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General Category => General Homebrew Discussion => Topic started by: jeffy on February 17, 2019, 05:11:18 PM

Title: Iodophor age
Post by: jeffy on February 17, 2019, 05:11:18 PM
My preferred sanitizer is iodophor.  I was told years ago by a kitchen health inspector that as long as the color in the iodophor/water mix is amber, then it is effective.  When left in an open container that color fades within a couple of days. 
In the last year I have adjusted my packaging regimen to closed transfer into kegs (filled with sanitizer and then pushed out with CO2) before transfer.  I have been reusing the sanitizer from keg to keg to keg and since I cannot see it, I have no idea if it is still amber.
The question is, does the sanitizer lose its effectiveness with age or with oxygen exposure or both?
Maybe next time I’ll take a little sample during transfer.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: hopfenundmalz on February 17, 2019, 05:27:12 PM
Iodine test strips determine the effectiveness.

https://preclaboratories.com/product/iodine-test-paper/

Some Brewer friends said the inspector asked where their test strips were. They said they laughed, as they mix new solutions everyday. Don't know if they got dinged or not.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: denny on February 17, 2019, 05:36:07 PM
Jeff, I'll pass your questionm along to the people that make BTF  iodophor.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 17, 2019, 05:46:53 PM
I make up a new supply every time that I need to use it and discard at the end of the session.  One of the great things about iodophor is that it's cheap enough to do so,  especially if you buy it by the gallon -- which will last a very long time, and AFAIK it does not degrade in concentrated form. 

BTF label says to use a test kit to verify ppm (I'm sure their lawyers made them put that part in,) and immediately thereafter states, "As long as solution is amber color,  there is sufficient iodine present to sanitize.   Make new solution daily or when color fades."
Title: Iodophor age
Post by: tommymorris on February 17, 2019, 07:41:52 PM
OP, can you squirt a little out into a glass with a cobra tap? Then you could check the color.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: lupulus on February 17, 2019, 07:52:06 PM
Iodine evaporates.

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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 17, 2019, 08:01:15 PM
Iodine evaporates.

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But the amber color is an indicator that positively confirms the presence of iodine.  Try this experiment.   Make up an iodophor solution.  Drop in a Campden tablet or other metabisulfate, which will reduce iodine in the same way it does its fellow halogen, chlorine.   The solution will instantaneously turn colorless.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: lupulus on February 18, 2019, 01:14:54 AM
You are right. I fail to see the contradiction though.  Iodine evaporates.

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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 18, 2019, 01:28:44 AM
You are right. I fail to see the contradiction though.  Iodine evaporates.

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No contradiction implied.  I'm just thinking that you don't need to know its evaporation rate, or test for ppm,  as long as you have a rough idea of the color corresponding to your desired concentration.   That seems to be the intention of the manufacturers.

The question we're left with is, will the iodine somehow be reduced even in a closed container, by some means other than evaporation?     The instruction to make it up fresh daily isn't qualified by "unless stored tightly covered" or the like.  I'll be interested in hearing what, if anything, Denny learns from National Chemicals.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: lupulus on February 18, 2019, 04:36:40 PM
You are right. I fail to see the contradiction though.  Iodine evaporates.

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No contradiction implied.  I'm just thinking that you don't need to know its evaporation rate, or test for ppm,  as long as you have a rough idea of the color corresponding to your desired concentration.   That seems to be the intention of the manufacturers.

The question we're left with is, will the iodine somehow be reduced even in a closed container, by some means other than evaporation?     The instruction to make it up fresh daily isn't qualified by "unless stored tightly covered" or the like.  I'll be interested in hearing what, if anything, Denny learns from National Chemicals.
Agreed. My educated guess is that if the container is full (no air) and closed (and room temp) it will stay amber and active (as chlorine does).

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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 18, 2019, 05:40:22 PM
You are right. I fail to see the contradiction though.  Iodine evaporates.

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No contradiction implied.  I'm just thinking that you don't need to know its evaporation rate, or test for ppm,  as long as you have a rough idea of the color corresponding to your desired concentration.   That seems to be the intention of the manufacturers.

The question we're left with is, will the iodine somehow be reduced even in a closed container, by some means other than evaporation?     The instruction to make it up fresh daily isn't qualified by "unless stored tightly covered" or the like.  I'll be interested in hearing what, if anything, Denny learns from National Chemicals.
Agreed. My educated guess is that if the container is full (no air) and closed (and room temp) it will stay amber and active (as chlorine does).

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The only other possibility I can think of is that there might be some potential reaction with minerals in the dilution water.  But that's a less than educated guess.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: denny on February 18, 2019, 06:20:59 PM
Would anyone mind if I asked someone from BTF iodophor to comment here?
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 18, 2019, 06:55:57 PM
Would anyone mind if I asked someone from BTF iodophor to comment here?
Mind?  Surely I wouldn't.  Exactly what we need is something straight from the people who actually know.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: lupulus on February 18, 2019, 07:52:49 PM
Would anyone mind if I asked someone from BTF iodophor to comment here?
Thanks Denny. Of course.

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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: jeffy on February 18, 2019, 07:57:04 PM
Would anyone mind if I asked someone from BTF iodophor to comment here?
Thanks Denny. Of course.

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Seems like a good idea.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: denny on February 18, 2019, 09:03:54 PM
I'll contact them and ask someone to drop by
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 19, 2019, 08:55:02 PM
I'll contact them and ask someone to drop by

Hey guys!  I'm here for any Q&A regarding our BTF Iodophor.  I am our Brewing Ambassador for the Craft Meister and BTF Iodophor products here at National Chemicals.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: denny on February 19, 2019, 09:01:45 PM
I'll contact them and ask someone to drop by

Hey guys!  I'm here for any Q&A regarding our BTF Iodophor.  I am our Brewing Ambassador for the Craft Meister and BTF Iodophor products here at National Chemicals.

Thanks for dropping by, Jonathan!

I asked Jonathan to drop by to answer some questions.  I know him well, he's a great guy with great info, so let the questions fly!
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 19, 2019, 09:13:06 PM
So the most basic question on this thread seems to be, how long will iodophor solution that has been made up retain its effectiveness if stored sealed up so that iodine won't evaporate (except into minimal head space?)  Does it degrade by some process other than evaporation of the iodine?
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 19, 2019, 09:33:51 PM
And while we have you, I have another question.   Is full immersion of a piece of equipment in iodophor for two minutes necessary, or is the surfactant able to maintain sufficient contact over sufficient time to sanitize an item that is dipped or sprayed and allowed to drain? 
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 19, 2019, 09:51:43 PM
So the most basic question on this thread seems to be, how long will iodophor solution that has been made up retain its effectiveness if stored sealed up so that iodine won't evaporate (except into minimal head space?)  Does it degrade by some process other than evaporation of the iodine?

The first thing to consider is that Iodine is naturally a gas, like other halogens such as Chlorine.  Their natural tendency is to be a gas.  Iodophor is made from an Iodine complex that creates a concentrated, liquid, soluble form of Iodine.

Basic usage info:

Always mix BTF Iodophor into cool or lukewarm water.  The hotter the water, the faster the Iodine will gas into the atmosphere.

Mix rate: 1/2 ounce concentrate per 5 gallons of water; 1/4 ounce concentrate per 2.5 gallons of water; 1 tsp per 1.5 gallons of water.

Allow 2 minutes of contact time, drain, air dry.  No rinsing is required.

Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.  In a completely air tight container, this shelf life is likely far greater, but it's pretty difficult to put an exact number on it for time.  There are things you can look for in solution color (amber vs. clear) and using Iodine test strips as a guide.  Personally, I mix a fresh solution in a small batch every time I have a brewery-related task, then discard and mix new when I'm doing something again.  It's cheap enough per use to do this.

Other things that will degrade the solution:

-Residual alkaline detergents.  The Iodine complex and the Iodophor concentrate are acidic solutions.  Mixing into any water that has residual alkaline detergent will neutralize the solution.  I've run into people that have had issues running Iodophor through plate/counterflow chillers where there was residual alkaline detergent remaining in the system and it neutralizes the Iodophor solution.

-Excessive agitation or shaking

-UV light, so leave your solution in a dark place

As far as the concentrated product itself, National Chemicals suggests a two year shelf life for storage.  However, we have run into situations where clients have turned in product over 10 years old and it passes QA tests.  For best results, buy smaller containers and try to go through the bottles in about 2 years - or brew more!
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 19, 2019, 09:55:12 PM
And while we have you, I have another question.   Is full immersion of a piece of equipment in iodophor for two minutes necessary, or is the surfactant able to maintain sufficient contact over sufficient time to sanitize an item that is dipped or sprayed and allowed to drain?

My typical procedure, say, for a carboy is to fill about 1-2 gallons of Iodophor solution into the carboy, swirl to contact everything for about 30 seconds, dump the solution, then place on a rack to drip dry.  The time spent drying contributes to the "wet time" contact.

Initially, the product was designed as a 3rd sink sanitizer for beer glasses.  BTF stands for Bartender's Friend.  In a 3rd sink, you would dunk the glass, immerse for up to 2 minutes, then place on a rack to dry.  You can treat your brewing gear and parts the same way as well.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: denny on February 19, 2019, 09:55:31 PM
I think you've mentioned to me before that protein contaminants will degrade mixed iodophor.....basically if you put stuff in that hasn't been cleaned first.  Am I remembering correctly?
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: BrewBama on February 19, 2019, 10:00:38 PM
Is Craftmeister Oxygen Brewery Wash considered alkaline?

I didn’t notice if you addressed spraying an Iodophor solution onto a surface.


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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: denny on February 19, 2019, 10:07:54 PM
Is Craftmeister Oxygen Brewery Wash considered alkaline?

I didn’t notice if you addressed spraying an Iodophor solution onto a surface.


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They specifically make an alkaline wash so I'm pretty sure the oxygen isn't.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 19, 2019, 10:22:49 PM
I think you've mentioned to me before that protein contaminants will degrade mixed iodophor.....basically if you put stuff in that hasn't been cleaned first.  Am I remembering correctly?

Denny, you are correct.  Residual organic material does deactivate the solution, so always clean appropriately, rinse, then sanitize.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 19, 2019, 10:26:22 PM
Is Craftmeister Oxygen Brewery Wash considered alkaline?

I didn’t notice if you addressed spraying an Iodophor solution onto a surface.


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Yes, Craft Meister Oxygen Brewery Wash is alkaline in solution.  In addition to the sodium percarbonate (the oxygen release chemistry), we blend in sodium metasilicate, a non-caustic alkaline agent, into the powder.  The alkaline pH promotes the break down of proteins and organic materials.

Spraying an Iodophor solution for spot sanitizing is effective, just make completely sure you hit every surface you are sanitizing.  I've heard of cellar employees at breweries keeping spray bottles of Iodophor in a holster, ready for action!
Title: Iodophor age
Post by: BrewBama on February 19, 2019, 10:46:29 PM
Thank you for coming here to address questions. As you can see there are many. Here are a cpl more:

To purge a keg of oxygen, many homebrewers remove the oxygen from a keg by filling it completely with *liquid* then remove the *liquid* with CO2.  Finally we replace the CO2 with beer via “closed transfer”.  Can the *liquid* be Iodophor or is the air drying step you described above absolutely required?

Once a vessel is sanitized by soaking for 2 minutes and allowed to air dry [inverted], in a home brewery (aka my laundry room), how long would you conservatively expect the [inverted] vessel to be considered “sanitized”?  What factors would you suggest to increase this conservative estimation?
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: BrewBama on February 19, 2019, 11:22:18 PM
“Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.”

How should this ‘water’ be disposed of after the 12-24 hr off gassing?  I don’t dare pour an Iodophor solution down the drain lest it kill my biological balance in my septic system but can this ‘water’ be poured into a septic system?


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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 19, 2019, 11:36:55 PM
“Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.”

How should this ‘water’ be disposed of after the 12-24 hr off gassing?  I don’t dare pour an Iodophor solution down the drain lest it kill my biological balance in my septic system but can this ‘water’ be poured into a septic system?


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I don't have a septic system but this is an interesting point, as I believe I am not really allowed to dump this into the city sewer either (though I do, mildly worried how it may affect the water reclamation process downstream.)  Remember my mention above that Campden, SMB or PMB will reduce the iodine and turn the water instantly clear.  Would this be a viable solution for those with septic systems, and advisable for all of us who may be concerned about the effects or legality of discharging sanitizers?
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: mabrungard on February 20, 2019, 12:37:50 PM

Other things that will degrade the solution:

-Residual alkaline detergents.  The Iodine complex and the Iodophor concentrate are acidic solutions.  Mixing into any water that has residual alkaline detergent will neutralize the solution.  I've run into people that have had issues running Iodophor through plate/counterflow chillers where there was residual alkaline detergent remaining in the system and it neutralizes the Iodophor solution.


Interesting. So if alkaline cleaners tend to neutralize iodophor solutions, it therefore suggests that highly alkaline water supplies might take a bit more of the concentrate than low alkalinity water such as rainwater, RO, or distilled? This also suggests that we can neutralize excess alkalinity in our water supply in order to make our iodophor solutions more effective.

If that's the case, the Water Acidification calculator in Bru'n Water does make it easier to figure out what a brewer's acid dose needs to be in order to neutralize most or all the water supply's alkalinity.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: denny on February 20, 2019, 03:14:59 PM
Is Craftmeister Oxygen Brewery Wash considered alkaline?

I didn’t notice if you addressed spraying an Iodophor solution onto a surface.


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Yes, Craft Meister Oxygen Brewery Wash is alkaline in solution.  In addition to the sodium percarbonate (the oxygen release chemistry), we blend in sodium metasilicate, a non-caustic alkaline agent, into the powder.  The alkaline pH promotes the break down of proteins and organic materials.

Spraying an Iodophor solution for spot sanitizing is effective, just make completely sure you hit every surface you are sanitizing.  I've heard of cellar employees at breweries keeping spray bottles of Iodophor in a holster, ready for action!

I stand corrected and will refrain from further speculation.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: denny on February 20, 2019, 03:18:43 PM
“Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.”

How should this ‘water’ be disposed of after the 12-24 hr off gassing?  I don’t dare pour an Iodophor solution down the drain lest it kill my biological balance in my septic system but can this ‘water’ be poured into a septic system?


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FWIW, I have been pouring mixed, active Iodophor (and StarSan) dow n the drain into myseptic system for many years without problem.  Considering that the amount I add is meant for 5 gal. And the septic system is hundreds of gal., the solution is so dilute thay it causes no problems.  Maybe your septic system is different.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: mainebrewer on February 20, 2019, 05:07:29 PM
“Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.”

How should this ‘water’ be disposed of after the 12-24 hr off gassing?  I don’t dare pour an Iodophor solution down the drain lest it kill my biological balance in my septic system but can this ‘water’ be poured into a septic system?

Same here. I've brewed 5 gal batches pretty much every 2 weeks for the past 16 years. I routinely mix up 2 gals of the sanitizer du jour (iodophor, saniclean/starsan) and at the end of the brew session pour it down the drain into my septic system. There have been no discernable negative effects as a result.


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FWIW, I have been pouring mixed, active Iodophor (and StarSan) dow n the drain into myseptic system for many years without problem.  Considering that the amount I add is meant for 5 gal. And the septic system is hundreds of gal., the solution is so dilute thay it causes no problems.  Maybe your septic system is different.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: BrewBama on February 20, 2019, 05:10:38 PM
“Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.”

How should this ‘water’ be disposed of after the 12-24 hr off gassing?  I don’t dare pour an Iodophor solution down the drain lest it kill my biological balance in my septic system but can this ‘water’ be poured into a septic system?


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FWIW, I have been pouring mixed, active Iodophor (and StarSan) dow n the drain into myseptic system for many years without problem.  Considering that the amount I add is meant for 5 gal. And the septic system is hundreds of gal., the solution is so dilute thay it causes no problems.  Maybe your septic system is different.

No, mine is hundreds of gallons as well. I just hate to knowingly add a substance that could kill my bio balance. Now knowing it could simply be water after 24 hours I could simply add more Iodophor to the same bucket and not pour it down the drain at all.


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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 20, 2019, 05:35:01 PM
“Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.”

How should this ‘water’ be disposed of after the 12-24 hr off gassing?  I don’t dare pour an Iodophor solution down the drain lest it kill my biological balance in my septic system but can this ‘water’ be poured into a septic system?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

FWIW, I have been pouring mixed, active Iodophor (and StarSan) dow n the drain into myseptic system for many years without problem.  Considering that the amount I add is meant for 5 gal. And the septic system is hundreds of gal., the solution is so dilute thay it causes no problems.  Maybe your septic system is different.

No, mine is hundreds of gallons as well. I just hate to knowingly add a substance that could kill my bio balance. Now knowing it could simply be water after 24 hours I could simply add more Iodophor to the same bucket and not pour it down the drain at all.


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It wouldn't be just water, it just wouldn't have iodine.  It would still contain the acids, surfactants and other ingredients that work with the iodine, so just adding more iodophor concentrate, I suspect,  would result in the wrong balance.  It's cheap, why not just dump it?
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: BrewBama on February 20, 2019, 05:45:41 PM
Good point. I use very little to make a solution


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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 21, 2019, 01:56:07 AM
“Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.”

How should this ‘water’ be disposed of after the 12-24 hr off gassing?  I don’t dare pour an Iodophor solution down the drain lest it kill my biological balance in my septic system but can this ‘water’ be poured into a septic system?


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Valid concern, however, once it is clear water it’s just that - water.  The Iodine has returned to gas in the atmosphere and you are clear to dump that water into your septic.  The worst thing you could do is dump a bottle of Iodophor concentrate into your septic, that would be bad. 
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 21, 2019, 02:01:25 AM
Is Craftmeister Oxygen Brewery Wash considered alkaline?

I didn’t notice if you addressed spraying an Iodophor solution onto a surface.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Yes, Craft Meister Oxygen Brewery Wash is alkaline in solution.  In addition to the sodium percarbonate (the oxygen release chemistry), we blend in sodium metasilicate, a non-caustic alkaline agent, into the powder.  The alkaline pH promotes the break down of proteins and organic materials.

Spraying an Iodophor solution for spot sanitizing is effective, just make completely sure you hit every surface you are sanitizing.  I've heard of cellar employees at breweries keeping spray bottles of Iodophor in a holster, ready for action!

I stand corrected and will refrain from further speculation.

It is confusing, a bit, on our part to have two types of cleaners.  Both the Oxygen and the Alkaline Brewery Wash have an alkaline pH in solution, the difference is the Oxygen wash has sodium percarbonate for the “oxi clean” effect and the Alkaline Wash doesn’t.  The advantage to the Alakline Wash is that without percarbonate, Alkaline Wash can be used in cold water, whereas hot water is required to dissolve and activate percarbonate.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 21, 2019, 02:05:46 AM
“Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.”

How should this ‘water’ be disposed of after the 12-24 hr off gassing?  I don’t dare pour an Iodophor solution down the drain lest it kill my biological balance in my septic system but can this ‘water’ be poured into a septic system?


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Valid concern, however, once it is clear water it’s just that - water.  The Iodine has returned to gas in the atmosphere and you are clear to dump that water into your septic.  The worst thing you could do is dump a bottle of Iodophor concentrate into your septic, that would be bad.



Valid concern, however, once it is clear water it’s just that - water.  The Iodine has returned to gas in the atmosphere

Really just water?  Surely there are other ingredients that remain?  These would affect any possible use of the water other than dumping it down the drain, right? 
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 21, 2019, 02:06:22 AM

Other things that will degrade the solution:

-Residual alkaline detergents.  The Iodine complex and the Iodophor concentrate are acidic solutions.  Mixing into any water that has residual alkaline detergent will neutralize the solution.  I've run into people that have had issues running Iodophor through plate/counterflow chillers where there was residual alkaline detergent remaining in the system and it neutralizes the Iodophor solution.


Interesting. So if alkaline cleaners tend to neutralize iodophor solutions, it therefore suggests that highly alkaline water supplies might take a bit more of the concentrate than low alkalinity water such as rainwater, RO, or distilled? This also suggests that we can neutralize excess alkalinity in our water supply in order to make our iodophor solutions more effective.

If that's the case, the Water Acidification calculator in Bru'n Water does make it easier to figure out what a brewer's acid dose needs to be in order to neutralize most or all the water supply's alkalinity.

Marty, this is an excellent question.  I will dig into specific water pH thresholds where Iodophor solutions become difficult to maintain.  We did develop the product in Winona, MN, which has tremendously hard water right on the Mississippi River - however hardness and pH are slightly different discussions.  I recall a client that had municipal water coming out at a pH of 9 that had difficulty mixing Iodophor solutions.

With an RO system at home myself, I usually use my RO water for small batches of Iodophor solutions when I brew. 

I will run this up the chain to Dr. Landman, the developer of the product, for his input and post back with a more specific answer.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 21, 2019, 02:09:59 AM
“Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.”

How should this ‘water’ be disposed of after the 12-24 hr off gassing?  I don’t dare pour an Iodophor solution down the drain lest it kill my biological balance in my septic system but can this ‘water’ be poured into a septic system?


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Valid concern, however, once it is clear water it’s just that - water.  The Iodine has returned to gas in the atmosphere and you are clear to dump that water into your septic.  The worst thing you could do is dump a bottle of Iodophor concentrate into your septic, that would be bad.



Valid concern, however, once it is clear water it’s just that - water.  The Iodine has returned to gas in the atmosphere

Really just water?  Surely there are other ingredients that remain?  These would affect any possible use of the water other than dumping it down the drain, right?

For the purposes of disposing of spent solution, I would consider it just water (free of Iodine).  I wouldn’t personally use it for anything else other than dumping it down the drain.  This is why I make very small volumes of solution at a time - 1 tsp of concentrate for 1.5 gallons of water will do the trick for just about anything for home brewing related.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 21, 2019, 02:16:48 AM
“Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.”

How should this ‘water’ be disposed of after the 12-24 hr off gassing?  I don’t dare pour an Iodophor solution down the drain lest it kill my biological balance in my septic system but can this ‘water’ be poured into a septic system?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Valid concern, however, once it is clear water it’s just that - water.  The Iodine has returned to gas in the atmosphere and you are clear to dump that water into your septic.  The worst thing you could do is dump a bottle of Iodophor concentrate into your septic, that would be bad.



Valid concern, however, once it is clear water it’s just that - water.  The Iodine has returned to gas in the atmosphere

Really just water?  Surely there are other ingredients that remain?  These would affect any possible use of the water other than dumping it down the drain, right?

For the purposes of disposing of spent solution, I would consider it just water (free of Iodine).  I wouldn’t personally use it for anything else other than dumping it down the drain.  This is why I make very small volumes of solution at a time - 1 tsp of concentrate for 1.5 gallons of water will do the trick for just about anything for home brewing related.
Thanks for the clarification.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: goose on February 21, 2019, 02:09:52 PM
“Typically the Iodine mixed into solution will gas back into the atmosphere in roughly 12-24 hours, turning back to clear water.”

How should this ‘water’ be disposed of after the 12-24 hr off gassing?  I don’t dare pour an Iodophor solution down the drain lest it kill my biological balance in my septic system but can this ‘water’ be poured into a septic system?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

FWIW, I have been pouring mixed, active Iodophor (and StarSan) dow n the drain into my septic system for many years without problem.  Considering that the amount I add is meant for 5 gal. And the septic system is hundreds of gal., the solution is so dilute thay it causes no problems.  Maybe your septic system is different.

No, mine is hundreds of gallons as well. I just hate to knowingly add a substance that could kill my bio balance. Now knowing it could simply be water after 24 hours I could simply add more Iodophor to the same bucket and not pour it down the drain at all.


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It wouldn't be just water, it just wouldn't have iodine.  It would still contain the acids, surfactants and other ingredients that work with the iodine, so just adding more iodophor concentrate, I suspect,  would result in the wrong balance.  It's cheap, why not just dump it?

Back when i first started brewing (back in the dark ages :D), I kept Iodophor in a closed keg before I knew all the particulars of the product.  When it turned clear, I just dumped some more concentrate into the keg.  The beers started tasting like crap using this method since I used that same keg for the batch of beer.  I stopped doing that and started making up a new solution every time I needed it since, as Rob said, it's cheap.  Problem solved.  I now use SaniClean for sanitizing because it doesn't foam and will keep for a month or two when mixed with R.O. water (I keep it in a Gott Cooler and check the pH of it every time I brew) (apologies to Craft Meister).

I also just dumped it down the drain to my septic system, along with other cleaning and sanitizing products and have not seen any adverse impact.

Thanks for all of the input from Craft Meister!
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: lupulus on February 21, 2019, 08:24:52 PM
@ Jonathan - thanks for taking the time
@ Denny - thanks for finding Jonathan
Glad to get confirmation of what I once knew.

Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 22, 2019, 07:14:52 PM

Other things that will degrade the solution:

-Residual alkaline detergents.  The Iodine complex and the Iodophor concentrate are acidic solutions.  Mixing into any water that has residual alkaline detergent will neutralize the solution.  I've run into people that have had issues running Iodophor through plate/counterflow chillers where there was residual alkaline detergent remaining in the system and it neutralizes the Iodophor solution.


Interesting. So if alkaline cleaners tend to neutralize iodophor solutions, it therefore suggests that highly alkaline water supplies might take a bit more of the concentrate than low alkalinity water such as rainwater, RO, or distilled? This also suggests that we can neutralize excess alkalinity in our water supply in order to make our iodophor solutions more effective.

If that's the case, the Water Acidification calculator in Bru'n Water does make it easier to figure out what a brewer's acid dose needs to be in order to neutralize most or all the water supply's alkalinity.

Hey Marty, I have some information back from Dr. Landman for you on this topic regarding pH for mixing Iodophor solutions:

"Absolutely. pH 8.5-9 is considered aggressive toward iodophors and requires a higher dose of concentrate to achieve a 12.5-25ppm solution. Above pH 9, the water needs to be treated with a weak acid (typically citric acid) to buffer the diluent back to the 7-8 range before dosing with the iodine concentrate.

... the high pH on the alkaline side prevents the iodine atom from releasing off the organic carrier molecule. It is the release of the free iodine atom that forms the active form of iodine that kills bacteria, etc. It is called hypoiodous acid ... that and elemental iodine are bactericidal. Elemental iodine is hard to get into solution ... hard to dissolve. The hypoiodous acid dissolves easily into water.
The older, original dairy iodophors were formulated with a high percent of some acid ... phosphoric acid, Hydroxyacetic acid, etc.  ... to keep the pH low and help release the iodine."

Hope this helps!
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 22, 2019, 07:30:14 PM
That sounds just like the popular "recipe" for using bleach with sodium hypochlorite diluted to 80 ppm,  where it is said to be essential to acidify to pH 5.0 in order that the chlorine will be almost entirely in the form of hypclorous acid, that being the active killer.   These halogens all behave alike, it seems.

So, does this mean we should be checking the ph of our solution,  or does the color indicator have our backs?
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 22, 2019, 07:58:49 PM
That sounds just like the popular "recipe" for using bleach with sodium hypochlorite diluted to 80 ppm,  where it is said to be essential to acidify to pH 5.0 in order that the chlorine will be almost entirely in the form of hypclorous acid, that being the active killer.   These halogens all behave alike, it seems.

So, does this mean we should be checking the ph of our solution,  or does the color indicator have our backs?

I don't think it's necessary to measure the pH of your water or Iodophor solution.  It's probably a better idea to understand the pH of your tap water or source of water for mixing the solution as I think it's very rare to have a municipal water source coming out at a pH higher than 8.5-9.  Using the regular guides of solution color and Iodine test strips will be an effective measuring tool, along with proper measurement of the BTF Iodophor concentrate.
Title: Iodophor age
Post by: BrewBama on February 22, 2019, 09:23:14 PM
Thank you for coming here to address questions. As you can see there are many. Here are a cpl more:

To purge a keg of oxygen, many homebrewers remove the oxygen from a keg by filling it completely with *liquid* then remove the *liquid* with CO2.  Finally we replace the CO2 with beer via “closed transfer”.  Can the *liquid* be Iodophor or is the air drying step you described above absolutely required?

Once a vessel is sanitized by soaking for 2 minutes and allowed to air dry [inverted], in a home brewery (aka my laundry room), how long would you conservatively expect the [inverted] vessel to be considered “sanitized”?  What factors would you suggest to increase this conservative estimation?

I received this information from  an email:

“I'm familiar with this keg purging method, especially as suggested by Drew and Denny on Experimental Brewing.  Denny has conducted his own tests on purging kegs with an Iodophor solution and says to me that it works great.

It's kind of hard to put a length of time for how long something will stay sanitized.  The best advice would be to use that keg as soon as it's dry after sanitizing.  Typically what I do is to store my kegs clean, then upside down/inverted to dry, then sanitize right before use.  Bacteria and other bugs travel on airborne dust and particles, so the more time you leave a container open to the air, the more chance there is for contamination.”



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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: narcout on February 23, 2019, 12:49:08 AM
Thank you for coming here to address questions. As you can see there are many. Here are a cpl more:

To purge a keg of oxygen, many homebrewers remove the oxygen from a keg by filling it completely with *liquid* then remove the *liquid* with CO2.  Finally we replace the CO2 with beer via “closed transfer”.  Can the *liquid* be Iodophor or is the air drying step you described above absolutely required?

Once a vessel is sanitized by soaking for 2 minutes and allowed to air dry [inverted], in a home brewery (aka my laundry room), how long would you conservatively expect the [inverted] vessel to be considered “sanitized”?  What factors would you suggest to increase this conservative estimation?

I received this information from  an email:

“I'm familiar with this keg purging method, especially as suggested by Drew and Denny on Experimental Brewing.  Denny has conducted his own tests on purging kegs with an Iodophor solution and says to me that it works great.

It's kind of hard to put a length of time for how long something will stay sanitized.  The best advice would be to use that keg as soon as it's dry after sanitizing.  Typically what I do is to store my kegs clean, then upside down/inverted to dry, then sanitize right before use.  Bacteria and other bugs travel on airborne dust and particles, so the more time you leave a container open to the air, the more chance there is for contamination.”



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Do people let items dry after sanitizing?  In the 13 or 14 years I've been using Iodophor as a sanitizer, I have never (and I mean not once) waited for something to dry after I've sanitized it.

It also doesn't seem to jive with the "sanitize right before use" advice.

A purged and sanitized keg isn't going to dry unless you open it, which would kind of defeat the whole point.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 23, 2019, 01:11:19 AM
I let it drain -- I don't, say, rack into a fermenter with a puddle of iodophor in the bottom -- but I try to use stuff while still "wet" as I figure that means it is still sanitized, as you say, narcout.  Even though it's "no rinse," I like a balance between adding as little solution as possible to my beer and waiting so long that I might need to sanitize again.  But...

On the other hand, maybe in an irrational contradiction,  I often sanitize my fermenter ahead of brewing and close it up still wet.  Does this carry a risk of something present on a speck of dust in the air inside contaminating my beer?  I figure the wort will be in contact with the air as the fermenter is filled no matter what.  Maybe should consider that with regard to saniting all equipment, so if it dries, the surface is only as prone to contamination from the the air as the wort itself is.  If a surface has been thoroughly cleaned and sanitized once, maybe we shouldn't worry too much.

Here's my general philosophy.  Cleaning is of primary importance,  sanitizing is just feel-good insurance.  Sanitizing is killing the stuff you left on a surface, cleaning is removing it in the first place.  Clean surfaces are the least possible source of infection.  The one thing we can't clean or sanitize is the air (unless you're brewing in a NASA clean room.) 
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: BrewBama on February 23, 2019, 02:26:43 AM
...
A purged and sanitized keg isn't going to dry unless you open it, which would kind of defeat the whole point.

Which is why I asked the questions while I had the opportunity.

I’ll continue to sanitize and purge and close transfer as I’ve been doing.


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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 23, 2019, 02:43:02 AM


...
A purged and sanitized keg isn't going to dry unless you open it, which would kind of defeat the whole point.

Which is why I asked the questions while I had the opportunity.

I’ll continue to sanitize and purge and close transfer as I’ve been doing.


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Same here.  As I see it, that approach to closed fermentation, sani purging and closed transfer provides for a sanitary environment after we've pitched and closed up.  We just need to be sure there's nothing taking up residence in nooks and crannies or a biofilm in our cold side equipment.  That's more down to cleaning, including beer stone removal, than sanitizing. 
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: goose on February 23, 2019, 01:56:18 PM


...
A purged and sanitized keg isn't going to dry unless you open it, which would kind of defeat the whole point.

Which is why I asked the questions while I had the opportunity.

I’ll continue to sanitize and purge and close transfer as I’ve been doing.


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Same here.  As I see it, that approach to closed fermentation, sani purging and closed transfer provides for a sanitary environment after we've pitched and closed up.  We just need to be sure there's nothing taking up residence in nooks and crannies or a biofilm in our cold side equipment.  That's more down to cleaning, including beer stone removal, than sanitizing.

+1

I can get just about all but maybe a ml or two of sanitizer out of the keg by rocking it around while continuing to blow in CO2 after the keg is emptied.  Obviously, if you shorten the dip tube, this will be harder to accomplish.   I do not open the keg and let it air dry as I agree it defeats the purpose of a closed system transfer.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 23, 2019, 02:36:22 PM


...
A purged and sanitized keg isn't going to dry unless you open it, which would kind of defeat the whole point.

Which is why I asked the questions while I had the opportunity.

I’ll continue to sanitize and purge and close transfer as I’ve been doing.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Same here.  As I see it, that approach to closed fermentation, sani purging and closed transfer provides for a sanitary environment after we've pitched and closed up.  We just need to be sure there's nothing taking up residence in nooks and crannies or a biofilm in our cold side equipment.  That's more down to cleaning, including beer stone removal, than sanitizing.

+1

I can get just about all but maybe a ml or two of sanitizer out of the keg by rocking it around while continuing to blow in CO2 after the keg is emptied.  Obviously, if you shorten the dip tube, this will be harder to accomplish.   I do not open the keg and let it air dry as I agree it defeats the purpose of a closed system transfer.
Goose, I have trimmed dip tubes, but I use this trick I picked up here on the forum.   I also have my gas tubes trimmed to be flush with the inside surface of the keg, or actually slightly recessed.   I blow out all the iodophor I can through the liquid side.   Then pressureize and invert the keg.  With the keg positioned so that the gas post is the lowest point,  pop on a gas QD and blow the remaining iodophor out.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 25, 2019, 09:48:14 PM
The main reason we stress the air drying aspect for using the BTF Iodophor solution is that those instructions are stated specifically on our label.  With EPA regulated products, instructions, methods, and applications are strictly adhered to, especially for commercial use.

However, in real-world applications, air drying may not always be necessary.  The best reason for air drying is to eliminate the opportunity for small amounts of Iodine to get into your beverage.  The chances, when PROPERLY MEASURING an Iodophor solution of flavor impacts from residual Iodine, are slim to nil.

Here is an external link to a great document from an interview with Dr. Landman on BTF Iodophor:

https://www.bayareamashers.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Iodophor.pdf

Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: jeffy on February 25, 2019, 10:26:15 PM
Wow.  Five pages, an expert, a lot of discussion, but not a clear answer to my original question, unless I missed it.  If I measure the proper amount of iodophor into a five gallon keg, seal it, then push it out with CO2 into another keg, there will be no air drying involved.  I'm OK with having a small amount of dilute liquid under the dip tube and I feel that that first corny keg is sanitized and ready to fill with beer.
Now what if I leave the other keg full of sanitizer until the next time I have beer ready to keg?  It's in the dark without oxygen in the head space.  It may be a couple of weeks before I push out the solution with CO2 into another keg.
From what I have read here, the answer is that this probably works, but since it is so cheap, why am I doing it?  Because I have lots of kegs and it's nice to clean and sanitize them at one time.
This weekend I think I will pull out a sample from a keg with three week old iodophor and check for amber color.  Will that be as definitive as a test strip?
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: mabrungard on February 26, 2019, 02:00:40 AM
The main reason we stress the air drying aspect for using the BTF Iodophor solution is that those instructions are stated specifically on our label.  With EPA regulated products, instructions, methods, and applications are strictly adhered to, especially for commercial use.


Air Dry?? I had to go into the brewery and take my bottle off the shelf and read the instructions, but it does say that. The REALLY troubling thing is: "Why did EPA require this?" or  "Why did National Chemicals agree to this requirement?"

I'm afraid that you've just opened a can of worms, but I'm still not about to begin air drying a piece of equipment and have it pick up mold spores. As far as I'm concerned, air drying would bring iodophor back to being no better than an acid-based sanitizer...ineffective against mold spores.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 26, 2019, 02:04:40 AM
The main reason we stress the air drying aspect for using the BTF Iodophor solution is that those instructions are stated specifically on our label.  With EPA regulated products, instructions, methods, and applications are strictly adhered to, especially for commercial use.


Air Dry?? I had to go into the brewery and take my bottle off the shelf and read the instructions, but it does say that. The REALLY troubling thing is: "Why did EPA require this?" or  "Why did National Chemicals agree to this requirement?"

I'm afraid that you've just opened a can of worms, but I'm still not about to begin air drying a piece of equipment and have it pick up mold spores. As far as I'm concerned, air drying would bring iodophor back to being no better than an acid-based sanitizer...ineffective against mold spores.
+1

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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 26, 2019, 02:10:29 AM
Wow.  Five pages, an expert, a lot of discussion, but not a clear answer to my original question, unless I missed it.  If I measure the proper amount of iodophor into a five gallon keg, seal it, then push it out with CO2 into another keg, there will be no air drying involved.  I'm OK with having a small amount of dilute liquid under the dip tube and I feel that that first corny keg is sanitized and ready to fill with beer.
Now what if I leave the other keg full of sanitizer until the next time I have beer ready to keg?  It's in the dark without oxygen in the head space.  It may be a couple of weeks before I push out the solution with CO2 into another keg.
From what I have read here, the answer is that this probably works, but since it is so cheap, why am I doing it?  Because I have lots of kegs and it's nice to clean and sanitize them at one time.
This weekend I think I will pull out a sample from a keg with three week old iodophor and check for amber color.  Will that be as definitive as a test strip?
Jeffy, something I don't quite get about your procedure.  If a little bit of iodophor is left in each keg, then from the second one on, they aren't completely filled to start.  You can surely invert the keg briefly to get full coverage.  But the headspace will be more and more as you go, which, it seems to me, means a little more air left unpurged each time -- which could affect not only the beer, but also the iodophor.  Am I missing something?

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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: jeffy on February 26, 2019, 02:19:27 AM
Wow.  Five pages, an expert, a lot of discussion, but not a clear answer to my original question, unless I missed it.  If I measure the proper amount of iodophor into a five gallon keg, seal it, then push it out with CO2 into another keg, there will be no air drying involved.  I'm OK with having a small amount of dilute liquid under the dip tube and I feel that that first corny keg is sanitized and ready to fill with beer.
Now what if I leave the other keg full of sanitizer until the next time I have beer ready to keg?  It's in the dark without oxygen in the head space.  It may be a couple of weeks before I push out the solution with CO2 into another keg.
From what I have read here, the answer is that this probably works, but since it is so cheap, why am I doing it?  Because I have lots of kegs and it's nice to clean and sanitize them at one time.
This weekend I think I will pull out a sample from a keg with three week old iodophor and check for amber color.  Will that be as definitive as a test strip?
Jeffy, something I don't quite get about your procedure.  If a little bit of iodophor is left in each keg, then from the second one on, they aren't completely filled to start.  You can surely invert the keg briefly to get full coverage.  But the headspace will be more and more as you go, which, it seems to me, means a little more air left unpurged each time -- which could affect not only the beer, but also the iodophor.  Am I missing something?

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I think we’re only talking a couple of teaspoons full.  Not enough to matter in my opinion.  None of the kegs is exactly the same volume.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 26, 2019, 02:21:22 AM
Wow.  Five pages, an expert, a lot of discussion, but not a clear answer to my original question, unless I missed it.  If I measure the proper amount of iodophor into a five gallon keg, seal it, then push it out with CO2 into another keg, there will be no air drying involved.  I'm OK with having a small amount of dilute liquid under the dip tube and I feel that that first corny keg is sanitized and ready to fill with beer.
Now what if I leave the other keg full of sanitizer until the next time I have beer ready to keg?  It's in the dark without oxygen in the head space.  It may be a couple of weeks before I push out the solution with CO2 into another keg.
From what I have read here, the answer is that this probably works, but since it is so cheap, why am I doing it?  Because I have lots of kegs and it's nice to clean and sanitize them at one time.
This weekend I think I will pull out a sample from a keg with three week old iodophor and check for amber color.  Will that be as definitive as a test strip?
Jeffy, something I don't quite get about your procedure.  If a little bit of iodophor is left in each keg, then from the second one on, they aren't completely filled to start.  You can surely invert the keg briefly to get full coverage.  But the headspace will be more and more as you go, which, it seems to me, means a little more air left unpurged each time -- which could affect not only the beer, but also the iodophor.  Am I missing something?

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I think we’re only talking a couple of teaspoons full.  Not enough to matter in my opinion.  None of the kegs is exactly the same volume.
Okay.  I'm waiting for your report on the color of the sample you pull.  That will be the first concrete evidence on this question.

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Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 26, 2019, 02:45:05 AM
This whole thing finally motivated me.   Just ordered test strips.  :)

EDIT  Jeffy, if you're interested, search "iodine test strips" on Amazon.   Bunch of choices, all ~$8 for 100 strips.

Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 27, 2019, 07:38:26 PM
Wow.  Five pages, an expert, a lot of discussion, but not a clear answer to my original question, unless I missed it.  If I measure the proper amount of iodophor into a five gallon keg, seal it, then push it out with CO2 into another keg, there will be no air drying involved.  I'm OK with having a small amount of dilute liquid under the dip tube and I feel that that first corny keg is sanitized and ready to fill with beer.
Now what if I leave the other keg full of sanitizer until the next time I have beer ready to keg?  It's in the dark without oxygen in the head space.  It may be a couple of weeks before I push out the solution with CO2 into another keg.
From what I have read here, the answer is that this probably works, but since it is so cheap, why am I doing it?  Because I have lots of kegs and it's nice to clean and sanitize them at one time.
This weekend I think I will pull out a sample from a keg with three week old iodophor and check for amber color.  Will that be as definitive as a test strip?

I apologize for not providing a clear answer to the original post on this thread.

Your method will work just fine, and will achieve the desired outcomes of clean and sanitized kegs in an efficient manner.  The fact that the kegs are pressurized, in the dark, and clean of organic material will ensure that the BTF Iodophor solution is viable for the job.  As long as the kegs you sanitize and purge in this fashion remain pressure rated, they will stay in a sanitized state until use.  Exposure to outside air through a. Leak would compromise this. 

I would welcome your input regarding a test of the solution in storage with a test paper at the end of the process, but if kept pressurized and sealed, in the dark, I would imagine this solution would be viable for quite a while - it’s just difficult to give you an exact length of time.

In addition, small amounts of properly measured, 12.5 PPM BTF Iodophor, such as barely a tablespoon, will dilute out into such extremely small concentrations in your finished beer that it will be undetectable.  I refer again to the PDF I linked in an earlier post for a good experiment:

https://www.bayareamashers.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Iodophor.pdf

I sincerely hope this helps and please contact me if there are unanswered questions.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 27, 2019, 08:01:07 PM
The main reason we stress the air drying aspect for using the BTF Iodophor solution is that those instructions are stated specifically on our label.  With EPA regulated products, instructions, methods, and applications are strictly adhered to, especially for commercial use.


Air Dry?? I had to go into the brewery and take my bottle off the shelf and read the instructions, but it does say that. The REALLY troubling thing is: "Why did EPA require this?" or  "Why did National Chemicals agree to this requirement?"

I'm afraid that you've just opened a can of worms, but I'm still not about to begin air drying a piece of equipment and have it pick up mold spores. As far as I'm concerned, air drying would bring iodophor back to being no better than an acid-based sanitizer...ineffective against mold spores.

There is a good reason for indicating air drying.  Since the initial application of BTF Iodophor was a third sink sanitizer for sanitizing bar glassware, food code and sanitary guidelines need to apply for standard three compartment sink ware washing.  Here is a document from the ServSafe safe food handling program:

https://www.servsafe.com/ServSafe/media/ServSafe/Documents/poster_12.pdf

Dishes, utensils, glasses, etc. that are sanitized in a third sink must be air dried (not towel dried), inverted on a rack before using again or before storage.  The instructions on BTF Iodophor to air dry before use reinforce the application of the product as a bar and restaurant third sink sanitizer.

For the use of BTF Iodophor as a sanitizer for home brewing, I don’t feel it is required to completely air dry equipment for brewing, such as kegs or carboys, etc.  Shaking off or draining out as much of the end use solution as possible will suffice.  See the quote from Dr. Landman in the article I linked earlier:

https://www.bayareamashers.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Iodophor.pdf

“”NO RINSE” is a phrase that is frequently used in conjunction with iodophor. Manufacturers of Iodophor claim that, when used in a solution of 12.5 ppm, there is no need to rinse to solution from items. They say that the item should be merely air dried. Dr. Landman opined that air drying wasn’t really necessary.”

Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: JT on February 27, 2019, 11:54:44 PM
That makes sense.  Star San, Sani Clean, Io Star - they all say the same thing regarding air drying.  Always wondered why and it makes sense that we wouldn't want them towel dried.  Easy to forget that the solutions weren't made specifically for my home brewing
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: jeffy on February 28, 2019, 01:23:14 AM
I tapped a sample tonight from a corny keg marked “iodophor 1/12/19, transferred to this keg 2/17/19.”
The color is pale yellow if not lighter.  Almost no color.
I will see if my local store has test strips this weekend, but the color tells me that it’s not a viable solution.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Craft Meister on February 28, 2019, 08:12:11 PM
I tapped a sample tonight from a corny keg marked “iodophor 1/12/19, transferred to this keg 2/17/19.”
The color is pale yellow if not lighter.  Almost no color.
I will see if my local store has test strips this weekend, but the color tells me that it’s not a viable solution.

Interesting.  Sounds like there’s a very small amount of Iodophor still present, but you will need to verify the concentration with a test strip to be sure.  I’ll be interested to see how this tests out when you can measure.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Joe T on February 28, 2019, 08:42:48 PM
I recently listened to a Master Brewers Association podcast episode titled "Efficacy of sanitizers in the brewery" in which a Brewer from Bell's discussed an experiment they conducted on kill rates of sanitizers after switching from ethanol to iodophor for spot spraying valves, etc.

Long story short, after the experiment they switched back to ethanol. Lots of great info there. It's worth a listen.

Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on February 28, 2019, 08:58:44 PM
I recently listened to a Master Brewers Association podcast episode titled "Efficacy of sanitizers in the brewery" in which a Brewer from Bell's discussed an experiment they conducted on kill rates of sanitizers after switching from ethanol to iodophor for spot spraying valves, etc.

Long story short, after the experiment they switched back to ethanol. Lots of great info there. It's worth a listen.
We had a lengthy discussion here about that when it came out.

https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=32077.0

Long story short, that study's methodology was so fundamentally flawed that it couldn't pass muster in a grade school science fair.  That it got as far as a poster presentation at MBAA is a warning to regard with suspicion anything they promulgate.  Iodophor is a stone killer, no question.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Joe T on February 28, 2019, 09:32:44 PM
Damn you, Internet!
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: Robert on March 01, 2019, 07:34:25 PM


I tapped a sample tonight from a corny keg marked “iodophor 1/12/19, transferred to this keg 2/17/19.”
The color is pale yellow if not lighter.  Almost no color.
I will see if my local store has test strips this weekend, but the color tells me that it’s not a viable solution.

I just tested some with the strips I got (same brand hopfenundmalz posted about above.)  12.5 ppm is a WAY lighter, yellowish, color than what I expected.   You might be ok, but you'll have to test to find out.   It will be good to recalibrate my eyeballing of the color.  I've probably been wasting concentrate because I thought it looked too weak.
Title: Re: Iodophor age
Post by: jeffy on March 02, 2019, 09:48:40 PM


I tapped a sample tonight from a corny keg marked “iodophor 1/12/19, transferred to this keg 2/17/19.”
The color is pale yellow if not lighter.  Almost no color.
I will see if my local store has test strips this weekend, but the color tells me that it’s not a viable solution.

I just tested some with the strips I got (same brand hopfenundmalz posted about above.)  12.5 ppm is a WAY lighter, yellowish, color than what I expected.   You might be ok, but you'll have to test to find out.   It will be good to recalibrate my eyeballing of the color.  I've probably been wasting concentrate because I thought it looked too weak.
I picked up some test strips today and checked the solution in the above keg.  It was pretty much no color change on the strip.  I then tested a solution I had made up this morning to sanitize bottles and equipment and it looks like it reads about 12.5 ppm.  Interestingly, if I look at the latter in the tub (about 7 inches deep) it is mid amber in color, but in a typical judging cup, the liquid is almost colorless.  So if you are going to use color of the liquid as an indication, you need a deep enough sample.
I think I will experiment a bit with kegs and age to see how that progresses.