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General Category => Extract/Partial Mash Brewing => Topic started by: flbrewer on February 14, 2014, 01:41:09 AM

Title: She's Alive!
Post by: flbrewer on February 14, 2014, 01:41:09 AM
After just shy of 2 weeks in the bottle, my latest extract is done (Surly Furious clone kit)...and I can't believe how clear it is! It tastes really good, although I expected more of a head on the pour. It is really non-existant when I pour slowly. If I pour harder, I get a small head but loads of yeast. Thoughts?
Secondly, with a gentle pour, I see no bubbles rising...is this common? The carbonation sounded good when I opened the bottle.
Finally, will a longer bottling increase the carbonation or head at this point?

http://imgur.com/1E84yPS
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: klickitat jim on February 14, 2014, 01:52:08 AM
Looks pretty. How does carbonation taste and feel?

I usually give my bottle conditioned beers a month at room temp before opening.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: flbrewer on February 14, 2014, 01:53:37 AM
Looks pretty. How does carbonation taste and feel?

I usually give my bottle conditioned beers a month at room temp before opening.
It tastes a bit flat now that you mention it! What's room temp for you? Lately (even in N. Florida) it's been around 62-65 degrees.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: Stevie on February 14, 2014, 01:53:59 AM
+1 to what Jim said. Give it a bit more time. Could also be a case of uneven priming.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: flbrewer on February 14, 2014, 01:56:10 AM
+1 to what Jim said. Give it a bit more time. Could also be a case of uneven priming.
Yes, good point. When I added the sugar/water mixture to the beer in the bottling bucket, I didn't mix too vigorously. I simply swirled the bucket gently. I imagine that liquid quickly dropped to the bottom and those first few bottles will be carbed higher.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: Jimmy K on February 14, 2014, 02:17:33 AM
Gentle swirling should be fine. More time should help though. Warm it if you can. I think a lot of commercial breweries bottle condition over 75F.

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Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: morticaixavier on February 14, 2014, 04:07:33 AM
is there a sweetness remaining? that's a good sign that it's not done conditioning yet.

Other than that, it's okay to pour slowly but right down the center of the glass. looks nice though.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: klickitat jim on February 14, 2014, 04:22:12 AM
Be a little more patient. I consider just shy of a month to be pushing it. Just shy of two weeks at low 60s, probably not done yet. When it IS done, its going to be real pretty.
Title: She's Alive!
Post by: flbrewer on February 14, 2014, 11:22:17 AM
Will a lower conditioning temp(62-65) cause the beer to not condition fully or merely take longer? If it's a problem I am at a loss on how to warm them up. If it's ok then I can wait.


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Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: mainebrewer on February 14, 2014, 11:56:21 AM
Bottle conditioning at 62-65 degrees will take a lot longer than doing it at 70-75 degrees.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: Jeff M on February 14, 2014, 12:30:55 PM
I read a thread once that suggested 80F~ to bottle condition.  My beer take over 2 weeks to condition in the 63~ range, give it some time!
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: HoosierBrew on February 14, 2014, 12:50:09 PM
I read a thread once that suggested 80F~ to bottle condition.  My beer take over 2 weeks to condition in the 63~ range, give it some time!

+1.  I've read that some Belgian breweries condition that warm before cellaring.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: weithman5 on February 14, 2014, 02:03:01 PM
i usually go a month, i usually bottle one in a plastic used pepsi bottle.  this way i can feel the firmness of the bottle and i can easily see the yeast formation.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: Vin S on February 14, 2014, 03:11:49 PM
If you space on top of your fridge. Place a case up there.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: morticaixavier on February 14, 2014, 03:39:20 PM
I read a thread once that suggested 80F~ to bottle condition.  My beer take over 2 weeks to condition in the 63~ range, give it some time!

+1.  I've read that some Belgian breweries condition that warm before cellaring.

Pretty sure I've read that Sierra Nevada conditions that warm. It's not really going to hurt the beer once it's in the bottle and conditioning. you wouldn't want to store it long term at that temp but a couple weeks is no problem.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: duboman on February 14, 2014, 05:52:24 PM
Just needs more time....

When I bottle they'll sit at 70-75 for at least 10-14 days, a few days in the fridge and they're good to go, lower temps mean slower process to carbonate.

Also note that higher gravity beers may take longer due to the higher alcohol content. I've had some 8-10% beers take over a month
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: rabeb25 on February 14, 2014, 10:02:16 PM
Maybe I am overly sensitive to it but I can certainly taste the difference between bottle carbing and force carbonation, and strongly prefer force carbonation as I feel its "cleaner".

I have always looked at it like this(so correct me if I am wrong). If you ferment warm you get esters, and bottle carbing is another fermentation. So why would you ferment a beer (bottle carb) above normal fermentation temps and under pressure, is that not just asking for esters?
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: morticaixavier on February 14, 2014, 10:40:57 PM
Maybe I am overly sensitive to it but I can certainly taste the difference between bottle carbing and force carbonation, and strongly prefer force carbonation as I feel its "cleaner".

I have always looked at it like this(so correct me if I am wrong). If you ferment warm you get esters, and bottle carbing is another fermentation. So why would you ferment a beer (bottle carb) above normal fermentation temps and under pressure, is that not just asking for esters?

when you allow a yeast growth phase warm you get esters. there is little to no growth phase in bottle conditioning thus little or no esters. Can you taste the bottle conditioning in a Sierra Nevada beer?

now, on a homebrew level we tend to leave a LOT more yeast in the bottle when bottle conditioning than SN does and that could well make a difference.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: klickitat jim on February 15, 2014, 09:13:21 AM
Funny but I've always (all of my life) preferred kegged beer. That's just CO2, no extra yeast. But, I like what Palmer says. CO2 is CO2, bottle conditioned isn't better its just different.

Maybe some people like the difference
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: majorvices on February 15, 2014, 09:45:15 PM
Keep in mind that warm fermentation temp will create fusels, which are literally oils, that can kill head retention. If you fermentation temp got much higher than 79 degrees this could be your head retention problem.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: flbrewer on February 15, 2014, 11:07:45 PM
Keep in mind that warm fermentation temp will create fusels, which are literally oils, that can kill head retention. If you fermentation temp got much higher than 79 degrees this could be your head retention problem.
Good point, but this batch was very consistent in temps. Getting lucky in Florida over the past few months.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: majorvices on February 15, 2014, 11:12:19 PM
FYI typed that on my phone. Meant to say 70. That's temp of fermentation. If your room is at, say, 64 your ambient is "OK". Just remember to add 6-8 degrees to your ambient for the temp of fermentation - which generates its own heat. If you keep your house much warmer than 64 it's a bit too warm for most ale yeasts.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: flbrewer on February 15, 2014, 11:17:04 PM
FYI typed that on my phone. Meant to say 70. That's temp of fermentation. If your room is at, say, 64 your ambient is "OK". Just remember to add 6-8 degrees to your ambient for the temp of fermentation - which generates its own heat. If you keep your house much warmer than 64 it's a bit too warm for most ale yeasts.
6-8 degrees? Wow, wasn't aware it was that much higher. I currently use a water bath which keeps it pretty tight. I'll check the surrounding water and use a UV gun to check the glass. Counting down the days until I get a wine cooler.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: duboman on February 16, 2014, 12:55:23 AM

FYI typed that on my phone. Meant to say 70. That's temp of fermentation. If your room is at, say, 64 your ambient is "OK". Just remember to add 6-8 degrees to your ambient for the temp of fermentation - which generates its own heat. If you keep your house much warmer than 64 it's a bit too warm for most ale yeasts.
6-8 degrees? Wow, wasn't aware it was that much higher. I currently use a water bath which keeps it pretty tight. I'll check the surrounding water and use a UV gun to check the glass. Counting down the days until I get a wine cooler.
if you are using a water bath and swapping ice bottles to maintain temps, you should be okay and the ambient isn't such an issue, that's what I used to do prior to ferm chamber and found it did a really nice job maintaining a consistent temp.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: HoosierBrew on February 16, 2014, 01:00:18 AM

FYI typed that on my phone. Meant to say 70. That's temp of fermentation. If your room is at, say, 64 your ambient is "OK". Just remember to add 6-8 degrees to your ambient for the temp of fermentation - which generates its own heat. If you keep your house much warmer than 64 it's a bit too warm for most ale yeasts.
6-8 degrees? Wow, wasn't aware it was that much higher. I currently use a water bath which keeps it pretty tight. I'll check the surrounding water and use a UV gun to check the glass. Counting down the days until I get a wine cooler.
if you are using a water bath and swapping ice bottles to maintain temps, you should be okay and the ambient isn't such an issue, that's what I used to do prior to ferm chamber and found it did a really nice job maintaining a consistent temp.

Same here. I did it for years before I got my first used fridge and temp control. Worked pretty well. Just gotta remember/budget time for exchanging frozen bottles. That's where I got the idea to use frozen bottles to help the IC chill my wort down to pitching temps too. Still do it.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: reverseapachemaster on February 16, 2014, 03:41:49 PM
So why would you ferment a beer (bottle carb) above normal fermentation temps and under pressure, is that not just asking for esters?

Fermenting under pressure reduces ester production.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: euge on February 16, 2014, 04:21:57 PM
I'd be surprised to see much of a temp difference from ambient with that small of a fermentation and volume. ???

If the glass isn't squeaky clean or you use a rinse aid in the dishwasher that can lessen head retention dramatically.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: majorvices on February 16, 2014, 10:37:31 PM
I guess I didn't realize it wasn't a 5+ gallon ferment. But your still going to pick up some appreciable exothermic activity. Best to know EXACTLY what your temps are. Does OP know that? If he doesn't then don't rule it out! Stick on Fermometer is a good start.
Title: Re: She's Alive!
Post by: flbrewer on February 16, 2014, 11:17:06 PM

I guess I didn't realize it wasn't a 5+ gallon ferment. But your still going to pick up some appreciable exothermic activity. Best to know EXACTLY what your temps are. Does OP know that? If he doesn't then don't rule it out! Stick on Fermometer is a good start.
Yes, I know what temp it was at. Or I believe to be within a degree or two.


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