays, deductibles and restrictions-at least it's that way in France.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: Kit B on February 07, 2012, 03:37:23 PM
I have a very good chiropractor that I go to, on rare occassions.
His instructions are to exercise my abs & back, regularly.
If I do this, I rarely run into problems.
BUT...There are those stupid times that I plant my foot wrong...get out of bed & twist at just the wrong time...lift, without thinking...exit a vehicle wrong...Just stupid stuff.
Those times, I attempt the stretching exercises & if the problem doesn't go away, I make an appointment.

HOWEVER...
I once went to a chiropractor that a good friend suggested.
The a55hole mis-diagnosed me with scholiosis & wanted to put me on 18 months of therapy.
I left his office & made an appointment at my current clinic.
Do not just trust the opinion of a single doctor (of any kind), when they tell you something crazy, like that.

Edit...
2 visits to my current chiropractor had me back in shape, after 10 days.

Sadly, the friend that suggested that other quack has made it a policy to go in for adjustments, every few weeks.
I often wonder whether it's only because of the quack's prescribed treatments.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: morticaixavier on February 07, 2012, 04:28:10 PM

doesn't your government cover all that stuff?

Yeah, that's what I thought, too.

Sigh...the many misunderstanding of the Canadian health care system.  Neither massage therapy nor chiropractic care are covered by our system, at least not in Ontario( nor is homeopathy, acupuncture, voodoo etc).  That's part of the reason for my skepticism.  Family doctor and hospital care etc are covered.  My employers insurance plan does cover some of this, not sure how much cause I've never looked into it before but most employer insurance plans have a yearly cap. 

IMO, most people who have problems with their "backs" also tend to have problems with their "fronts" (i.e., big flabby bellies).

To be honest, my middle's not that great either.  But, joking aside you're right.  Trouble is, it's not that easy to lose that big flabby belly.  Trust me, I've tried (and lost it and found it again).
[/quote]

Ahh yeah the chiro and message. too bad. seems like at least chiro should be covered. they are doctors after all.

on the finding the weight again;
if you lose wieght via diet you must forever and always stick to that diet. if you lose weight by excersize it's a little better but you still must maintain some level of activity to keep your metabolism up.

the best weightloss plan I ever found was eating about 7-10 times a day but only about 100-200 calories each time. this way I was able to live quite well on around 1500 calories a day and never felt hungry. drank alot of herbal tea back then. replacing the tea with beer does not help.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: maxieboy on February 07, 2012, 05:12:42 PM
IMO, most people who have problems with their "backs" also tend to have problems with their "fronts" (i.e., big flabby bellies).

Prevention is key:  Strengthen the core.

This.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: jeffy on February 07, 2012, 07:55:37 PM
IMO, most people who have problems with their "backs" also tend to have problems with their "fronts" (i.e., big flabby bellies).

Prevention is key:  Strengthen the core.

This.

I guess I'm not most people.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: hopfenundmalz on February 07, 2012, 08:49:49 PM
As a guy who has had some back issues over the years, my long term solution has been to have regular excercise to strenghten the core.  Been doing some Pilates since the start of the year, and that has helped a bunch.  All that and a memory foam matress. 

Short term solution is to see a Doctor.

Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: phillamb168 on February 08, 2012, 01:43:44 AM
Go see a doctor!  Geez...asking for medical advice from a beer forum?



doesn't your governemnt cover all that stuff?
There's a lot of misinformation about what nationalized single payer health plans cover.  They  really are about like our decent private insurance plans over here with copays, deductibles and restrictions-at least it's that way in France.

I'm on the super basic national system here, and it covers hospital stuff, and a doctor's visit once a year (more or less). I don't have what's called a 'mutuel' (additional coverage provided by an employer) so I'm paying out-of-pocket for pretty much everything including prescriptions. The huge, enormous difference between here and the US, though, is that a trip to the doctor's costs about 50 eur, and medications cost between 50 cents and 5 euro. Also doctors aren't allowed to 'recommend' name-brand stuff like they are in the US. No free ProvaxidinolAB(c)(R) pens to be found.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: denny on February 08, 2012, 09:24:13 AM
IMO, most people who have problems with their "backs" also tend to have problems with their "fronts" (i.e., big flabby bellies).

Prevention is key:  Strengthen the core.

This.

I guess I'm not most people.

I think that's obvious, Jeff!
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: weithman5 on February 08, 2012, 10:17:23 AM

. Also doctors aren't allowed to 'recommend' name-brand stuff like they are in the US. No free ProvaxidinolAB(c)(R) pens to be found.

hey, i like my pens ::)
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: jeffy on February 08, 2012, 11:38:03 AM
IMO, most people who have problems with their "backs" also tend to have problems with their "fronts" (i.e., big flabby bellies).

Prevention is key:  Strengthen the core.

This.

I guess I'm not most people.

I think that's obvious, Jeff!

Can you see me from there?
btw I'm right behind you with that big b-day in April.
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: denny on February 08, 2012, 01:05:35 PM

Can you see me from there?
btw I'm right behind you with that big b-day in April.

Congrats!  Let's get together for an old fart celebratory beer at NHC!
Title: Re: My Back's Killing me
Post by: kramerog on February 08, 2012, 08:34:17 PM
My back is killing me.  All I did was get out of bed the other day  Seriously.  That's it. 

Sounds like tight hamstrings.  Gotta stretch them.