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General Category => Yeast and Fermentation => Topic started by: quattlebaum on May 22, 2013, 02:10:49 AM

Title: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: quattlebaum on May 22, 2013, 02:10:49 AM
So i am affiliated with a local brew pub and occasionally get some yeast (1056) on the 5 to 6 generation when they getting ready to pitch to the next brew. So questions are. How much to pitch? I have been pitching around 100ml or so. It goes berserk! Also, how long do ya think it will last if kept at 35 degrees or so without having to do a starter. The head brewer says if kept cold you can just pitch slurry without a starter for up to a month. Any suggestions?
Title: Re: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: gmac on May 22, 2013, 02:18:05 AM
Mr malty or yeastcalc and I'm sure a month will work if its pure. Maybe a quick starter to just get it refreshed.
Title: Re: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 22, 2013, 03:07:06 AM
I agree with your head brewer.
Older yeast you have more slury you need to pitch.
Regular pitching rate would apply (1 liter of slury for 1 BBL of lager, 0.5 liter of slury for 1 BBL of ale).
We could also talk about yeast density but let's keep is simple.
Title: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: majorvices on May 22, 2013, 08:00:39 AM
You are probably fine up to a month but the sooner you use it the better. I'd use MrMalty.com yeast calculator and put the yeast harvest date in there and go from there. You are better off slightly overpitching than underpitching, but try not to massively overpitch. You shouldn't need a starter if you use the yeast within a month, but again,the sooner you use it the better!
Title: Re: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: davidgzach on May 22, 2013, 12:06:24 PM
I go by Sean's 25% viability loss per month for slurry and it works well for me.  Mr. Malty seems a little drastic.  But a month is a good barometer for making a starter IMO.

Dave
Title: Re: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: skyler on May 22, 2013, 06:15:02 PM
I use 001 from a brewery all the time. It is usually very foamy, so after 2 days in the fridge the full jar appears half full or so. I generally use a pint of foamy slurry or a half pint of settled slurry per 5.5 gal batch under 1.065 and a little more for over 1.065. A friend always thinks we are overpitching, but my results are good.

I try to use it within 2 weeks, but haven't really had a problem with it ever (never used older than 6 weeks without just making a starter).
Title: Re: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: a10t2 on May 22, 2013, 07:35:02 PM
A friend always thinks we are overpitching, but my results are good.

I would say you're *massively* over-pitching, but Chico is so neutral you can get away with it. I would say that amount of packed slurry is somewhere in the range of 600-900 billion cells.
Title: Re: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: skyler on May 24, 2013, 07:33:32 PM
I regularly overpitch with slurry because I am concerned that there is break matter and hops in the slurry and that I have fewer cells than it appears. This is especially true with this brewery's yeast, which seemingly always comes from their IPA. But it is also true pretty often with my own beers. My wort chilling method tends to send a lot of trub to the fermenter and I NEVER wash yeast.
Title: Re: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: ccfoo242 on May 29, 2013, 03:09:46 AM
I vaguely recall from a podcast that had some of the White Labs people on it, they said that overpitching isn't a big deal as long as you don't harvest the yeast afterward. I don't recall the reason, I think it had to do with the amount of dead yeast that were starved from not enough resources.
Title: Re: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 30, 2013, 01:23:42 PM
I vaguely recall from a podcast that had some of the White Labs people on it, they said that overpitching isn't a big deal as long as you don't harvest the yeast afterward. I don't recall the reason, I think it had to do with the amount of dead yeast that were starved from not enough resources.
I do not thing that this is correct.
Title: Re: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: ccfoo242 on June 06, 2013, 12:06:50 AM
I vaguely recall from a podcast that had some of the White Labs people on it, they said that overpitching isn't a big deal as long as you don't harvest the yeast afterward. I don't recall the reason, I think it had to do with the amount of dead yeast that were starved from not enough resources.
I do not thing that this is correct.

OK, I found where I heard that. Wrong about the reason, but right about it being ok as long as you don't harvest it.

If you go to the 2012 BJCP seminars (http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/pages/lets-brew/homebrewing-seminars/2012) and listen to Neva Parker's talk about "Fermentation Mythbusters", skip to about 28:20 in and she mentions why you shouldn't use too much yeast. Not because they are dead or starved for resources, something about yeast growth and new yeast generation for subsequent generations. So, as long as it's the last time you use the yeast you can over pitch, but don't harvest that yeast when done.
Title: Re: Re pitching chico/1056 from local brewery
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on June 07, 2013, 09:50:56 PM
I vaguely recall from a podcast that had some of the White Labs people on it, they said that overpitching isn't a big deal as long as you don't harvest the yeast afterward. I don't recall the reason, I think it had to do with the amount of dead yeast that were starved from not enough resources.
I do not thing that this is correct.

OK, I found where I heard that. Wrong about the reason, but right about it being ok as long as you don't harvest it.

If you go to the 2012 BJCP seminars (http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/pages/lets-brew/homebrewing-seminars/2012) and listen to Neva Parker's talk about "Fermentation Mythbusters", skip to about 28:20 in and she mentions why you shouldn't use too much yeast. Not because they are dead or starved for resources, something about yeast growth and new yeast generation for subsequent generations. So, as long as it's the last time you use the yeast you can over pitch, but don't harvest that yeast when done.

I would agree that when you overpich you have less growth and older cell population offer FG is reached. If you grossly overpich you might not have growth at all.