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General Category => Ingredients => Topic started by: a10t2 on February 04, 2010, 03:32:54 AM

Title: Cardamom?
Post by: a10t2 on February 04, 2010, 03:32:54 AM
There's a Penzey's spice shop in town that I drive by all the time. I finally went in today because I wanted to try some chamomile in a wit. Turns out they don't carry it (and I really don't think I'll be shopping there again; the place has the floor space/product ratio of an Apple Store). The one nice thing was that they have sniffable jars of each of the spices, and I ended up getting some whole green cardamom.

Anyone know how much of this to use in a beer? My first instinct is to treat it like coriander (1/4 oz at flameout) but I was wondering if maybe that would be too much. Everything I can find about cooking with it says it's incredibly potent. So maybe I'll start with more like 3-5 grams. Which also brings up the question of what I'm going to do with 1.7 ounces of the stuff.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: tygo on February 04, 2010, 03:44:44 AM
I used cardamom in a cherry wit partial mash years ago.  I knew I had used it at one point and had to go find my old brewing notebook. 

I used 0.75 oz of the stuff in a five gallon batch.  I added that at 5 minutes before the end of the boil along with some black pepper.  My initial tasting notes after 2 weeks in the bottle said the spice was too strong but after four weeks was more in balance.  I think I probably used too much but I do remember enjoying this beer.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: brewmasternpb on February 04, 2010, 06:03:30 AM
I've used Cardamom for a few beers now.  It depends if you're crushing it up.  I crushed some, and added .5 oz to the boil for 10 minutes, it gets bitter quick.  Maybe .5 oz, crushed, added after the boil, or even in the secondary.  Enjoy!  Black Cardamom is interesting as well, gives it a more menthol flavor.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: Hokerer on February 04, 2010, 02:11:09 PM
Which also brings up the question of what I'm going to do with 1.7 ounces of the stuff.

Wasn't there an old Cheers episode where Cardamom was the secret ingredient for the winning best drink contest entry?

(IIRC, though, that was black cardamom)
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: redbeerman on February 04, 2010, 02:19:38 PM
You need to be very careful in beer.  This stuff gets pretty potent, pretty fast.  I would start with no more than 7g.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: akr71 on February 05, 2010, 03:31:18 PM
Which also brings up the question of what I'm going to do with 1.7 ounces of the stuff.

If you don't like it in your beer, it goes great in sauces (& BBQ sauce) and stews.  Not too much, though.  Also, its used alot in baking (in Scandinavia).
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: mikeypedersen on February 05, 2010, 03:35:19 PM
I'm using some green cardamom in a Chai Brown.  I'm making a tea with that and a lot of other spices that I will add to the beer when I keg it up!
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: wpshadowens on February 05, 2010, 05:56:20 PM
FWIW... My first attempt at a wit ended up down the drain because I mistakenly used cardamom instead of coriander.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: mikeypedersen on February 05, 2010, 06:10:07 PM
FWIW... My first attempt at a wit ended up down the drain because I mistakenly used cardamom instead of coriander.
Whoops!  Did you save/wash the yeast to brew with it again?
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: a10t2 on February 05, 2010, 06:16:35 PM
FWIW... My first attempt at a wit ended up down the drain because I mistakenly used cardamom instead of coriander.

Uh oh. How much did you use, Bill?
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: nicneufeld on February 08, 2010, 12:33:02 AM
Cardamom has always struck me as an immensely intense spice...I would try cooking with it a lot first, getting a feel for it via food, before formulating a beer recipe.

I picked up some black cardamom which I gather is dried over fires and does have a bit more metholly aroma.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: wpshadowens on February 09, 2010, 05:33:06 PM
I used 0.5 oz of Cardamom. My recipe called for 0.5 oz of Coriander at 15 mins. I think it would have been a good beer if not for the Cardamom but it really wasn't drinkable with it. I even tried to let it age for a while but that didn't help. I finally gave up on it because I needed the bottles.

Mikey, I didn't save the yeast and have not tried to brew that recipe (or style) again. It's really not one of my favorite styles and was brewing it for my wife. I have been thinking about giving it another crack though but I would have to modify the recipe as I've since moved on to all-grain.

Bill
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: a10t2 on February 13, 2010, 05:43:16 AM
Thanks to everyone for the feedback. I'll be brewing this in the next week or two and will probably use 5 g to start, and add more in the fermenter if needed.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: skyler on March 21, 2010, 01:40:15 AM
I tried an aggressive amount of cardamom in a wit I brewed today - .33 oz at 5 min - definitely too much, at least from a pre-fermentation taste. Assuming it doesn't dissipate, I doubt I would use more than .1 oz again in the future, and I love cardamom.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: intrinsic on March 27, 2010, 02:21:47 AM
I used 1/2 teaspoon of the seeds (before crushing) in a Saison one time and I thought it was overpowering but ymmv.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: narvin on March 28, 2010, 12:24:01 AM
This can be an overpowering spice.  I'd stick to no more than a few whole pods crushed per 5 gal.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: skyler on April 08, 2010, 06:08:42 PM
Surprisingly, my over-cardamom wit tastes pretty good. I would still use less than I did, but I think as many as 10 pods or so for a 5 gal batch is fine if you're a big cardamom fan.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: a10t2 on April 26, 2010, 05:42:36 AM
I ended up using 5 g of green cardamom. Cracked the pods open and dumped them and the seeds in at flameout, and left them in for the whirlpool/chill, 40 minutes total. The overall result is subtle but really nice. When I went to taste the hydrometer sample today, I actually forgot I had spiced this batch and was trying to figure out what was slightly "off". So I think in the future I might go with as much as 10 g for a more pronounced flavor.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: Jeff Renner on August 31, 2010, 10:12:35 PM
Picking up on an old thread, I've used 5 grams of cardamom in 7.5 gallons of my Ginger Wit, which as been brewed by brewers around the world with good results.  The recipe (from 1995) is at http://www.brewery.org/cm3/recs/09_85.html.

The recipe also uses fresh ginger, coriander and grains of paradise.  Pretty tasty, refreshing summer beer.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: majorvices on August 31, 2010, 10:17:38 PM
Wow. Here I thought  was the first one to come up with a Ginger wit idea. Jeff beat me to it by several years. Oh well, at least the recipe is not the same.
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: astrivian on September 01, 2010, 03:20:19 AM
Off topic, but a10t2's sig should be a shirt. :)
Title: Re: Cardamom?
Post by: hopaddicted on September 07, 2010, 03:08:12 PM
If you still want to try chamomile in your next wit or another beer, try your local health food store. I put some in my wit and it added a nice character I thought, seemed to fade or at least was overpowered by the other spices with time, but early on it was nice.