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General Category => All Grain Brewing => Topic started by: tonyccopeland on November 01, 2014, 08:46:30 PM

Title: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: tonyccopeland on November 01, 2014, 08:46:30 PM
I brewed the following recipe this summer and ended up with a pale ale with an incredibly smooth finish.  It seemed to be just what I wanted after about 6 weeks in the keg.   I would like to try to get this finish in a few of my other recipes, but I don't have a lot of brew time for experimentation (brew once a month and have four kids with plenty of activities) and was wondering if any had recommendations/ideas/input on what might have contributed to this finish?  or could this be multiple things in combination?   I was thinking maybe to a couple batches with wy1450 and different low alpha acid hops and doing a 5 gal. batch and fermenting 2 2.5 gal buckets with different yeasts.  To further complicate things I switched to a cooler setup where this batch was done when I was doing BIAB, so maybe I should do a no sparge with a thin mash?  If I keep adding test cases/scenarios, It would be over a year before I figure this one out.

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 7.76 gal
Post Boil Volume: 6.76 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.50 gal   
Bottling Volume: 5.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.055 SG
Estimated Color: 7.8 SRM
Estimated IBU: 36.1 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 82.7 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt                   Name                                     Type          #        %/IBU         
12 lbs                Pale Malt; American (Farm Boy Farms) (6. Grain         1        100.0 %       
0.75 oz               Cascade [6.30 %] - First Wort 60.0 min   Hop           2        15.7 IBUs     
0.75 oz               Cascade [6.30 %] - Boil 30.0 min         Hop           3        11.0 IBUs     
1.00 oz               Cascade [6.30 %] - Boil 15.0 min         Hop           4        9.4 IBUs     
1.00 Items            Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 10.0 mins)        Fining        5        -             
0.50 tsp              Yeast Nutrient (Wyeast) (Boil 10.0 mins) Other         6        -             
1.00 oz               Cascade [6.30 %] - Boil 0.0 min          Hop           7        0.0 IBUs     
1.0 pkg               Denny‚Äôs Favorite 50 (Wyeast Labs #1450)  Yeast         8        -             


Mash Schedule: BIAB, Medium Body
Total Grain Weight: 12 lbs
----------------------------
Name              Description                             Step Temperature        Step Time           
Saccharification  Add 8.64 gal of water at 162.2 F        155.0 F                 75 min               
Mash Out          Heat to 168.0 F over 7 min              168.0 F                 10 min               

Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: colinhayes on November 01, 2014, 09:00:17 PM
Could be the first wort hopping?
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: klickitat jim on November 01, 2014, 09:51:26 PM
Smooth is kind of hard to diagnose from a distance but one thing pops out at me. You have your FWH at 60 min, when its probably perceived as more like a 20 min. So probably its a combo of that and ph
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: stpug on November 01, 2014, 10:52:40 PM
Nothing about that pale ale recipe stands out as "bitter" or "harsh", so I would expect a "smooth" beer with the recipe given.  FWH, in my book, are simply bittering hops with an added few IBUs - nothing about them is perceived as extra "smooth" to me.  Take a pale ale with relatively low BU:GU ratio, couple it with a yeast that takes it's time to flocclate, and by the time the beer clears it should be well aged and mellowed due to yeast-isoalpha acid bonding and flocculation.  I would try it again exactly as you have detailed.
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: tonyccopeland on November 02, 2014, 02:13:39 PM
Thanks for insight.  I think I am going to try and reproduce the current on my new cooler setup, then take it from there staying with fwh/yeast and changing the grist, then hops.
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: dunngood on November 02, 2014, 02:17:31 PM
So you added 8.64 gals. To the mash with no sparge ?
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: denny on November 02, 2014, 04:38:23 PM
Thanks for insight.  I think I am going to try and reproduce the current on my new cooler setup, then take it from there staying with fwh/yeast and changing the grist, then hops.

I think you may have to define what you mean by "smooth finish".  But I agree that both the FWH and the yeast could contribute to what I imagine you mean.
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: tonyccopeland on November 02, 2014, 05:09:15 PM
So you added 8.64 gals. To the mash with no sparge ?
I was doing a BIAB... mashed with full volume and just removed the bag with grains.
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: tonyccopeland on November 02, 2014, 05:12:15 PM
Thanks for insight.  I think I am going to try and reproduce the current on my new cooler setup, then take it from there staying with fwh/yeast and changing the grist, then hops.

I think you may have to define what you mean by "smooth finish".  But I agree that both the FWH and the yeast could contribute to what I imagine you mean.
Yeah... I agree, gotta work on that description too when I brew the next batch.
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: klickitat jim on November 02, 2014, 11:58:57 PM
What I think he means is that smooth is a texture so its describing the mouthfeel. But I'll bet you mean flavor.
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: epic1856 on November 03, 2014, 04:25:14 PM
I brewed the following recipe this summer and ended up with a pale ale with an incredibly smooth finish.  It seemed to be just what I wanted after about 6 weeks in the keg.          

I think it has less to do with the recipe and more with aging. You didnt say how it was stored for 6 weeks, but you may have accidentally lagered the beer. Some of the benefits of lagering I found; http://www.homebrewing.org/Lagering--Chapter-1-Common-Misconceptions_ep_58-1.html (http://www.homebrewing.org/Lagering--Chapter-1-Common-Misconceptions_ep_58-1.html)
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: blatz on November 03, 2014, 07:44:42 PM
the times I have used Denny's 50 versus Chico, I've always felt it was 'smoother' than the same recipe with Chico.  I prefer that type finish in ambers, american browns and american porters, not so much in APA or IPAs. 

Maybe that is what you're getting. 
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: HoosierBrew on November 03, 2014, 07:49:35 PM
the times I have used Denny's 50 versus Chico, I've always felt it was 'smoother' than the same recipe with Chico.  I prefer that type finish in ambers, american browns and american porters, not so much in APA or IPAs. 

Maybe that is what you're getting. 

+1.  I notice that too, which is why I like 1450 for those styles - the softer, maltier mouthfeel or whatever.  Which is also why I don't use it for APA and IPA.  Good call.
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: reverseapachemaster on November 03, 2014, 07:56:27 PM
Age plus yeast choice but FWH with no 60 minute addition.
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: tonyccopeland on November 03, 2014, 11:04:09 PM
I brewed the following recipe this summer and ended up with a pale ale with an incredibly smooth finish.  It seemed to be just what I wanted after about 6 weeks in the keg.          

I think it has less to do with the recipe and more with aging. You didnt say how it was stored for 6 weeks, but you may have accidentally lagered the beer. Some of the benefits of lagering I found; http://www.homebrewing.org/Lagering--Chapter-1-Common-Misconceptions_ep_58-1.html (http://www.homebrewing.org/Lagering--Chapter-1-Common-Misconceptions_ep_58-1.html)
My kegerator is set for 41 degrees, if that helps shed a little light on things.   My kegerator only holds two kegs, so i generally kick em in 8 weeks or less.
Title: Re: Smooth finish on a brew... Help on what might have caused it?
Post by: stpug on November 05, 2014, 06:45:16 PM
I'd be interested in how your next batch of this beer works out. How reminiscent of your last batch it comes or doesn't. Keep us posted.