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General Category => Going Pro => Topic started by: Thirsty_Monk on May 27, 2013, 10:09:04 PM

Title: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 27, 2013, 10:09:04 PM
Here it is:
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/282277_602229943122821_1334440778_n.jpg)

Now the cans:
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/968861_604900962855719_90513226_n.jpg)
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: a10t2 on May 27, 2013, 10:38:46 PM
Nice can design. Is that a Wild Goose system? What do you think of it?
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 27, 2013, 11:06:45 PM
Yes it is Wild goose system.
I did not use it yet.

We are still debating what kind of filler I got.
It was supposed to be the same as on semi-automated line but I got something different.
I think it will fill the cans but can not be used when I upgrade to semi-automated line.

I will report later.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: tschmidlin on May 28, 2013, 05:07:18 AM
That's a nice looking canner, can't wait to see it when you're running it! :)
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: kylekohlmorgen on May 28, 2013, 12:28:55 PM
Yeah, would love to see a video of it in action!

I've seen it before, but I love your branding. Definitely something I'd blindly pick up off the shelf.
Title: Can filler and seamer
Post by: majorvices on May 28, 2013, 06:12:59 PM
Nice! Like the can design, too. Nice work!
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 29, 2013, 01:30:59 AM
Yeah, would love to see a video of it in action!
Here is video. This is not mine line but you get the idea. I do not have lid dropper.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aT95-N-Phhc

http://www.wildgoosecanning.com/main/mc-50/
They said that
Quote
Dual fillers with a single seamer are the same hardware components and core software that drive the WGC-100 and the WGC-250.
My biggest problem is with filler.
It was supposed to be the same as on MC-100 but this thing is stationary.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 29, 2013, 01:38:21 AM
Nice! Like the can design, too. Nice work!
Thank you.
It was interesting process.
You can have up to 6 colors but unlike regular printing print press can not mix these colors for additional shading.

Also colors on color pallet do not look the same as printed on silver background.
We had a multiple rounds of color samples.

It will be couple of weeks before we have cans, lids (they call them ends) ring binders...
I am exited and scared at the same time.
Not sure what new package will bring for us and hoping for the best.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: anthony on May 29, 2013, 03:34:15 AM
Sort of off topic, but do you sell pre-filled growlers? Is that why you submitted COLAs for them?
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: kylekohlmorgen on May 29, 2013, 11:56:46 AM
Can I ask the approximate cost difference between the MC-50 and the MC-100 (with conveyor/lid dropper/seamer)?

Is that against forum rules?
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 29, 2013, 01:23:37 PM
Sort of off topic, but do you sell pre-filled growlers? Is that why you submitted COLAs for them?
Yes we use growler as a bottle and filled them in the brewery. We do not fill growlers on demand. We are distributing them (growlers) in the liquor/grocery stores. We take deposit on growler. When they come back we wash/sanitize them and fill them again. People can also swap the growlers in the tap room. One disadvantage to do it this way is that growler in the tap room is the same (almost) price as in the retail. Well you would not have to do it this way but we do.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 29, 2013, 01:28:40 PM
Can I ask the approximate cost difference between the MC-50 and the MC-100 (with conveyor/lid dropper/seamer)?

Is that against forum rules?
Price of MC-50 is about one new minivan. Price of MC-100 is twice as much. Do not forget suppy (cans, lids, plates making, binders and trays) that is about another minivan.

But similar would go for bottling line. Moheen filler is about tvo minivans then you need labeled and supply.
Anyway you look into it it cost arm and leg.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: euge on May 29, 2013, 01:28:48 PM
Man that can design looks awfully similar to Magic Hat. :o Just sayin be keerful. ;)
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 29, 2013, 01:30:55 PM
Man that can design looks awfully similar to Magic Hat. :o Just sayin be keerful. ;)
Yes that fat bold monk is similar to that.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Pinski on May 29, 2013, 02:27:33 PM
Can I ask the approximate cost difference between the MC-50 and the MC-100 (with conveyor/lid dropper/seamer)?

Is that against forum rules?
Price of MC-50 is about one new minivan. Price of MC-100 is twice as much. Do not forget suppy (cans, lids, plates making, binders and trays) that is about another minivan.

But similar would go for bottling line. Moheen filler is about tvo minivans then you need labeled and supply.
Anyway you look into it it cost arm and leg.

There should be a forum rule against expressing cost in terms  of minivans.

Congrats on the cool tool and nice work on the can design Thirsty!
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: gmac on May 29, 2013, 02:33:34 PM
Sort of off topic, but do you sell pre-filled growlers? Is that why you submitted COLAs for them?
Yes we use growler as a bottle and filled them in the brewery. We do not fill growlers on demand. We are distributing them (growlers) in the liquor/grocery stores. We take deposit on growler. When they come back we wash/sanitize them and fill them again. People can also swap the growlers in the tap room. One disadvantage to do it this way is that growler in the tap room is the same (almost) price as in the retail. Well you would not have to do it this way but we do.

Can I mail you back my growlers and you mail them back full :) ?  Not sure when I'll be in Eau Claire again now.  I'm sure the cans will expand your business greatly.  Good luck.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: klickitat jim on May 29, 2013, 02:33:56 PM
A craft minivan like the Mystery Machine? Or just some run of the mill minivan
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Pinski on May 29, 2013, 02:44:57 PM
A craft minivan like the Mystery Machine? Or just some run of the mill minivan

Dude, the Mystery Machine was NOT a minivan.   ;D

OK, maybe it was a MiniWinni.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: HoosierBrew on May 29, 2013, 02:51:35 PM
 ;D.  Good stuff.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: gsandel on May 29, 2013, 03:34:39 PM
Quote
There should be a forum rule against expressing cost in terms  of minivans.
;D

I quite agree...perhaps our equivelant monitary system should be in something valuable (unlike Mini vans) like "1/2bbl stainless conicals"...
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: euge on May 29, 2013, 03:49:46 PM
I think it would be logical to price them in terms of kegs. Perhaps something like "it cost me [the equivalent of] 400 kegs..."
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: edvinjonsson on May 29, 2013, 04:22:08 PM
Can I ask the approximate cost difference between the MC-50 and the MC-100 (with conveyor/lid dropper/seamer)?

Is that against forum rules?
Price of MC-50 is about one new minivan. Price of MC-100 is twice as much. Do not forget suppy (cans, lids, plates making, binders and trays) that is about another minivan.

But similar would go for bottling line. Moheen filler is about tvo minivans then you need labeled and supply.
Anyway you look into it it cost arm and leg.

You also have to get a buttload of cans don't you? Who do you get them from?

Awesome cans btw!
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: bluesman on May 29, 2013, 04:37:15 PM
Movin' on up Leos!  Very nice can design. :)

So...How many mini-vans away from being able to buy your beer in Delaware? ;)

Congrats!
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 29, 2013, 07:34:43 PM
Movin' on up Leos!  Very nice can design. :)

So...How many mini-vans away from being able to buy your beer in Delaware? ;)

Congrats!
Ron,
You have to take a road trip to get my beer. I am not planning on shipping out of state. I think I can do quite well within the state. New Glarus is the example.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 29, 2013, 07:37:35 PM
Can I ask the approximate cost difference between the MC-50 and the MC-100 (with conveyor/lid dropper/seamer)?

Is that against forum rules?
Price of MC-50 is about one new minivan. Price of MC-100 is twice as much. Do not forget suppy (cans, lids, plates making, binders and trays) that is about another minivan.

But similar would go for bottling line. Moheen filler is about tvo minivans then you need labeled and supply.
Anyway you look into it it cost arm and leg.

You also have to get a buttload of cans don't you? Who do you get them from?

Awesome cans btw!

My minimum is 8 pallets on cans and one pallet on lids. Lids will kill you thou.

In bottle market you also have minimums on six packs and mother cartons, labels and everybody wants to sell you truckload of bottles.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: edvinjonsson on May 29, 2013, 08:47:00 PM

You also have to get a buttload of cans don't you? Who do you get them from?

Awesome cans btw!

My minimum is 8 pallets on cans and one pallet on lids. Lids will kill you thou.

In bottle market you also have minimums on six packs and mother cartons, labels and everybody wants to sell you truckload of bottles.

8 Pallets is not that bad for printed cans, I thought you had to get a truckload. Does wild goose supply the cans too ?
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 29, 2013, 09:11:21 PM
No you buy them direct from supplier.
I think you can even buy Balls cans if you wanted to.
I used Crowns.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: klickitat jim on May 29, 2013, 09:21:34 PM
Out of pure curiosity, is there a manual canner for sub-nano brewer? Or a better question would be, how many cases of bottles (production level) until switching to cans makes sense?
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: a10t2 on May 29, 2013, 11:37:24 PM
Out of pure curiosity, is there a manual canner for sub-nano brewer?

There's no such thing as a truly "manual" canner. The seaming is a fairly complicated operation and there's really no way around that. I guess that at really tiny volumes you could fill the cans using a simple siphon setup and then seam them, but most people seem to end up with Ball's Cask's two-head filler. Until Wild Goose came on the market, anyway. I guess we'll see what happens now.

Or a better question would be, how many cases of bottles (production level) until switching to cans makes sense?

Economically, a semi-automated canning setup is actually less expensive than bottling, in both capital and per-unit costs. The two Ball Cask units, gently used, sell for about half a minivan 500 millivans.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: gmac on May 30, 2013, 12:56:00 AM
Out of pure curiosity, is there a manual canner for sub-nano brewer?

There's no such thing as a truly "manual" canner. The seaming is a fairly complicated operation and there's really no way around that. I guess that at really tiny volumes you could fill the cans using a simple siphon setup and then seam them, but most people seem to end up with Ball's two-head filler. Until Wild Goose came on the market, anyway. I guess we'll see what happens now.

Or a better question would be, how many cases of bottles (production level) until switching to cans makes sense?

Economically, a semi-automated canning setup is actually less expensive than bottling, in both capital and per-unit costs. The two Ball units, gently used, sell for about half a minivan.

I had another thread going on a manual canner that I have a line on.  Still wish I could make it work but really, as Sean already told me, the seamer is the key and my guy won't sell me just the seamer.  The used system is 3 times the cube root of 1/2 of 1/3 of a mini-van squared / 2 minivans (-456*the average annual rain fall in cubic centiliters).  Of course, these are Canadian mini-vans so you'd have to factor in the exchange rate (1 minivan = 2 1984 Ford F-150)
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: edvinjonsson on May 30, 2013, 01:47:17 AM
but most people seem to end up with Ball's two-head filler.

Don't you mean Cask?

Economically, a semi-automated canning setup is actually less expensive than bottling, in both capital and per-unit costs. The two Ball units, gently used, sell for about half a minivan.

The only issue with canning is the amount of cans you have to buy.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: a10t2 on May 30, 2013, 02:15:58 AM
Don't you mean Cask?

Yes! Thanks.

The only issue with canning is the amount of cans you have to buy.

Only if you want them printed. You can get blank cans in basically any quantity, just like bottles.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: klickitat jim on May 30, 2013, 02:16:17 AM
Curiosity solved. Thanks!
Found another reason to stay the course of cornys and occasionally a few bottles
Title: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Pawtucket Patriot on May 30, 2013, 01:19:55 PM
Very cool, Leos! Did WGE do the on-site setup/training?
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: Thirsty_Monk on May 30, 2013, 01:25:33 PM
Very cool, Leos! Did WGE do the on-site setup/training?
Not yet. I still do not have cans in the house.
Title: Re: Can filler and seamer
Post by: bluesman on May 30, 2013, 04:39:40 PM
Movin' on up Leos!  Very nice can design. :)

So...How many mini-vans away from being able to buy your beer in Delaware? ;)

Congrats!
Ron,
You have to take a road trip to get my beer. I am not planning on shipping out of state. I think I can do quite well within the state. New Glarus is the example.

The next time I travel your way, I will definitely stop in for a tour, and some of your great beer. :)