Homebrewers Association | AHA Forum

General Category => Equipment and Software => Topic started by: jeffy on April 13, 2015, 02:41:59 PM

Title: BS decoction setting
Post by: jeffy on April 13, 2015, 02:41:59 PM
I brewed a Dunkel yesterday using 100% Wyerman Munich II.  When I entered it into BeerSmith it showed it coming out too pale in color, so I decided rather than go back to the store and get some roast malt for color adjustment, I'd do a decoction or two.  I had the time and I'm one of those weird brewers who thinks it adds to the beer.  When I entered this into BS it did not change the color setting, even with two decoctions.  Anyone else run into this?  I know the wort will be darker because of the decoctions, but I have no idea other than by looking, how much.  I'm fine with the result, but wondered why there would be no change in the program.
Title: Re: BS decoction setting
Post by: dkfick on April 13, 2015, 03:16:22 PM
I don't think BeerSmith accounts for decoction (or boiling) adding any color to the beer.  It's probably because it's not really been quantified as of yet... If you can come up with a reliable model I'm sure Brad would add it ;-)
Title: Re: BS decoction setting
Post by: Jimmy K on April 13, 2015, 03:44:58 PM
Perhaps it's too unpredictable because of different decoction techniques, schedules, equipment, stirring effectiveness, etc.
Title: Re: BS decoction setting
Post by: jeffy on April 13, 2015, 03:47:04 PM
That's what I figured, but it never has stopped him before.  You have assume at least a little darkening, so I'd expect a guess built into the program.
Title: Re: BS decoction setting
Post by: beersk on April 14, 2015, 01:03:31 PM
I'm not sure it really does add that much color...have you honestly noticed a color difference between a non-decocted and decocted beer? Kai did a couple decoction videos showing color differences. What I took from it is that it doesn't add much, if any, color.
I wouldn't believe for a second that a beer like Ayinger Altbarisch dunkel is 100% Munich II. There has to be some caramunich/debittered black malt in there for color.
Title: Re: BS decoction setting
Post by: klickitat jim on April 14, 2015, 01:28:09 PM
I'm not sure it really does add that much color...have you honestly noticed a color difference between a non-decocted and decocted beer? Kai did a couple decoction videos showing color differences. What I took from it is that it doesn't add much, if any, color.
I wouldn't believe for a second that a beer like Ayinger Altbarisch dunkel is 100% Munich II. There has to be some caramunich/debittered black malt in there for color.
There's nothing stopping them from roasting a portion of that munich before it goes in the mash. And can still say its 100%
Title: Re: BS decoction setting
Post by: brewday on April 14, 2015, 02:01:00 PM
I'm not sure it really does add that much color...have you honestly noticed a color difference between a non-decocted and decocted beer? Kai did a couple decoction videos showing color differences. What I took from it is that it doesn't add much, if any, color.
I wouldn't believe for a second that a beer like Ayinger Altbarisch dunkel is 100% Munich II. There has to be some caramunich/debittered black malt in there for color.
There's nothing stopping them from roasting a portion of that munich before it goes in the mash. And can still say its 100%

I thought I had read it was brewed with several malts, including dark???  Maybe I'm crazy.  As for decoction and color, I do notice quite a difference between my decocted vs not decocted Hefes and Berliners.
Title: Re: BS decoction setting
Post by: jeffy on April 14, 2015, 02:03:01 PM
I'm not sure it really does add that much color...have you honestly noticed a color difference between a non-decocted and decocted beer? Kai did a couple decoction videos showing color differences. What I took from it is that it doesn't add much, if any, color.
I wouldn't believe for a second that a beer like Ayinger Altbarisch dunkel is 100% Munich II. There has to be some caramunich/debittered black malt in there for color.

When boiling a decoction you can actually see the color darken, especially so when adding it back to the main mash. 
I did one decoction of thick mash to get from 148F to 158F, then took an all liquid decoction and boiled it for 20 minutes to concentrate it before adding back to mash out.  I'm pretty sure I got some color and some more malt flavors, sort of like boiling the first runnings for a Strong Scotch Ale.
Title: Re: BS decoction setting
Post by: brewday on April 14, 2015, 02:21:01 PM
I'm not sure it really does add that much color...have you honestly noticed a color difference between a non-decocted and decocted beer? Kai did a couple decoction videos showing color differences. What I took from it is that it doesn't add much, if any, color.
I wouldn't believe for a second that a beer like Ayinger Altbarisch dunkel is 100% Munich II. There has to be some caramunich/debittered black malt in there for color.

When boiling a decoction you can actually see the color darken, especially so when adding it back to the main mash. 
I did one decoction of thick mash to get from 148F to 158F, then took an all liquid decoction and boiled it for 20 minutes to concentrate it before adding back to mash out.  I'm pretty sure I got some color and some more malt flavors, sort of like boiling the first runnings for a Strong Scotch Ale.

+1

I think you can control the color to a degree based on length and vigor of boil.  Maybe that's why BS left it out.
Title: Re: BS decoction setting
Post by: reverseapachemaster on April 14, 2015, 02:36:14 PM
I think most people would say decoction is already a BS setting.