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General Category => General Homebrew Discussion => Topic started by: cornershot on July 10, 2013, 11:48:28 AM

Title: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: cornershot on July 10, 2013, 11:48:28 AM
What does India have to do with it? With all the creativity in the craft beer world, you'd think we could name it something that makes sense.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: In The Sand on July 10, 2013, 12:19:43 PM
http://beer.about.com/od/ale/p/IPAProfile.htm
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: beersk on July 10, 2013, 01:06:29 PM
Hear that. It doesn't have anything to do with India anymore. It's kind of like Kentucky Fried Chicken is just KFC now. Doesn't really have to do with Kentucky anymore. Silly analogy, I know, but whatevs. I actually like calling them APA's, since many American Pale Ales I've had are pretty much IPA's...might as well call them APA's instead of IPA's, since the style they evolved to today was pretty much created in America. Did that make sense? I don't know, does in my head, but reading it is kind of weird.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: majorvices on July 10, 2013, 01:17:57 PM
Reading Mitch Steele's book and understanding just how much hops the original IPA had in it (6 lbs of hops per bbl, not including dry hops) and seeing how high the original gravity was (often times 1.070+) I realized how much more like our version of IPA is compared to what IPA in England has become. Sure, there are vast differences. Ours use pure cultures, are not aged for months or years, etc. But I think our IPA name is probably more accurate than what you would find in England.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: beersk on July 10, 2013, 01:25:31 PM
I guess I was wrong. I read that book, but don't think that IPA's back then were anything like they are today, especially those typically brewed in the US.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: brewmichigan on July 10, 2013, 01:44:06 PM
Yeah, they hopped the hell out of those beers but I sure the flavor profile differed from our Simcoe and Amarillo laden DIPAs we have now. They also didn't have and enjoy by date on the cask.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: majorvices on July 10, 2013, 02:14:44 PM
I guess I was wrong. I read that book, but don't think that IPA's back then were anything like they are today, especially those typically brewed in the US.

Just meant the hopping rates, OG and paleness of the beer and lack of crystal malts and malt flavors would be mroe similar. Obviously few beers back in the 1800s taste anything like we have today, a few sours possibly excluded.

Edit: Maybe you should reread my post where I said there are "vast differences". But the beers were decidedly hop forward where English IPAs are more malt forward.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: tomsawyer on July 10, 2013, 02:23:35 PM
You could consider the American version an imperial APA or IAPA instead of AIPA.  Merging the APA and AIPA categories would really make for a wide OG range, but I suppose the IBU/GU would be in the same ballpark.  The lower ABV APAs would suffer in comps since big seems to dominate.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: weithman5 on July 10, 2013, 03:57:54 PM
similarly i have problem with the concept of dark india "pale" ale 8)
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: Jimmy K on July 10, 2013, 04:06:43 PM
Hear that. It doesn't have anything to do with India anymore. It's kind of like Kentucky Fried Chicken is just KFC now. Doesn't really have to do with Kentucky anymore.
KFC changed their name back to Kentucky Fried Chicken a few years ago. Apparently the real rub was that Kentucky tried to trademark the name Kentucky.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: bluesman on July 10, 2013, 04:35:32 PM
I believe it's most commonly referred to as  "IPA" and not "American IPA". When I visit a taproom or beer bar, I most commonly hear someone say, "What brand of IPA do you have on tap?". Names of products have this tenacious capacity to stick over time. Some more so than others, but this one certainly "stuck".
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: cornershot on July 10, 2013, 04:51:04 PM
I believe that the American IPA style would have evolved to what it is today even if English IPA never existed. Arguably every possible harmonious combination of hops, malt, water and yeast has been designated a style so it's easy to imagine a strong, pale, hop-forward beer coming about in America without the existence of another vaguely similar foreign version. So then what would we have called it? Double APA? Big APA? Extreme APA?  AIPA was never brewed just for export to India and IMO it needs a different name to reflect the uniquely American product that it is. (Steps off soap box)
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: majorvices on July 10, 2013, 06:01:56 PM
Guess I'm just not going to get wound up about it. ;) regardless of how strongly we feel it is a 'Merican originality it is an evolution of a style and IPA is the correct moniker IMO. To argue that it would have come to style regardless of the english version is beyond the point. My understanding is the first incarnation of American IPA were heavily influenced (and outright meant to copy) the "original" Ballantine IPA and that style was based on generations of other IPAs that had their origin in the first IPAs shipped from England.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: beersk on July 10, 2013, 06:04:06 PM
similarly i have problem with the concept of dark india "pale" ale 8)
I knew someone would say it! That's not what this is about, dude!

Either way, it's silly to get super technical about a name. The name tells you what to expect, no need to get your panties in a twist arguing the semantics. IPA or APA, you know that it's a hoppy beer. If you like hoppy beer, then choose that. Who cares what it's called? You like it right? Then shutch ya face and drink it!

Same with music genres. Metal for instance...I don't know if there's any other style, save for maybe electronic music, that has so many different genres. I think there might be 50 different genres of black metal alone...it's dumb. "Oh but this isn't like that other black metal, this is symphonic!" oooooooo! It's annoying. But that's how you know what it is. Black IPA, so what if it's not "pale"? Many IPA's and pale ales aren't very "pale" anyway. So shut up about it. You know exactly what to expect if you ordered a black IPA. Even if it is called Cross Dressing Amateur, I'll still drink it and enjoy the hell out of it because I love that style of beer - dark hoppy beer.
Same for IPA or American IPA or whatever. Let's not talk about where it came from and what it was originally, but where it's going. Can't change the past.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: dmtaylor on July 10, 2013, 06:22:10 PM
The USA is a melting pot of cultures, so we would often rather steal ideas from other places and bastardize it to make it our own rather than come up with something truly American from scratch.  We have our American "pilsners" that are nothing like Bohemian pilsners except that they are light in color.  Then we take India Pale Ale, which once upon a time was one of the most bitter beer styles known, and take it to the Nth level of bitterness but still continue to call it IPA, when it doesn't resemble the original at all.  Then we go even further and invent something stupid like Black IPA, which is neither from India nor Pale.  We should call that one something else... like, say, American stout?!?  American stout has been around for probably 30 years but it didn't get popular until we threw it into the IPA category, because Americans sure love their IPAs.  But stout... nah... stout's got too much flavor.  No, we'd rather add black food coloring to a regular IPA so it doesn't taste acrid.  Black food coloring!?  It's all such a joke.  It might not be so popular if we called it what it really is: American Very Hoppy Ale with Black Food Coloring.  Now that's a great style descriptor.  A little too honest.  No... we'd rather call it Black India Pale Ale.  Simultaneously oxymoronic, and moronic.

We Americans are just plain goofy.  At least we know what flavors we like if we can't be creative enough to come up with names for things.  Hops hops and more hops.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: cornershot on July 10, 2013, 07:35:05 PM
Dave and Beersk, that was beautiful! Thanks, fellas! Needed a good laugh!
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: reverseapachemaster on July 10, 2013, 08:03:13 PM
Big Ass American Pale Ale. BAAPA.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: a10t2 on July 10, 2013, 08:07:21 PM
http://beer.about.com/od/ale/p/IPAProfile.htm

Whoa... Ron Pattinson is stroking out right about now.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: blatz on July 10, 2013, 08:34:15 PM
The USA is a melting pot of cultures, so we would often rather steal ideas from other places and bastardize it to make it our own rather than come up with something truly American from scratch. 

umm...the Germans actually did it too.  Sedlmayr essentially stole the pilsner 'idea' from Plzen and then just called it German Pilsner.

IIRC, wasn't marzen also bastardized vienna lager?

English IPAs aren't being made to export to India anymore either, so why stop with American IPA? English Strong Pale Ale.

Who cares what its called??  If the beer is good, I say drinketheth. 

Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: majorvices on July 10, 2013, 08:43:12 PM
http://beer.about.com/od/ale/p/IPAProfile.htm

Whoa... Ron Pattinson is stroking out right about now.

Welcome back, cowboy!
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: majorvices on July 10, 2013, 08:44:37 PM


Who cares what its called??  If the beer is good, I say drinketheth.

+ 1. Not even going to try to change the name now. Called it Imperial Pale ale if it makes you feel any better.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: hopfenundmalz on July 10, 2013, 08:49:34 PM
http://beer.about.com/od/ale/p/IPAProfile.htm

Whoa... Ron Pattinson is stroking out right about now.
Along with Martyn Cornell.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: cornershot on July 10, 2013, 08:58:02 PM
http://beer.about.com/od/ale/p/IPAProfile.htm

Personally, I don't want any "wang" in my beer!
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: HoosierBrew on July 10, 2013, 11:00:05 PM
The USA is a melting pot of cultures, so we would often rather steal ideas from other places and bastardize it to make it our own rather than come up with something truly American from scratch. 

umm...the Germans actually did it too.  Sedlmayr essentially stole the pilsner 'idea' from Plzen and then just called it German Pilsner.

IIRC, wasn't marzen also bastardized vienna lager?

English IPAs aren't being made to export to India anymore either, so why stop with American IPA? English Strong Pale Ale.

Who cares what its called??  If the beer is good, I say drinketheth. 


+1   
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: Mark G on July 11, 2013, 02:31:04 AM
Damn... I thought this thread was going to be about pairing steak with beer. Oh well.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: klickitat jim on July 11, 2013, 02:44:36 AM
From now on, American IPA shall be called... Tim. Or the beer formerly known as AIPA.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: In The Sand on July 11, 2013, 02:53:01 AM
From now on, American IPA shall be called... Tim. Or the beer formerly known as AIPA.

 ROFLMAO
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: reverseapachemaster on July 11, 2013, 03:13:58 AM
The USA is a melting pot of cultures, so we would often rather steal ideas from other places and bastardize it to make it our own rather than come up with something truly American from scratch. 

umm...the Germans actually did it too.  Sedlmayr essentially stole the pilsner 'idea' from Plzen and then just called it German Pilsner.

IIRC, wasn't marzen also bastardized vienna lager?

English IPAs aren't being made to export to India anymore either, so why stop with American IPA? English Strong Pale Ale.

Who cares what its called??  If the beer is good, I say drinketheth.

Same with grodzinski/gratzer. The Germans liked to take places over and rename everything with some German version of the name. Of course, the Romans did that to Greece hundreds of years before, too.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: malzig on July 11, 2013, 10:18:40 AM
Reading Mitch Steele's book and understanding just how much hops the original IPA had in it (6 lbs of hops per bbl, not including dry hops) and seeing how high the original gravity was (often times 1.070+) I realized how much more like our version of IPA is compared to what IPA in England has become. Sure, there are vast differences. Ours use pure cultures, are not aged for months or years, etc. But I think our IPA name is probably more accurate than what you would find in England.
I've had some of the historic recreations (http://www.oldbeers.com/) that Ron Pattinson has worked on with Pretty Things and beers were shockingly similar to the beers we think we have created.  In the 19th century, Brits were making pale colored, all base malt, hugely hopped beers with American hops.  Everything old is new again.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: beersk on July 11, 2013, 02:31:52 PM
I still like APA as a new name for IPA, I don't know that it's too late to change it, but I don't care enough to lobby the idea. But, that's the beauty of it, we can call it what we want. Open up your own brewery and brew an IPA and call it APA.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: Vin S on July 11, 2013, 02:51:32 PM
I will love it and drink it and call it George.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: weithman5 on July 11, 2013, 03:15:04 PM
think i am going to work on an big american dopplebock or BAD.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: majorvices on July 11, 2013, 06:10:44 PM
I still like APA as a new name for IPA, I don't know that it's too late to change it, but I don't care enough to lobby the idea. But, that's the beauty of it, we can call it what we want. Open up your own brewery and brew an IPA and call it APA.

If I order an APA at a brewpub it better not be an IPA. And vise versa.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: a10t2 on July 11, 2013, 06:23:58 PM
If I order an APA at a brewpub it better not be an IPA. And vise versa.

+1. Fight to change the convention if you don't agree with it, but don't take it out on your customers. Finding a beer is confusing enough nowadays.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: HoosierBrew on July 11, 2013, 06:24:50 PM
I still like APA as a new name for IPA, I don't know that it's too late to change it, but I don't care enough to lobby the idea. But, that's the beauty of it, we can call it what we want. Open up your own brewery and brew an IPA and call it APA.

If I order an APA at a brewpub it better not be an IPA. And vise versa.
+1.   IPA has always been the hoppiest beer in the beer world.  This is the American equivalent of such.  Works for me.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: weithman5 on July 11, 2013, 07:02:54 PM
If I order an APA at a brewpub it better not be an IPA. And vise versa.

+1. Fight to change the convention if you don't agree with it, but don't take it out on your customers. Finding a beer is confusing enough nowadays.

for that matter, at least half the time i can't tell when i order a beer what the hell it is supposed to be, if it is not something i am already familiar with. and names are not all that helpful. waiting to order a "moose crap, double chocolate coffee rye bladder filler with turpentine"
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: beersk on July 11, 2013, 07:15:06 PM
If I order an APA at a brewpub it better not be an IPA. And vise versa.

+1. Fight to change the convention if you don't agree with it, but don't take it out on your customers. Finding a beer is confusing enough nowadays.

for that matter, at least half the time i can't tell when i order a beer what the hell it is supposed to be, if it is not something i am already familiar with. and names are not all that helpful. waiting to order a "moose crap, double chocolate coffee rye bladder filler with turpentine"
Yeah, really. Thems boys bein' too strict, settin' too many rules.

Dale's Pale Ale is 6.5% abv and hoppy as hell...ain't no IPA in that name. Call it what you want. Many "APAs" I've had are pretty much hopped to IPA levels. Besides, there's some overlap between pale ale and IPA in the BJCP categories, so I don't see what the big deal is.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: hopfenundmalz on July 11, 2013, 07:56:39 PM
Zombie Dutst is another IPA masquerading as an APA. Then there are ones like All Day IPA.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: cornershot on July 11, 2013, 08:01:42 PM
I love All Day IPA!
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: beersk on July 11, 2013, 08:27:06 PM
Zombie Dutst is another IPA masquerading as an APA. Then there are ones like All Day IPA.
See this is what I'm talking about. All Day IPA is a pale ale strength beer hopped up like an IPA. I don't get all the fuss about making sure you call a beer this or that. APA or IPA, they're pretty darned close in a lot of ways and certainly there's a lot of overlap.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: weithman5 on July 11, 2013, 08:42:26 PM
for that matter look at the ibu recommended for a strong scottish ale.  17-35. one of the commercial examples is dirty bastard (which i love by the way), however its published ibu is 50 over 50% more than the max.  so overlap is overlap and as long as i have an idea of what i am getting into.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: dmtaylor on July 11, 2013, 09:03:22 PM
APA and American "IPA" have evolved in the past 6-7 years to become one and the same.  Or perhaps we should just assign shilling ratings to them to designate the low gravity ones from the high gravity, ala Scottish ales.  Or how about X, XX, XXX, XXXX.  Heck, we've already invented the Double IPA / Imperial IPA.  Why not just rename them all to APA X, XX, XXX, XXXX.  Hey, okay, I think I've got it!!  Just call it an APA w/ X IBUs.  In other words, just name the beer with the number of IBUs it's got.  Me: "You've got to try this 60 IBU APA."  Another guy: "Don't be such a wuss.  My 5000 IBU APA blows yours out of the sky!"

Don't we already do this anyway?  Except we call it IPA instead of APA.

Or I guess we could just go the route of MTV, where the M officially doesn't stand for anything anymore.  Kind of like Ulysses S Grant.  What's the S stand for?  Exactly.  IPA?  Yeah, that's just the name of the style.  It doesn't stand for anything, other than really hoppy ale.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: weithman5 on July 11, 2013, 09:07:50 PM

Or I guess we could just go the route of MTV, where the M officially doesn't stand for anything anymore.  Kind of like Ulysses S Grant.  What's the S stand for?  Exactly.  IPA?  Yeah, that's just the name of the style.  It doesn't stand for anything, other than really hoppy ale.

Simpson.  the story i am familiar with is the dudes at West point assumed he had a middle name customary to the time as his mother's maiden name which was simpson. so they put an s down.  didn't actually have the middle name though. IIRC
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: majorvices on July 11, 2013, 11:01:21 PM
Perfect example, and one of the reasons I'm not a big fan of Dale's. Too malt forward. Too big. Not a Pale Ale. If I want to drink a pale ale I expect it to be sessionable. And All Day IPA is really a Pale Ale . I can drink one of those beers and I'm ready to move onto something else. Too thin for an IPA. Not sessionable to me. Not balanced.

By the sheer fact that I may be driving if I order a Pale Ale I expect it to be in the 5-6% range. Not 6-8%.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: majorvices on July 11, 2013, 11:07:43 PM
APA and American "IPA" have evolved in the past 6-7 years to become one and the same. 

Not in my world, buster! ;)
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: erockrph on July 11, 2013, 11:08:41 PM
If I'm not judging for or brewing for a competition, then just give me a ballpark idea of what to expect so I can pick a beer to drink. I expect that at any particular brewery the DIPA is hoppier than their IPA, which is hoppier than their APA, which is hoppier than their blonde. That's enough for me, but extra details like IBUs, ABV, hops, grain bill, etc are appreciated. No need to be a nomenclature nazi, as long as your name gives me a reasonable expectation of what the beer is going to be.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: majorvices on July 11, 2013, 11:13:57 PM
If I'm not judging for or brewing for a competition, then just give me a ballpark idea of what to expect so I can pick a beer to drink. I expect that at any particular brewery the DIPA is hoppier than their IPA, which is hoppier than their APA, which is hoppier than their blonde. That's enough for me, but extra details like IBUs, ABV, hops, grain bill, etc are appreciated. No need to be a nomenclature nazi, as long as your name gives me a reasonable expectation of what the beer is going to be.

Exactly! I just need to know what I'm drinking. If you call it an APA, I should't need to know the ABV. Same with IPA or IIPA. I'll know what I'm getting into. Call it a Pale Ale and it's 7% ABV and I'm floating down in the canoe and I drink 4 I may not be able to drive when I get to the truck!

Or if I'm sitting in a pub with my wife and she says, "What should I get" and I pick out the Pale Ale and it's really a 7% 80 IBU IPA then she's stuck with something I didn't intend her to have.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: HoosierBrew on July 11, 2013, 11:39:35 PM
If I'm not judging for or brewing for a competition, then just give me a ballpark idea of what to expect so I can pick a beer to drink. I expect that at any particular brewery the DIPA is hoppier than their IPA, which is hoppier than their APA, which is hoppier than their blonde. That's enough for me, but extra details like IBUs, ABV, hops, grain bill, etc are appreciated. No need to be a nomenclature nazi, as long as your name gives me a reasonable expectation of what the beer is going to be.

Exactly! I just need to know what I'm drinking. If you call it an APA, I should't need to know the ABV. Same with IPA or IIPA. I'll know what I'm getting into. Call it a Pale Ale and it's 7% ABV and I'm floating down in the canoe and I drink 4 I may not be able to drive when I get to the truck!

Or if I'm sitting in a pub with my wife and she says, "What should I get" and I pick out the Pale Ale and it's really a 7% 80 IBU IPA then she's stuck with something I didn't intend her to have.
+1.  The nomenclature gives an expectation of being in the ballpark.  I too appreciate the OG and IBUs postings though - it gives a little clearer picture of what you're actually getting. I think the absolute worst thing for the craft beer industry right now though is to take a bunch of excited beer novices who are trying to learn what to buy and go confusing them further by changing terms in midstream. I know there's some overlap in pale ale and IPA styles, but people should be able to expect a definite difference when they pay $$. 
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: malzig on July 11, 2013, 11:45:19 PM
Black IPA, so what if it's not "pale"? Many IPA's and pale ales aren't very "pale" anyway.
Or we could call it by the name the Brits used for it more than 100 years ago, KK Ale, instead of making believe we invented something that no one has ever thought of before, so we get to name it.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: deepsouth on July 12, 2013, 12:36:11 AM
interesting thread.  i've enjoyed reading it so far. 

regarding the subject at hand, i'm with erockrph up there.

Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: cornershot on July 12, 2013, 01:55:43 AM
Ok so from now on IPA ( pronounced: eye-pee-ay) is now a WORD used to describe a particular style of beer. It is not an acronym for ANYTHING! Unless it's brewed in England.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: hopfenundmalz on July 12, 2013, 02:12:16 AM
Ok so from now on IPA ( pronounced: eye-pee-ay) is now a WORD used to describe a particular style of beer. It is not an acronym for ANYTHING! Unless it's brewed in England.
I can assume you never had Greene King IPA. 3.6% ABV, 32-ish IBU, little hop flavor or aroma on cask.

What would you say if you ordered an IPA and got an ordinary bitter?
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: cornershot on July 12, 2013, 02:45:59 AM
If the 32 ibu came from all late hops plus dry hops and had a big IPAish hop profile with enough malt to back it up but half the alcohol, I'd say gimme 3 more! Love me some session beer! Love IPA for the hops. Alcohol content doesn't matter much. If I could have a 3.5% IPA that tastes like a 7% IPA I'd rather drink twice as many 3.5% beers.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: hopfenundmalz on July 12, 2013, 02:53:38 AM
If the 32 ibu came from all late hops plus dry hops and had a big IPAish hop profile with enough malt to back it up but half the alcohol, I'd say gimme 3 more! Love me some session beer! Love IPA for the hops. Alcohol content doesn't matter much. If I could have a 3.5% IPA that tastes like a 7% IPA I'd rather drink twice as many 3.5% beers.
it was an ordinary bitter to me, and the IBU were not from late hops, did not have a dry hop character. It was disappointing. Fuller's Bengl lancer at 5.3% bottled was much more of a British IPA to my thinking.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: majorvices on July 12, 2013, 03:51:54 AM
I give in. No reason to call it IPA when it must be something else. Stipulations: I don't want us to call it a "gold fish" any longer. They are obviously ORANGE! fish. They are not gold, nor or they made of gold! And don't get me started on those goshdern CRACKERS! THOSE ARE NOT GOLDFISH NEITHER! They should be called CRACKERLOOKIN' FISH! Who the F#ck do I call to change this!!!
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: tonyp on July 12, 2013, 07:50:54 AM
The name "IPA" is too well engrained in popular culture now. What we need to do is change what the "I" means. Maybe Imperial Pale Ale would work and everyone can still say "Can I have an IPA?"

With this naming scheme Double IPA would still work, but IIPA would obviously be redundant not that its that popular to begin with, i doubt anyone would miss it.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: malzig on July 12, 2013, 10:46:46 AM
Ok so from now on IPA ( pronounced: eye-pee-ay) is now a WORD used to describe a particular style of beer. It is not an acronym for ANYTHING! Unless it's brewed in England.
What do you have against India?
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: cornershot on July 12, 2013, 11:40:36 AM
Ok so from now on IPA ( pronounced: eye-pee-ay) is now a WORD used to describe a particular style of beer. It is not an acronym for ANYTHING! Unless it's brewed in England.
What do you have against India?

Absolutely nothing.


What does India have to do with it? With all the creativity in the craft beer world, you'd think we could name it something that makes sense.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: AmandaK on July 12, 2013, 12:06:34 PM
I give in. No reason to call it IPA when it must be something else. Stipulations: I don't want us to call it a "gold fish" any longer. They are obviously ORANGE! fish. They are not gold, nor or they made of gold! And don't get me started on those goshdern CRACKERS! THOSE ARE NOT GOLDFISH NEITHER! They should be called CRACKERLOOKIN' FISH! Who the F#ck do I call to change this!!!

HA. CRACKERLOOKIN' FISH!!!
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: thebigbaker on July 12, 2013, 12:55:42 PM
I give in. No reason to call it IPA when it must be something else. Stipulations: I don't want us to call it a "gold fish" any longer. They are obviously ORANGE! fish. They are not gold, nor or they made of gold! And don't get me started on those goshdern CRACKERS! THOSE ARE NOT GOLDFISH NEITHER! They should be called CRACKERLOOKIN' FISH! Who the F#ck do I call to change this!!!

That's funny!  Similar to why do we call it a Parkway when we drive on them and a Driveway when we park on them.  Why call them Apartments when they are all stuck together. 

Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: bboy9000 on July 12, 2013, 01:22:16 PM
I give in. No reason to call it IPA when it must be something else. Stipulations: I don't want us to call it a "gold fish" any longer. They are obviously ORANGE! fish. They are not gold, nor or they made of gold! And don't get me started on those goshdern CRACKERS! THOSE ARE NOT GOLDFISH NEITHER! They should be called CRACKERLOOKIN' FISH! Who the F#ck do I call to change this!!!

ROTFLMAO!
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: redbeerman on July 12, 2013, 02:32:42 PM
I give in. No reason to call it IPA when it must be something else. Stipulations: I don't want us to call it a "gold fish" any longer. They are obviously ORANGE! fish. They are not gold, nor or they made of gold! And don't get me started on those goshdern CRACKERS! THOSE ARE NOT GOLDFISH NEITHER! They should be called CRACKERLOOKIN' FISH! Who the F#ck do I call to change this!!!

HA. CRACKERLOOKIN' FISH!!!

I'm thinking Orange Fishlookin' cracker!
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: weithman5 on July 12, 2013, 03:01:38 PM
crumbly orange carp
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: tomsawyer on July 12, 2013, 04:07:01 PM
IPA = India Pitch-black Ale.

Oh and in looking at the original title, I am reminded that AIPA goes well with a juicy steak or medium-rare burger.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: cornershot on July 12, 2013, 04:27:46 PM
IPA = India Pitch-black Ale.

Oh and in looking at the original title, I am reminded that AIPA goes well with a juicy steak or medium-rare burger.

I prefer a porter with my steak. I think IPA is better suited to post-steak for the digestive-enhancing qualities found in a more bitter beer.
I like my steak bloody but ground beef should always be served well done in the name of food safety.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: weithman5 on July 12, 2013, 04:40:36 PM
IPA = India Pitch-black Ale.

Oh and in looking at the original title, I am reminded that AIPA goes well with a juicy steak or medium-rare burger.

I prefer a porter with my steak. I think IPA is better suited to post-steak for the digestive-enhancing qualities found in a more bitter beer.
I like my steak bloody but ground beef should always be served well done in the name of food safety.
knock the horns off, wipe its ass and put it on the plate
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: joe_feist on July 12, 2013, 04:45:03 PM
5 pages of absolutely wonderful entertainment. Really, lmao one line after another.

Oh yeah, guess I should have opinion. Put me in the "get me in ball park" if I'm out on the town relaxing. I'd be stricter if I was judging or helping a fellow brewer tackle a problem.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: bluesman on July 12, 2013, 04:46:41 PM
I have no beef with IPA, except when it's sweet. IPA's that finish on the sweet side are tough to drink.

Anyone remember this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ug75diEyiA0
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: HoosierBrew on July 12, 2013, 04:51:51 PM
I have no beef with IPA, except when it's sweet. IPA's that finish on the sweet side are tough to drink.

Anyone remember this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ug75diEyiA0
+1.  Agree totally.  A little dryness works better with hops IMO and is more thirst quenching. I'm in the minority who don't like IIPAs like Hopslam - great hoppiness, followed by syrup. Not for me.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: beersk on July 12, 2013, 05:08:21 PM
OP: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVCtkzIXYzQ
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: fmader on July 12, 2013, 05:10:50 PM
OP: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVCtkzIXYzQ

Lol nice... The Dude abides
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: tomsawyer on July 12, 2013, 05:20:24 PM
IPA = India Pitch-black Ale.

Oh and in looking at the original title, I am reminded that AIPA goes well with a juicy steak or medium-rare burger.

I prefer a porter with my steak. I think IPA is better suited to post-steak for the digestive-enhancing qualities found in a more bitter beer.
I like my steak bloody but ground beef should always be served well done in the name of food safety.
Porter and a porterhouse, I can live with that.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: beersk on July 12, 2013, 05:22:54 PM
OP: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVCtkzIXYzQ

Lol nice... The Dude abides
That movie is so damn funny...

I like some stream water with my freshly killed prey. Bloody rare, please.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: HoosierBrew on July 12, 2013, 05:31:21 PM
OP: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVCtkzIXYzQ

Lol nice... The Dude abides
That movie is so damn funny...

I like some stream water with my freshly killed prey. Bloody rare, please.
Love that movie!  I like how his rug "ties the whole room together"........
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: fmader on July 12, 2013, 05:38:37 PM
OP: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVCtkzIXYzQ

Lol nice... The Dude abides
That movie is so damn funny...

I like some stream water with my freshly killed prey. Bloody rare, please.
Love that movie!  I like how his rug "ties the whole room together"........
That it did, Dude
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: deepsouth on July 12, 2013, 06:47:31 PM
i usually grind my own beef, or buy large cuts and have a butcher grind them.  i do this so i don't have to eat my burgers cooked to death.  for tacos, i go well done, but for burgers, it's hard to beat one mid-rare. 



IPA = India Pitch-black Ale.

Oh and in looking at the original title, I am reminded that AIPA goes well with a juicy steak or medium-rare burger.


I like my steak bloody but ground beef should always be served well done in the name of food safety.
[/quote
IPA = India Pitch-black Ale.

Oh and in looking at the original title, I am reminded that AIPA goes well with a juicy steak or medium-rare burger.

I prefer a porter with my steak. I think IPA is better suited to post-steak for the digestive-enhancing qualities found in a more bitter beer.
I like my steak bloody but ground beef should always be served well done in the name of food safety.

Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: deepsouth on July 12, 2013, 06:51:22 PM
IPA = India Pitch-black Ale.

Oh and in looking at the original title, I am reminded that AIPA goes well with a juicy steak or medium-rare burger.

I prefer a porter with my steak. I think IPA is better suited to post-steak for the digestive-enhancing qualities found in a more bitter beer.
I like my steak bloody but ground beef should always be served well done in the name of food safety.
knock the horns off, wipe its ass and put it on the plate

this.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: larsonkd on July 12, 2013, 09:32:53 PM
I feel that the stronger versions of American "IPA" are more accurately described as Imperial Pale Ales.  Pale in color with a malty backbone, but very hop forward, and a strong alcohol presence.  I think we will soon be branching out with our use of IPA or Pale Ale, such as Citrus Pale Ale, Summer Pale Ale, Winter Pale Ale, etc.  I already found Elysian Brewery experimenting with citrus flavors in a Pale Ale (Elysian Superfuzz Blood Orange), which was pretty tasty for the summer.

Personally, I brew a lot of American IPA's using American hops; again very hop forward beers with strong hop presence in the flavor an aroma, but I also experiment with old time British (Burton Upon-Trent) styles, where I try to use European and British hops to recreate the what the original IPA's may have been like...always incorporating some light oak to give it a more genuine taste.

As mentioned before in other posts...read Mitch Steele's book "IPA: Brewing Techniques, Recipes and the Evolution of India Pale Ale" and use the recipes within to get a better understanding of the differences between the IPA styles and ingredients used.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: bboy9000 on July 12, 2013, 10:14:50 PM
I feel that the stronger versions of American "IPA" are more accurately described as Imperial Pale Ales.


Wouldn't those be Double IPA's?
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: HoosierBrew on July 12, 2013, 10:29:49 PM
I feel that the stronger versions of American "IPA" are more accurately described as Imperial Pale Ales.


Wouldn't those be Double IPA's?
+1.  Very hop forward and stronger in abv sounds kinda like IIPA to me. :)
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: larsonkd on July 13, 2013, 01:13:17 PM
From what I read, they are one in the same...although the Imperial Pale Ale would be more of a nod to English Brewing, as the Imperial term originated in the English brewing of Russian Imperial Stouts for the Russian Imperial Courts in the late 1700's.

Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: dmtaylor on July 14, 2013, 02:27:54 PM
The name "IPA" is too well engrained in popular culture now. What we need to do is change what the "I" means. Maybe Imperial Pale Ale would work and everyone can still say "Can I have an IPA?"

With this naming scheme Double IPA would still work, but IIPA would obviously be redundant not that its that popular to begin with, i doubt anyone would miss it.

Now these are great ideas that I could live with and more easily find inner peace.   8)
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: tonyp on July 14, 2013, 08:46:51 PM
From what I read, they are one in the same...although the Imperial Pale Ale would be more of a nod to English Brewing, as the Imperial term originated in the English brewing of Russian Imperial Stouts for the Russian Imperial Courts in the late 1700's.

Imperial also means majestic, magnificent, imperious or domineering which would be a much more apropos name since modern American IPAs have little in common with English or Russian empires.

I think the name Imperial Pale Ale could catch on :)
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: majorvices on July 14, 2013, 09:23:20 PM
Brain fart a couple years ago, I typed "Imperial Pale Ale" instead of "India Pale Ale" on my keg ring and didn't even notice it until a few days ago.
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: udubdawg on July 14, 2013, 10:31:06 PM
I like some stream water with my freshly killed prey. Bloody rare, please.

this thread has a lot, but needs more stream water with bloody freshly-killed prey IMO.
 
http://explore.org/#!/live-cams/player/brown-bear-salmon-cam-brooks-falls

Brooks Falls brown bears, fishing for sockeye, live.

makes me hungry for salmon (with IPA)
Title: Re: Got beef with "American IPA"
Post by: fmader on July 14, 2013, 10:55:02 PM
I like some stream water with my freshly killed prey. Bloody rare, please.

this thread has a lot, but needs more stream water with bloody freshly-killed prey IMO.
 
http://explore.org/#!/live-cams/player/brown-bear-salmon-cam-brooks-falls

Brooks Falls brown bears, fishing for sockeye, live.

makes me hungry for salmon (with IPA)

I've learned three things after watching this for 5 minutes...
1. These bears suck at fishing
2. These fish suck at swimming
3. I'm hungry for salmon with a Double American India Imperial Pale Ale