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Other than Brewing => All Things Food => Topic started by: oscarvan on November 30, 2010, 05:53:43 am

Title: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: oscarvan on November 30, 2010, 05:53:43 am
I've been making bread for a while. Nothing exotic, just my one or two loaves of whole wheat, a recipe I've been tweaking for a few decades. It's down to minimal work for maximum result. If someone is interested:

O's bread.... Makes two loaves:

3 cups water 115º
2 TBSP yeast.

Mix.

add:

2 cups unbleached all purpouse flour
4 TBSP molasses
4 TBSP = 1/2 stick melted butter
2 TSP salt

mix until homogenous.

add:

3 cups whole wheat flour
1 cup all purpose unbleached flour
1+ cup rolled oats.

Knead and knead...... Put in 2 greased bread pans (I use PAM) and rise in 95º oven for 45 minutes AND doubled in size. Turn heat up to 350º and bake for 40 minutes.

Remove, let cool and eat.

Now, I have always wanted to get just a hair more fluff, but if I add more yeast it gets, well, too yeasty. Getting involved in this beer thing I am suddenly immersed in a whole world of the care and feeding of yeast. In fact, an Erlenmeyer and stir plate are in the mail..... ;D But, that got me to thinking. Would it make sense to wake up my bread yeast in the Erlenmeyer and aerate it for 10 or 15 minutes? Would I get the yeasties more "pumped"? Anyone played with stir plates and bread yeast?
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: stlaleman on November 30, 2010, 06:05:21 am
To get more "fluff" in bread, you have to excite the gluten, not the yeast. Try making bread when you are really pissed off, the extra hard pounding you give the dough while kneading will make for better bread.
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: oscarvan on November 30, 2010, 06:17:22 am
To get more "fluff" in bread, you have to excite the gluten, not the yeast. Try making bread when you are really pissed off, the extra hard pounding you give the dough while kneading will make for better bread.

Meet "hobie"......that's a 1/8th horsepower pounding, but, your point is taken.

(http://www.woodenshoemusic.com/PicPages/Linkto_files/PB200007.jpg)
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: beerocd on November 30, 2010, 07:24:44 pm
Would it make sense to wake up my bread yeast in the Erlenmeyer and aerate it for 10 or 15 minutes? Would I get the yeasties more "pumped"? Anyone played with stir plates and bread yeast?

You use a stir plate to build up the yeast - "grow more" of it. Bread yeast is SO cheap I can't see any benefit of it. A brick of red star yeast is less than $4 at costco or sams. Are you shooting for wonderbread fluff? They inject air into their dough.


Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: oscarvan on November 30, 2010, 09:20:31 pm
No, I will not be looking to match the Doughboy..... OK, more yeast in the next loaves.
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: beerocd on December 01, 2010, 05:30:06 am
No, I will not be looking to match the Doughboy..... OK, more yeast in the next loaves.

You know, too much yeast can destroy your bread too. I think maybe look at your proofing to improve your bread.
Also how do you bake it? I use a cast iron dutch oven, but I'm not shooting for soft and fluffy so much.
How about a pic of the bread? Loaf and sliced so we can see the crust and the crumb.
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: oscarvan on December 01, 2010, 06:31:44 am
(http://www.woodenshoemusic.com/PicPages/Linkto_files/P1140001.jpg)
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: beerocd on December 01, 2010, 06:27:20 pm
(http://www.woodenshoemusic.com/PicPages/Linkto_files/P1140001.jpg)

My whole wheat out of the bread machine is like that unless I add vital wheat gluten. Then I get a better rise.
Not that I'm criticizing; you wanted more lift. Looks good, dense - like real bread. :)
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: oscarvan on December 02, 2010, 03:20:42 am
AHA! That's a new one on me...... I will try it.

http://www.arrowheadmills.com/product/vital-wheat-gluten
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: euge on December 02, 2010, 11:35:34 am
Looking at your pic and recipe. For more "fluff" use bread flour or add gluten, make sure it is nice and sticky and slash the top of the loaf before you put it in the oven.

I see classic "all purpose" crumb and rise in those pics.
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: MrNate on December 02, 2010, 12:22:31 pm
I'm a novice, but what seems to be holding true is that bread flour, long knead time, and not overrising make for the best rise. When I do it that way I get all the oven spring my oven can handle. I knead by hand for about 30-45 minutes, and usually throw a few good jabs in there. It's good GnP training.

I'll post pictures next time I bake, since I have this nifty new phone and all.  ;D
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: oscarvan on December 02, 2010, 09:55:05 pm
Looking at your pic and recipe. For more "fluff" use bread flour or add gluten, make sure it is nice and sticky and slash the top of the loaf before you put it in the oven.

I see classic "all purpose" crumb and rise in those pics.

More good advice......thanks.
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: oscarvan on December 10, 2010, 07:56:43 pm
OK, I put Gluten in there in todays loaves. And it came out perfect...... too perfect. Like the crap you buy at the supermarket.....minus the list of unpronounceables.....I think I miss my somewhat underbubbled bread. Hmmmm........
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: James Lorden on December 13, 2010, 07:56:30 am
Another question, in the old days the brewer and the baker were best friends.

Anyone have any idea of measurements that could be used for using yeast from the bottom of the fermenter in place of those packets of dry yeast?
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: oscarvan on December 13, 2010, 06:32:38 pm
Ooooooohhhh, make bread with the yeast cake! Does that work?
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: euge on December 13, 2010, 07:45:13 pm
Ooooooohhhh, make bread with the yeast cake! Does that work?

It's the same yeast, just a different strain.
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: denny on December 14, 2010, 08:51:07 am
Ooooooohhhh, make bread with the yeast cake! Does that work?

It works, but not as well as bread yeast IMO.
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: oscarvan on December 15, 2010, 08:14:18 pm
OK, made bread today..... Put in a little Gluten..... (half of the recommended 4tsp/loaf) That's about right, they came out larger than before, but still had that solid feel to them. I'm happy.
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: denny on December 15, 2010, 08:15:39 pm
Wow, 4 tsp/loaf is a metric buttload!  (That's a technical baking phrase).  I use a TBSP. for about 3 lb. of flour (4 baguettes).
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: beerocd on December 15, 2010, 08:26:26 pm
Wow, 4 tsp/loaf is a metric buttload!  (That's a technical baking phrase).  I use a TBSP. for about 3 lb. of flour (4 baguettes).

So what's that, like 1.6 regular buttloads? I'm not so good at metric.  :-\
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: oscarvan on December 15, 2010, 09:24:12 pm
Well, there's about 1.65 pounds in one of my loaves....and there's 3 tsp in a tbsp....... so the box suggests 1.25 tbsp in a loaf. Yup that's more than you are using. So, my half and your dosage seems to be about the same.
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: tschmidlin on December 15, 2010, 10:00:00 pm
oscar, you're using 4 tsp per 1.65 lbs, so 1 tsp / .4 lbs.

Denny is using 3 tsp per 3 lbs, so 1 tsp / 1 lb.

So you're using 2.5x the amount as Denny. ;)
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: euge on December 16, 2010, 12:27:14 am
Isn't a metric buttload 5.33 regular buttloads?
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: oscarvan on December 16, 2010, 07:23:04 am
oscar, you're using 4 tsp per 1.65 lbs, so 1 tsp / .4 lbs.

Denny is using 3 tsp per 3 lbs, so 1 tsp / 1 lb.

So you're using 2.5x the amount as Denny. ;)

Except that I cut the recommended dosage in half so now I'm at 1.25 X what Denny is using, which is pretty much the same........which is what I think I said, or at least was trying to say. ???
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: tschmidlin on December 16, 2010, 09:54:16 am
oscar, you're using 4 tsp per 1.65 lbs, so 1 tsp / .4 lbs.

Denny is using 3 tsp per 3 lbs, so 1 tsp / 1 lb.

So you're using 2.5x the amount as Denny. ;)

Except that I cut the recommended dosage in half so now I'm at 1.25 X what Denny is using, which is pretty much the same........which is what I think I said, or at least was trying to say. ???
Got it.  These things get hard to track ;D
Title: Re: Bread/Yeast question.
Post by: Slowbrew on December 16, 2010, 10:14:51 am
Can someone equate Metric Butt Loads to Libraries of Congress for me?

Just seeing if any reads Slashdot.   8)

Paul