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Other than Brewing => All Things Food => Topic started by: MrNate on September 29, 2010, 04:34:53 AM

Title: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on September 29, 2010, 04:34:53 AM
I try to keep tradition alive with my daughters, but I married a damn hippie. I converted them all to scrapple, but they still can't pronounce "syrup" right.

Anyway, if you haven't ever had PA Dutch cooking, make this: http://www.cooks.com/rec/view/0,1938,152162-254206,00.html

The parsley is optional. There are only 4 spices in PA Dutch country: Salt, pepper, flour, and milk.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: gordonstrong on September 29, 2010, 04:55:07 AM
Forget about that, where's your scrapple recipe?  It's a little hard to find around here, but we can get goetta.  Similar.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on September 29, 2010, 05:01:46 AM
I got nothing on that score. I looked through all the old church cookbooks and my grandma's recipe notes. I guess it was just one of those things everybody knew how to make. If I know Grammie it was cornmeal and anything left from the pig all run through the grinder.

17 different recipies for Chow Chow, though.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: euge on September 29, 2010, 05:14:35 AM
Just another way to stretch out our porky friend. Scrapple and Goetta are similar to Boudin which however uses rice instead of buckwheat or oats.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: gordonstrong on September 29, 2010, 05:31:11 AM
Is there something that uses buckwheat?  Scrapple uses cornmeal and goetta uses oats.  The thing I like about goetta is how crisp it fries up.  The crust on scrapple is thinner, and it's a bit more delicate to handle.  Goetta is more forgiving to cook, too.  Never had boudin; I'll have to look for it.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: euge on September 29, 2010, 06:05:22 AM
From wikipedia:

Quote
Scrapple, also known by the Pennsylvania Dutch name pon haus,[1][2] is traditionally a mush of pork scraps and trimmings combined with cornmeal and flour, often buckwheat flour, and spices.

But I just see a pack of it by the sausage locally. Never tried it but I will. Some say Boudin is an acquired taste or maybe too spicy. Far from the truth.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on September 29, 2010, 12:57:22 PM
Do you cook goetta and boudin the same way as scrapple?
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: gordonstrong on September 29, 2010, 03:17:30 PM
Slice it and fry it.  Goetta comes in a tube/roll like bulk sausage for patties, so you usually get them as round pieces looking like paler but crisper sausage patties.  Scrapple is usually in a block, so I guess it's more like fried cornmeal mush but with porky goodness.  The pieces are rectangular, usually.

I found one of the things to learn with scrapple is how to slice it so that it's still soft on the inside while the outside is crisp.  I remember ordering scrapple at a Baltimore restaurant when the NHC was there and getting something that was totally crisp, like a cracker.  Not nearly as good.  I'm guessing it's about 3/8" thick when sliced properly.  Too thick and it will fall apart when you try to flip it.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: bluesman on September 29, 2010, 03:24:05 PM
In 1926 two brothers from Bridgeville, Delaware founded the RAPA Scrapple manufacturing plant. The brothers were named Ralph Adams and Paul Adams.

The Original flavor of RAPA Scrapple has been around since the founding of the company. This famous recipe is moderately seasoned with a natural spice blend. It is cooked in cast iron kettles for the old-fashioned flavor that made RAPA famous!

Ingredients
Pork Stock, Pork Livers, Pork Fat, Pork Snouts, Corn Meal, Pork Hearts, Wheat Flour, Salt, Spices.

Back on topic:  I make a Potato Soup with Rivals recipe originally from Jeff Smith that is dyno-mite!
Love that stuff

 
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on September 29, 2010, 03:45:41 PM
Slice it and fry it.  Goetta comes in a tube/roll like bulk sausage for patties, so you usually get them as round pieces looking like paler but crisper sausage patties.  Scrapple is usually in a block, so I guess it's more like fried cornmeal mush but with porky goodness.  The pieces are rectangular, usually.

I found one of the things to learn with scrapple is how to slice it so that it's still soft on the inside while the outside is crisp.  I remember ordering scrapple at a Baltimore restaurant when the NHC was there and getting something that was totally crisp, like a cracker.   Not nearly as good.  I'm guessing it's about 3/8" thick when sliced properly.  Too thick and it will fall apart when you try to flip it.

It wasn't the Bel-Loc diner, was it? And yeah, 3/8" sounds about right. I would've said 1/2", but I never measured my scrapple that carefully.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: gordonstrong on September 29, 2010, 03:51:57 PM
Dunno.  It was awhile ago.  Walking distance from the conference hotel, maybe 5-10 minutes.  Seemed like an old-fashioned kind of greasy spoon diner.  Would have expected better from a place with that kind of vibe, unless that's some kind of local way of eating it. 
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on September 29, 2010, 04:37:02 PM
Baltimore usually sucks for scrapple.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: euge on September 29, 2010, 06:04:55 PM
Do you cook goetta and boudin the same way as scrapple?

Boudin is considered a sausage and presented in natural casings. I have seen it out of the casing. The sausages can be steamed, grilled, baked, smoked, and micro'd. I wouldn't boil it though. Don't know about Goetta, but looks and sounds similar to boudin.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: gordonstrong on September 29, 2010, 06:34:12 PM
Goetta isn't like a link sausage; it doesn't have a casing.  I just checked out the wikipedia entry for it; looks fairly accurate.  The picture on the top is pretty much how you buy it.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: Hokerer on September 29, 2010, 06:36:26 PM
17 different recipies for Chow Chow, though.

Yummm, Chow Chow.  Getting to be time to can up this season's batch.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: The Professor on September 29, 2010, 07:34:47 PM
Forget about that, where's your scrapple recipe?  It's a little hard to find around here, but we can get goetta.  Similar.

Love it!  Scrapple, Goetta (especially), Haggis...all great comfort food in my book.  I first discovered Goetta on a visit to Cincinnati  around 34 years ago. It's really easy to make at home too!

In the casing  type 'extended' sausage department, I've always  had a particular fondness for the Hungarian rice and meat sausage, Hurka (the meat therein usually being what some consider nasty bits...not me!).  It's a bit like Polish Kiska, though hasa looser texture.  The version of Hurka that  contains some  blood in the mix is actually rather like Boudin Noir.

 I'm eating less of this stuff than I once did, but when I do have any of these, I make my own from scratch and really savor every bit.

Gordon, I'll go through my dad's file and dig out his really fine scrapple recipe for you.  It really is about the best I ever had (though I guess I'm biased).   ;D
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on September 29, 2010, 08:00:16 PM
Now I want to make my own scrapple, dangit. We usually buy Jones. I'm pretty happy with that.

But seriously, if you've never had potato rivels, you should try it. One giant gloppy mess of gelatinous comfort food. With a pat of butter on top.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: capozzoli on September 29, 2010, 11:02:16 PM
You have to get a scrapple terrine to make scrapple right.

The Amish sell them up theres around Lancaster. I think they are about $100. It is porcelain iron rectangle with a really heavey lid that fits inside so to compress. I think you cook with that in a water bath in the oven.   
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tygo on September 29, 2010, 11:59:39 PM
I have a big freezer bag full of homemade scrapple my dad brought down the last time he came to visit.  He makes it about once a year.  I can still remember my grandparents cooking it up in a big iron kettle on butcher day every year.  I really need to get that recipe from him. 
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: capozzoli on September 30, 2010, 12:05:16 AM
I would love to see that recipe.

This recipe interesting. http://philadelphia.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?zi=1/XJ/Ya&sdn=philadelphia&cdn=citiestowns&tm=8&f=10&tt=14&bt=0&bts=0&zu=http%3A//www.recipesource.com/main-dishes/breakfast/00/rec0017.html

I remember being at the Amish wares store and they told me that you need this special terrine to make scrapple the  correct way. He was talking about the density.

MAybe they were just trying to pussh this stuff on the English tourists.   


Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on September 30, 2010, 12:39:44 AM
I would love to see that recipe.

This recipe interesting. http://philadelphia.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?zi=1/XJ/Ya&sdn=philadelphia&cdn=citiestowns&tm=8&f=10&tt=14&bt=0&bts=0&zu=http%3A//www.recipesource.com/main-dishes/breakfast/00/rec0017.html

I remember being at the Amish wares store and they told me that you need this special terrine to make scrapple the  correct way. He was talking about the density.

MAybe they were just trying to pussh this stuff on the English tourists.   
Yeah, that doesn't seem quite right. On the other hand, I always think about how my grandparents would have done something. Which is to say that if I had a bucket full of pig scraps, I wouldn't let a little thing like not having the proper equipment stop me.

Somewhat new topic: PA Dutch Pot Pie is hands-down the greatest comfort food ever.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tygo on September 30, 2010, 12:46:17 AM
I think my dad just uses bread loaf pans or something like that.  He does put something on top to press it down. Actually I recall the one year he used wax paper, pieces of cardboard, and bricks.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on September 30, 2010, 12:56:03 AM
I'd be interested in the recipe as well if you ever get around to digging it up.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: chumley on October 05, 2010, 03:26:20 PM
Any old part of the pig will do
The dick and the nipple and the toenail too
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: The Professor on October 05, 2010, 03:36:12 PM
You have to get a scrapple terrine to make scrapple right.

The Amish sell them up theres around Lancaster. I think they are about $100. It is porcelain iron rectangle with a really heavey lid that fits inside so to compress. I think you cook with that in a water bath in the oven.   

The special equipment is fine, but not really necessary.   I still use my late Dad's method....  a regular  loaf pan with a foil covered brick to compress my terrines, pates, and scrapple type stuff.  The brick just fits very nicely into the top of the loaf pan.     It works quite well and provides the required density to the finished product!
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: capozzoli on October 05, 2010, 07:38:55 PM
Makes more sense. I had one of those real expensive terrines a long time ago then stopped using it. Lost track of it.

I would love to see some of those pate recipes. Ive been meaning to get back into that.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: capozzoli on October 05, 2010, 09:27:37 PM
Dunno.  It was awhile ago.  Walking distance from the conference hotel, maybe 5-10 minutes.  Seemed like an old-fashioned kind of greasy spoon diner.  Would have expected better from a place with that kind of vibe, unless that's some kind of local way of eating it. 

Ill bet they were deep frying it and just over did it. It comes out well deep fried and you dont have to worry about flipping it. Deep fry it at the right temp and it comes out less greasy than pan frying.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: gordonstrong on October 06, 2010, 12:00:17 AM
Can't say.  Just figured they were cheap so they sliced it too thin and incompetent and cooked it too long.  Or cooked it on too high heat.  Either way, it was totally crisp.  Done properly, scrapple has this great texture contrast.  It's sort of like the breakfast version of creme brulee.

I'd worry about trying to deep fry it since it's so delicate.  I guess they can put it in the basket and then lower it into the oil, but that seems like a lot more work at a diner where they just toss everything on the flat top.

While at our best specialty grocer this past weekend, I did see some Jones Scrapple so I grabbed one.  The wife doesn't like it because she claims she once saw "pork face" on the list of ingredients.  I don't doubt it's in there; I doubt that it would be listed that way on the label.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: papasan on October 06, 2010, 12:36:00 AM
mmmmmmm ... haven't had scrapple since I was a kid.  I think I've got my mom's recipe somewhere.  And how 'bout some shoofly pie for dessert?
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: capozzoli on October 06, 2010, 01:58:35 AM
Oh man, I love pig face. I was at this party once and there was a pig roast. I got really smashed and was standing next to a bunch of friends, and the pig. I turned and grabbed the head approached it like I was going to kiss it then proceeded to bite the snout off, part of the face came off with it. It turned out to be really good.

But it was one of those things where you wake up the next day and remember some of the things you did the night before. I remembered my friends turning their backs on me and walking away. It was almost as bad as that time I got on the dance floor thinking I could dance like a Russian. People turned their backs on me then too, but that was probably more because I was kicking them then in disgust.

I dont drink that much anymore.

Here is a good PA dutch dish and I got this recipe from the horses mouth. (no I didnt use my teeth).

Apple Dumplings.

(http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll294/capozzoli_2008/appledumplings010.jpg)

(http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll294/capozzoli_2008/appledumplings015.jpg)

For two apples.

Start by cubing a stick of butter into 1/4" chunks then put them in a bowl in the freezer.

Select apples that are recommended for baking. I prefer Jersey Wine Saps,but I will use granny smith when the wine saps are not in season.

Peel and core your apples and place them into a bowl of slightly salted water and set them aside. 

Put the frozen butter cubes into a food processor with a cup or so of flour, a little salt and sugar. pulse the food processor till it makes tini peas of the flour and butter. Add more flour if it is to wet. Once it is like dry little pebbles turn the food processor on constant and immediately add a sprinkle or two of water. It should almost right away turn into a ball of dough. If not add another sprinkle but be careful not to add too much. Then take the dough bal out. It should still be kinda cold. If not form it into two balls and put the dough balls in the fridge for 25 - 20 mins.This is a good idea anyway.

Then roll the balls out into a circle big enough to wrap the apples. Set the apple onto the center of the dough, fill the core hole with brown sugar. Sprinkle on a little cinnamon and nut meg, top it with a pat of butter Then carefully wrap the dough around the apple bottom to top, make sure not to break the dough as you wrap cause the dough needs to form a 'bowl' around the apple to hold the melted juices. The idea is it will create a dramatic culinary moment when the dumpling is cut open and the warm buttery juices pour out.

Doesnt work so well with frozen store bought crust cause it doesn't provide as much buttery reverse osmosis as the above dough does. The juice leaks out and it gets ruined. But if you want to do it with store bought do them in a large muffin pan.

Now, just grab up the kids and get out to the orchards to pick a bushel of apples and a couple of pumpkins. Dont forget the corn maze either or the late season cabbage for makin kraut.  ;)

Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tschmidlin on October 06, 2010, 04:37:58 AM
While at our best specialty grocer this past weekend, I did see some Jones Scrapple so I grabbed one.  The wife doesn't like it because she claims she once saw "pork face" on the list of ingredients.  I don't doubt it's in there; I doubt that it would be listed that way on the label.
It may have been listed as pig cheeks or pork cheeks.  They're supposed to be tasty, but I've never (knowingly :) ) had them.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tschmidlin on October 06, 2010, 04:47:00 AM
Dont forget the corn maze either or the late season cabbage for makin kraut.  ;)
How often have you made kraut, and how much do you make at once?  I've read up on it, but haven't done it yet.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: capozzoli on October 06, 2010, 12:15:42 PM
I make it every year at this time.Been doing that for the last seven or eight years or so.

I make it as soon as the Amish start selling the late cabbages.They are gigantic,and loaded with sugar. That is why late cabbages work best.They have lots of sugar and juice to aid in the fermentation.

I pack a fermenting bucket with cabbage, granny smith apples and kosher salt.

(http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll294/capozzoli_2008/Pie004-4.jpg)

(http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll294/capozzoli_2008/Pie005-4.jpg)

(http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll294/capozzoli_2008/Pie008-2.jpg)

(http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll294/capozzoli_2008/Pie008-2.jpg)

(http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll294/capozzoli_2008/Pie010-1.jpg)
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tschmidlin on October 06, 2010, 03:48:46 PM
I make it every year at this time.Been doing that for the last seven or eight years or so.

I make it as soon as the Amish start selling the late cabbages.They are gigantic,and loaded with sugar. That is why late cabbages work best.They have lots of sugar and juice to aid in the fermentation.

I pack a fermenting bucket with cabbage, granny smith apples and kosher salt.
Do you just have these pictures lying around, or did you make kraut last night? :)

I might have to try it this year.  I need to find a container to do it in, and a place to do it . . . I can't imagine my wife will want it in the house, she doesn't even want a jar in the fridge.  :)
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: euge on October 06, 2010, 06:35:35 PM
Is that a specialized bucket for kraut? One of my bro's has an old heavy duty ceramic one he uses to store his canes in. Comes up to my knee.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tschmidlin on October 06, 2010, 07:33:01 PM
I've got one that sounds just like that euge, about 5 or 7 gallons or so, ceramic.  My wife's grandfather used to make wine in it.  That container would hold a bit more kraut than I want though.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: capozzoli on October 06, 2010, 07:35:26 PM
That is a pickling crock. The the two lips are for tying a rope around it to hold a cloth cover. Acts as a dust shield but lets it 'breath'. Pickling croks come in all different sizes some of them huge as do kraut crocks. Its not really made for sauerkraut they are a little different then these. You can tell the difference buy the lip. If it has a lip like above it is a pickling crock. If it has a channel about an inch wide and inch or so deep it is kraut crock. The kraut crocks go with a lid. The lid has a male lip that fits into the channel groove on top of the crock. The lid sits in the groove and then it is filled with water. The idea is that this creates a lock that lets gas out but does not let air in.

If your friend has a kraut crock they can be worth a LOT of money. If it still has the lid it will be worth even more.

Those picks are from a short run batch from last year I think. I can only get two or three heads in there. We usually make enough to last all winter and be able to give it away. I now fill a 7 gallon fermentation bucket. By the time it settles I end up with five- 6 gallons of kraut. It takes a month or so to be ready but gets only better if you leave it sit. I keep it in the basement and it does not smell that bad. After it is fermented completely it does not give off much gas. But if you want to you can wrap the bucket in a trash back and it will contain the odoriferous vapors.

If it lasts till after January we then vacuum pack or can what is left.  

Its easy to do.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tygo on October 07, 2010, 03:30:36 AM
What are the spices you have on the plate there.  Looks like maybe bay leaves, black peppercorns, and ???.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: capozzoli on October 07, 2010, 03:36:31 AM
Bay leaf, caraway seeds and Juniper berries.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tygo on October 07, 2010, 03:44:50 AM
Nice.  That makes sense.  I may need to give that a try.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: redbeerman on October 07, 2010, 05:19:03 PM
Living just south of Lancaster County and in an area where Amish farms abound, I have no reason to try to beat them at their own game, although my wife makes a killer potato filling. ;D  What I enjoy the most is the abundance of fresh meat and poultry available, awesome is all I can say.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tschmidlin on October 10, 2010, 06:43:35 AM
Stopped by the farmer's market today and picked up a bunch of stuff, including some cabbage to make kraut.  I've got a little over 5 lbs of it going now in a 3-gallon plastic bucket I got from Tillamook creamery a few years ago for a dollar. :)  5 lbs is not that much in a bucket that size.  The recipe I used has onions, bay leaves, peppercorns, cumin seed, dill seed, and cloves.  I hope the recipe turns out ok . . .

I've got another cabbage to do some smaller batches and test out some other spices, including a faster one that has szechuan peppercorns, soy sauce, sesame oil, and mirin.  Should be good.  I might do some kimchi too.

I'll also be fermenting some cucumbers, and doing some fridge pickles.  My wife likes beets and picked up a lot of them, so I'll probably pickle the ones she doesn't roast.

Here's the kraut . . . the liquid level is still rising, not quite where it needs to be yet.  The pics don't really show much, but here they are anyway.

(http://lh3.ggpht.com/_j-Iuc3I_JMk/TLFgCJsxuWI/AAAAAAAAAEU/Zz0jkinMUS8/IMG00146-20101009-2336.jpg)

(http://lh5.ggpht.com/_j-Iuc3I_JMk/TLFgCNOjhxI/AAAAAAAAAEY/O2xE3kA6tAs/IMG00147-20101009-2337.jpg)

Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: bluesman on October 10, 2010, 01:25:55 PM
Yea...it's about that time to make some kraut again.  I need to pick up some cabbage heads and prepare it...maybe next weekend.

Hey Tom...did you weigh your cabbage to salt additions?

For best results weigh the cabbage and the salt using a ratio of 40 pounds of cabbage to 1 (one) pound of salt.

Here's some tips I learned over the years.

This was taken from an online recipe but I certainly agree based on my experiences with kraut.

During the curing process, kraut requires daily attention. Remove scum as it forms and wash and scald the cloth often to keep it free from scum and mold and wipe the side of the crock. Fermentation will be complete in about three weeks. The kraut should be kept in a place where the temperature is in the mid 50s to low 60s. It needs just enough warmth to keep it working during the fermenting process. Yet not so hot that it will spoil.

Kraut works from the top down. To check to see if the kraut is ready wait about 2 weeks and dig down in the center of the kraut about 5 or 8 inches. Take a little out and taste it. The kraut should be firm but not crunchy and should have good kraut flavor. If it is not ready let it sit for a few more days and then taste it again.

The following is for canning the sauerkraut. As soon as kraut is thoroughly cured, pack into clean canning jars, adding enough of the kraut juice, or a weak brine made by dissolving 2 tablespoons salt to a quart of water, fill jars to with 1/2 inch of top of jar. Put on cap, screwing the band tight. Process in water bath for 15 minutes. This method cooks the kraut.

We use double bags (one bag inside of another) to pack the kraut in and then we put it in the freezer. When using this method to store the kraut you need to leave some space in the bags because the kraut will continue to ferment until it is frozen. (We learned this the hard way. Had Kraut spill out into the freezer. It really smelled.) By freezing the kraut it is fresh when taken out of the freezer and has not been cooked. I find that cooking the kraut with the pork chops on a low temperature for three hours it turns out the best. Kraut tastes good raw too.

It is not often that we add any sugar at the end of the cooking time but, sometimes if the kraut seems too sour we will add a little sugar.

The main thing is to measure your salt and weigh your cabbage. The ratio of 1 pound of salt to 40 pounds of cabbage is very important. To little salt will make the kraut spoil and to much salt will make the kraut to salty.

Hints: Weigh cabbage and salt to get the correct ratio. This is important. Keep in a temperature where the kraut will work yet not spoil. Check the kraut often and keep it clean. When the kraut is ready remove about the first inch of kraut from the top and throw it away. The top inch of the kraut usually is kind of soft. You may find that at some time during the fermenting process that there doesn't seem to be enough juice. Just add some plain water. Don't put any more salt in the kraut. The good thing about homemade kraut is that it does not have the preservatives that store bought kraut has.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tschmidlin on October 11, 2010, 01:21:45 AM
I weighed the cabbage, but measured the salt by volume.  I didn't do so much that I can dig down 5 or 6 inches, and removing the top inch or two would remove a lot of what I made. :)  If I'd used two or three times as much cabbage there would probably be enough liquid, but as it is I'm going to top it up with some brine.  I left it in the house overnight to kick off the fermentation, put I'm moving it to the garage tonight to finish.

Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: HydraulicSammich on October 11, 2010, 02:22:59 AM
Hey, guys

You're making this kraut process way to complicated IMO.   I just bottled mine and it is perfect.  IMO, leave out the spice!  Traditionally, simple is best, add spice as per the dish.  Use the ambient heat to your advantage.  Stomping the kraut is of prime importance.  Get the juice, break the fiber.  Medium handful of salt, no iodine, per three or four nine inch heads of late cabbage.  Use Danish Bald etc. Use a kraut cutter.  You can find these at any second hand store or antique shop.   I go six weeks.  Clean it every week or two.  Just get off the scum.  I have never had to add water.  Some at canning if need be.  Use a weight on top.  It must have down pressure.  This keeps water on top and a place for the scum to live.  That is about as simple as you can get.  I prefer to cold pack as opposed to freeze.  You can always start another pot this time of year and just leave it through the winter at near freezing.  Again, I prefer it cold packed.  This allows twice cooking.  Personal preference. 
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: capozzoli on October 11, 2010, 02:32:13 AM
Tom,sounds like masala kraut.  ;D

I dont measure the salt I just make sure the shredded kraut is well coated my mixing in a tub before packing into the crock. Never had any problems yet.

I never had to add water either, If you are short on juice something else is wrong.

The most important thing is that you get a brine when you compress it. The cabbage has to be covered with the juice.

The spices I use leave very little flavor, but I like it. It is a certain "pickle" note.

One thing I do is take the outer green leaves and back them on top of the grated cabbage. This creates another layer to protect the kraut below.

Another tip is to consider taking some of the nice outer leaves then pack them at the bottom of the kraut. This way you will end up with whole sauerkraut leaves for stuffing. Make some Romanian style stuffed kraut.

Also try deep fried sauerkraut it is fantastic.

Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tschmidlin on October 11, 2010, 02:56:44 AM
It does sound a bit like masala kraut. :)

I think the thing that's "wrong" is there just isn't that much cabbage for the diameter of the bucket.  If it was narrower or if I used more cabbage there would be plenty of juice, but the bucket is 9.5 inches across and the cabbage is only 3 inches deep.  I don't need to add much, there's about 3/4 inch of liquid over the cabbage and I'd like it to be more than an inch (just based on stuff I've read).
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on October 15, 2010, 03:38:12 PM
Sounds like the same way they make Tabasco sauce, which I failed miserably at a couple of years ago. I didn't quite understand the whole brine/scum thing.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: tschmidlin on October 15, 2010, 04:16:32 PM
I've made a quick lactic fermented hot sauce before.  I used jalapenos, and it had a little vinegar and salt added pre-ferment.  Ground it all up and put it in a jar.  I let it sit for three days on top of the fridge and a little layer formed that I stirred into the sauce, then I put it in the fridge.  It was excellent.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on October 15, 2010, 04:25:39 PM
Yeah, mine didn't end up with "a little layer." It ended up with a layer of mold that was on the verge of evolving sentience, electing a government, and plotting a crusade.

I used a similar technique, though. Next time I'm going with the "weighted down in a crock" method.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: bluesman on October 15, 2010, 04:28:50 PM
My father's side of the family are Pennsylvania Dutch (German).  There are many recipes I could post.

Here's one of my favorites.

WHOOPIE PIES
MAKES 3 DOZEN COOKIES

Cookies
3-1/2 cups all-purpose flour
1-1/2 cups unsweetened cocoa powder
1 teaspoon salt
1 tablespoon baking soda
1 teaspoon baking powder
1 cup (2 sticks) butter, softened to room temperature
2 cups granulated sugar
2 large eggs
2 cups buttermilk (see notes below)
2 teaspoons vanilla


Seven Minute Cream Filling

2 large egg whites
1-1/2 cups granulated sugar
Pinch of salt
1 teaspoon light corn syrup
1/4 teaspoon cream of tartar
5 tablespoons cold water
1 teaspoon vanilla

For the cookies: Preheat oven to 400° F. Line 2 large baking sheets with parchment paper. Into a large bowl, sift together the flour, cocoa, salt, baking soda, and baking powder. In another large bowl, cream the butter and sugar with an electric mixer until light and fluffy. Add the eggs, buttermilk and vanilla; beat until well-combined. Gradually add the dry ingredients, mixing after each addition until combined. Drop batter onto sheets by heaping tablespoons, about 3 inches apart, as they will spread. (I use a small scoop that is about a one tablespoon capacity. It makes dropping the batter much easier and more uniform.) Bake for about 12 minutes, or until the tops of the cookies spring back to the touch. Let cool slightly before removing to a cooling rack topped with parchment or waxed paper. Let cool completely. Meanwhile, make the filling.

For the filling: Place the eggs, sugar, salt, corn syrup, cream of tartar and cold water in a medium heatproof bowl or the top of a double boiler. Beat with a handheld electric mixer just until combined. Place the bowl over a pot of boiling water, being very careful to make certain that the bottom of the bowl is not touching the water. Beat with the mixer on high speed for 7 minutes. Remove from the pan and add the vanilla. Beat again until combined. To speed up the cooling process, place the bowl in a larger bowl of ice and water. Continue to beat until the filling is thick and cool.

To assemble: Spread cooled filling, about 1-1/2 tablespoons per cookie, on the bottom of half of the cookies. Top each with the remaining cookies. Sandwiches may be served immediately. If storing, wrap individually with plastic wrap or waxed paper, then place in storage bags. Store in the refrigerator for several days, or freeze in freezer bags for several months.

Here's an image I found on the internet but looks exactly like the kind my grandmother used to make when we were kids.

(http://blog.favorsinthecity.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/Whoopie.jpg)

I will make some and post pics some day.  :)
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: chumley on October 18, 2010, 09:48:12 PM
Whoopie Pies?  That image has singing Southern Culture on the Skids' "Camel Walk".........

"Little Debbie, Little Debbie...."
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: euge on October 19, 2010, 05:54:30 PM
Or Moon pies...

But that's a Southern thing (I think).
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: dak0415 on October 19, 2010, 06:37:40 PM
Nah! Moon pies are graham cracker-like covered in chocolate, best consumed with RC Cola!
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on October 19, 2010, 07:04:37 PM
Or Moon pies...

But that's a Southern thing (I think).

Those appalacians run farther north than most people think...
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: capozzoli on October 19, 2010, 09:26:23 PM
Looks like a Devil Dog to me.
Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: bluesman on October 19, 2010, 09:32:09 PM
A little history I found on the web...

A whoopie pie is like a sandwich, but made with two soft cookies with a fluffy white filling. Traditional whoopies pies are made with vegetable shortening, not butter. The original and most commonly made whoopie pie is chocolate. but cooks like to experiment, and today pumpkin whoopie pies are a favorite seasonal variation.

The recipe for whoopie pies has its origins with the Amish, and in Lancaster county, Pennsylvania, it is not uncommon to find roadside farm stands offering these desserts. Amish cooking is about old recipes that have fed families for generations, with no trendy or cross-cultural fusions or mixtures. These cake-like whoopie pies were considered a special treat because they were originally made from leftover batter. According to Amish legend, when children would find these treats in their lunch bags, they would shout "Whoopie!"

Main's earliest claim is from the Labadie's Bakery in Lewiston, Massachusetts. They first started selling Whoopie Pies in 1925 with the opening of their bakery. The Labadie's Bakery remains in the same location today.

The Berwick Cake Company of Roxbury, Massachusetts, also manufactured “Whoopee pies” since at least 1931. Some think that Berwick’s pies actually date to 1927. Berwick closed its Roxbury plant in 1977.

Title: Re: PA Dutch
Post by: MrNate on November 23, 2011, 06:44:22 AM
I recently was informed that the secret to my grandma's scrapple was that she used short ribs.