Homebrewers Association | AHA Forum
General Category => Yeast and Fermentation => Topic started by: ynotbrusum on December 16, 2012, 12:57:33 PM
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So it's my first (intentional) sour and I was just wondering, as I am at a little over a month in the primary on WLP630 - should I rack to secondary? Or just let it go the full time on the lees before racking to keg? I was planning on 6-8 months for this beer. Since it is so low in gravity, I didn't want to assume that it was to be treated like the bigger Belgians.
:-[
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this wont necessarily answer your question, just passing along my berliner experiences. i did a berliner last year and pitched lacto wlp677 first, then wlp611 four days later, the lacto fermented most of the sugars before i pitched the ale yeast. transferred to a sanke keg for secondary conditioning/souring in the closet for one month. bottled 5 gallons, kegged 5 gallons. it was a good clean, clear beer but never got as sour as i like. i have since done two batches of a sour mash berliner that have been great and are ready in two or three weeks. one got a 34 score last year, nothing to brag about but within normal limits.
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Yeah, I listened to that talk from NHC about going with the Lactobacillus for 5 days and then adding the yeast, but my LHBS talked me into the Berliner Weisse WLP proprietary blend (since it was getting a little long in the tooth, he gave me all 3 of his vials for the price of one - so I pitched em all!)
Just wondering about the racking off the yeast part...
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no matter what i'm sure it will be a fine beer. it just depends on what you want. for me i had no real bar to judge by. the only berliner i had at the time i brewed my first was from my local brewery. i think i've only had 3 berliners other than my own. i've yet to have one from berlin or even outside austin. its a great summer beer, sometimes i mix it with cherry juice.
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Can you check the pH? A Berliner Weisse should be between 3.0 to 3.2 pH.
For future reference, I like to do a "sour mash"/lactobacillus starter at 100-120F, then add the sour mash/lacto starter to the wort and repeat a sour mash at 100-120F. After reaching the desired acidity, chill and add a German ale yeast.
How does it taste?
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I haven't tasted it yet, but ican pull a sample and test the pH and the taste. I thought I would adjust at the end using lactic acid on this batch. So you do two sequential lactobacillus starters and then mash at the 100-120f for how long before you then add yeast? Also, no boil, I assume?
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I do a "sour mash + lactobacillus starter". I mash the grains, no-boil, and let cool to 100-120F. Then add the starter and some more crushed grains and keep at 100-120F until sour enough. Then cool to room temperature and add German ale yeast.
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6-8 months for a berliner is insane. It might work, but it is a waste of time. You should be drinking this within a month.
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Unfortunately, if you pitch the ale yeast with the lacto it can take that long.
Now, most recommend pitching the lacto/sourmash first, then once you reach your desired acidity (~ 3 days) pitch the ale yeast.
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Unfortunately, if you pitch the ale yeast with the lacto it can take that long.
Exactly, so don't do it!
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So how quickly are you able to drink the BW doing it with the sour mash/lacto process first?
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So how quickly are you able to drink the BW doing it with the sour mash/lacto process first?
As fast as you can ferment and bottle condition. A quick boil after the sour mash will kill the lacto and stabilize the acidity. Ferment with an ale yeast and bottle - you could be drinking it 2-3 weeks after brewing. You also don't have to worry about lacto contaminating other equipment or bottles getting too acidic.
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6-8 months for a berliner is insane. It might work, but it is a waste of time. You should be drinking this within a month.
I did a 15 gal no boil batch and drank the first 5 gal within a month or so and it was OK. The other 5 gal I left plain and bottled something like 8-9 months later, and the other one I aged on raspberries and bottled after almost a year. Both of those are WAY more interesting than the young version.
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I did a 15 gal no boil batch and drank the first 5 gal within a month or so and it was OK. The other 5 gal I left plain and bottled something like 8-9 months later, and the other one I aged on raspberries and bottled after almost a year. Both of those are WAY more interesting than the young version.
This was not sour mashed I'd guess?
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...6-8 months for a berliner is insane. It might work, but it is a waste of time. You should be drinking this within a month...
(http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/duty_calls.png)
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...6-8 months for a berliner is insane. It might work, but it is a waste of time. You should be drinking this within a month...
(http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/duty_calls.png)
Hehe. Yeah, I know :)
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I did a 15 gal no boil batch and drank the first 5 gal within a month or so and it was OK. The other 5 gal I left plain and bottled something like 8-9 months later, and the other one I aged on raspberries and bottled after almost a year. Both of those are WAY more interesting than the young version.
This was not sour mashed I'd guess?
Mashed, ran off, cooled, pitched.