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General Category => Events => Homebrew Competitions => Topic started by: flbrewer on August 16, 2015, 12:57:02 PM

Title: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: flbrewer on August 16, 2015, 12:57:02 PM
Is it commonplace to have non-BJCP judges judging at competitions?
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: Stevie on August 16, 2015, 01:04:32 PM
Yes. Too many comps, not enough certified judges. Comps I have worked normally paired a certified and ranked judge with a novice. Comps I have entered have been judged by novices or provisional judges. It's a craps shoot.
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: nspake on August 16, 2015, 01:18:45 PM
Yes, as Steve says, both, and in most comps, the director tries to pair non-BJCP with ranked BJCP judges. It's a matter of needing judges but also keep in mind, some of those novices will go on to become BJCP. The lead time in first, getting into a Tasting Exam and then getting results means it is a while for a new judge to become ranked. Continued judging gives them more experience and, in the end, makes for better judges.
Cheers!
Neil
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: hopfenundmalz on August 16, 2015, 01:21:37 PM
We all judge our first competition. Most start as a novice to help out at a competition, then decide to take the test.
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: greatplainsbrewer on August 16, 2015, 02:24:34 PM
Last one I judged I was the only BJCP judge there but I'm pretty sure the professional brewer was the better judge that day.  Not having taken the taste exam doesn't mean someone is unqualified.
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: toby on August 16, 2015, 11:01:59 PM
Is it commonplace to have non-BJCP judges judging at competitions?
Yep. Completely normal.  Sometimes it's due to them just not having taken the exam yet, or other times it's pairing a willing novice with a judge.  We have a couple comps where a 'beer celebrity' (usually an established beer blogger or journalist) will get paired with a certified judge.
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: santoch on August 17, 2015, 02:58:39 AM
Agreed - there are nearly always non-BJCP judges in most competitions.  They are normally paired with a Certified or higher judge.  Nationals and higher are almost always paired with novices. That's another reason 2nd round NHC is so great.  Everyone is ranked and knows how to judge already - no 'judging crash course' required.

Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: svr on May 22, 2016, 01:27:14 PM
Just to be shure, because didn't quite get it.
Non BJCP judge, does he needs to be assign to BJCP org as novice or just started a course, or any beer enthusiast that I, as organizer find up to task -can be a judge.
I have in mind local brewmaster, veteran with 30 years expirience, but has nothing to do with BJCP? 
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: santoch on May 22, 2016, 02:53:53 PM
The BJCP has removed the term "Novice" from the score sheet, as it was very confusing and even misleading.

On each BJCP beer score sheet, there is a little area used to record the judge's credentials, whether as a BJCP judge and/or Non-BJCP judge.  For non-BJCP judges, you check the Non-BJCP box, and also there are checkboxes which include things like Cicerone ranks, Pro Brewer, Beer Sommelier, Sensory Training, and even an 'Other' box where you fill in the qualification such as blogger or writer.  You should check all the boxes that apply.
So, a non-bjcp, Master Cicerone, pro brewer checks the Non-BJCP, Master Cicerone, and Pro Brewer boxes.  If the judge doesn't have any of these additional qualifications, then they only check off the "Non-BJCP" box and that's it.

A provisional judge that took the off flavor class already would check the Provisional Judge and Sensory Training boxes.  (A BJCP provisional judge has passed the online exam but has not yet taken the in-person tasting exam).

http://www.bjcp.org/docs/SCP_BeerScoreSheet.pdf

HTH-
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: svr on May 24, 2016, 08:18:03 PM
Thanks for your help, and sorry to bother you.
I'm from Europe, Serbia looking to organize first BJCP competition in my country.
Till now in this part of Europe only Hungaria and Croatia had their own comp.
Trying to find where judges came from to their comp. couldn't find.
Any idea where to look?
I'm resolved to bring BJCP judges because it look like they didn't have BJCP judges.
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: Scot (one T) on May 24, 2016, 08:43:56 PM
I'd be happy to come judge if you cover travel expenses :)
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: santoch on May 24, 2016, 09:19:53 PM
I would try to send an email to Ali Kocho-Williams. He is the Norteast Representative for the BJCP.  That region includes all of the countries that are NOT US or Canada.  His email through the BJCP is ne_rep@bjcp.org.
He can help you find judges, though be forewarned that there are very few in Europe overall.

Good Luck!
Steve
 
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: MDixon on May 25, 2016, 12:18:20 PM
Wait until June 1 and then send a note to Scott Bickham at the same email address as Ali. Scott is the new rep. We were just discussing the guidelines with someone in Russia and the potential for an exam there.
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: svr on May 25, 2016, 03:46:16 PM
MD tnx I just voted  for you.  ;D
Rusia is not that close, but closer.
Again I have questions about number of judges, BJCP or NON BJCP.
In this part of word only few beer categories are widely popular, and I expect that APA and IPA will be majority of entrance.
If I expect 150 entrance,  lets say 40 IPA and same number of APA, while rest is all the other beer styles.
Can I use few judge panels to judge 40 IPA (lets say 4 judge panels -10 entrance each panel to judge) or I need one same judge panel for all 40 IPA's - in few days?
Thank you all
 
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: dsmitch19 on May 25, 2016, 06:55:32 PM
MD tnx I just voted  for you.  ;D
Rusia is not that close, but closer.
Again I have questions about number of judges, BJCP or NON BJCP.
In this part of word only few beer categories are widely popular, and I expect that APA and IPA will be majority of entrance.
If I expect 150 entrance,  lets say 40 IPA and same number of APA, while rest is all the other beer styles.
Can I use few judge panels to judge 40 IPA (lets say 4 judge panels -10 entrance each panel to judge) or I need one same judge panel for all 40 IPA's - in few days?
Thank you all

Definitely split up the larger categories into multiple judging pairs. An ideal flight size for one round of judging is 6-8 with 10 being OK. More than 10 beers in a flight and you start getting fatigue issues and unhappy judges, from my experience.

You'll need to do a mini-BOS round with the top beers form each judging pair to determine the medalists. Some more info on mini-BOS here: http://www.bjcp.org/docs/MiniBOS.pdf
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: MDixon on May 26, 2016, 12:08:11 PM
MD tnx I just voted  for you.  ;D
Rusia is not that close, but closer.
Again I have questions about number of judges, BJCP or NON BJCP.
In this part of word only few beer categories are widely popular, and I expect that APA and IPA will be majority of entrance.
If I expect 150 entrance,  lets say 40 IPA and same number of APA, while rest is all the other beer styles.
Can I use few judge panels to judge 40 IPA (lets say 4 judge panels -10 entrance each panel to judge) or I need one same judge panel for all 40 IPA's - in few days?
Thank you all

Thanks for the world geography reminder!

There is a BJCP exam in June 2016 in the Czech Republic. In Feb there is one in Italy in 2017, but of course that would not be accessible by car. Other than that I don't see anything coming up on the calendar, but if you could get enough people interested, one could be scheduled in your area, the biggest issue would be finding proctors. Scott would be the best to help with that.

If you need more info on holding the comp, use this to guide you.
http://bjcp.org/docs/SCPCompHdbk.pdf
Title: Re: Non BJCP Judging
Post by: svr on May 27, 2016, 02:24:45 PM
Will wait after Czech exam.
That would be perfect. Tnx