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General Category => Zymurgy => Topic started by: oscarvan on January 17, 2011, 11:27:18 PM

Title: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: oscarvan on January 17, 2011, 11:27:18 PM
I want to brew that for a friend. But, I would like to start simple and make two changes.

First I would like to do a single infusion and batch sparge......any great loss in that? Suggested temp?

Secondly, my friend is not THAT much of a hop head, so I was thinking about reducing the bittering hops by 50% to get to about 40 HBU....

Am I thinking straight?
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: oscarvan on January 21, 2011, 05:08:48 PM
Anyone home?  ;D
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: Slowbrew on January 21, 2011, 05:47:36 PM
Anyone home?  ;D

No experience on this topic but I think a single infusion in the lower end of the temp range should work reasonably well.

My concern would be the fact that it isn't really a gluten free beer but rather a it's a very low gluten beer.  One of my sisters-in-law (sister-in-laws ?, I can't remember today) has celiacs, as do her 2 kids.  She runs a gluten free bakery in Colorado and is adamant that any gluten is too much gluten.  Before you go through the effort to brew it you probably want to make sure your friend is willing to drink it.

If you do and your friend doesn't have any issues with it, please let us know.  My brother has been looking for a good recipe for a few years now.

Paul
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: oscarvan on January 21, 2011, 08:34:12 PM
Yup, my bud is willing to try, and if after the first few it turns out it's a no go......well, I'll sacrifice myself and drink it.
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: Mark G on January 21, 2011, 11:03:07 PM
Yup, my bud is willing to try, and if after the first few it turns out it's a no go......well, I'll sacrifice myself and drink it.
You sir, are a true gentleman.  ;)
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: gsandel on January 29, 2011, 06:07:07 PM
So what do you think of it from a perspective of a regular gluten consumer....is it worth drinking or making for the hell of it?
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: euge on January 29, 2011, 07:12:28 PM
You should probably only make a couple gallons at first. My experiences with gluten free beer is that they are terrible. The large amount of hops in Papazian's recipe probably makes up for some sins. Yes, I've been reading it too...

Suppose you just take it as an inspiration and craft your own. Seems to me the Clearex is an integral part of the recipe.
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: oscarvan on January 31, 2011, 01:30:13 AM
Haven't made it  yet..... on the list. Will be part of a social get together.
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: denny on January 31, 2011, 04:33:12 PM
I've had a number of gluten free beers from a friend who's hoping to to open a gluten free brewery.  I have to admit that none of them were anything I'd choose to drink if I didn't have to.
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: Slowbrew on January 31, 2011, 05:38:47 PM
I've had a number of gluten free beers from a friend who's hoping to to open a gluten free brewery.  I have to admit that none of them were anything I'd choose to drink if I didn't have to.

That's been my take on them too.

Paul
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: tschmidlin on January 31, 2011, 06:38:10 PM
I think the mistake comes from trying to make something taste like something it's not.  Like trying to make tofu taste like meat - it doesn't work and is just disappointing, but tofu as tofu is great.

So make gluten free drinks, and don't try to make them taste exactly like beer.  They should taste good in their own right.  Just my take on it.
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: euge on January 31, 2011, 06:45:04 PM
I think the mistake comes from trying to make something taste like something it's not.  Like trying to make tofu taste like meat - it doesn't work and is just disappointing, but tofu as tofu is great.

So make gluten free drinks, and don't try to make them taste exactly like beer.  They should taste good in their own right.  Just my take on it.

That's spot on IMO.  But, therein lies the difficulty. Perhaps a secondary fermentation or infusion with fresh fruit would be a welcome enhancer for this type of beer.

Mmmmm apricots...
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: oscarvan on February 01, 2011, 01:43:45 AM
Well, ordered a vial of Ferm-ex today. We'll see how this pans out.
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: dean on February 07, 2011, 11:42:12 PM
I think the mistake comes from trying to make something taste like something it's not.  Like trying to make tofu taste like meat - it doesn't work and is just disappointing, but tofu as tofu is great.

So make gluten free drinks, and don't try to make them taste exactly like beer.  They should taste good in their own right.  Just my take on it.

Sounds good to me that way... maybe I'll have to give it a try and see what comes of it.  I remember my Dad talked about using sorghum to make beer way back in the day.  At the time I was only about 12 or so and used to make a mash and dump it on old stumps letting it soak in... deer bait.    ;D
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: gmac on February 08, 2011, 04:43:27 PM
Please keep us up to date. I've got a friend in the same boat and if this works for you, I'll be giving it a try.
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: oscarvan on February 08, 2011, 06:48:08 PM
Will do..... still trying to get caught up on "regular" beers....
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: oscarvan on March 31, 2011, 12:00:01 AM
Well....... I brewed another batch, this time with fresh yeast and the Fermex pitched perfectly as per instructions. Unfortunately the test this afternoon showed a "high positive". Very frustrating. The good news is that I stumbled upon a lively discussion on the subject here:

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f164/

I think I will have to rethink the MO and abandon the "real beer gluten removed" concept....

Charlie, if you're listening, please weigh in.
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: oscarvan on April 04, 2011, 12:21:11 AM
Hold on, there may be hope. On brew day I made 10g, one bucket to be gf the other normal. There was some confusion as to which was which when it came to labeling them..... I have ordered more tests....
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: oddtodd on June 28, 2011, 12:55:28 AM
Sorry to bring up an old thread, but this topic really interests me. Just wanted to share some results and see if anyone else had gotten any.

I made a molasses porter about 5 weeks ago, split the wort into two fermenters, one of which got Clarity Ferm and the other did not. I went through the bottling process and about 2 weeks after bottling I had some samples tested at the same lab Papazian used. (Not that I don't trust him, I just have to see it for myself.) The results were kind of surprising to me. The porter with the Clarity-Ferm had a gluten content of < 5ppm, or basically undetectable. The control porter (without Clarity-Ferm) had a gluten content of 14.2 ppm. I expected a much higher gluten content in the control porter. (On a side note, when you have samples tested, it is important to specify you want a barley gluten test, which I did. Apparently barley gluten may report lower concentrations when wheat gluten standards are used.)

I guess the good news is that the Clarity-Ferm seems to effectively reduce the gluten content. I bet the actual content is quite nearly zero. No difference in taste or anything between the two samples either.

One thing I should mention however, I still brew with extracts and specialty grain (although I still steeped about a pound and a half of barley for 45 minutes in this recipe). Upon further research it seems that the process of making extracts may remove a good deal of the gluten. My results may not prove anything for all grain brewers, but for those looking for a way to make a barley based gluten free beer, extract and Clarity Ferm seems successful. I am not sure if Papazian has had a sample of his Slithy Tove tested without Clarity Ferm. Anyone done an all-grain batch and gotten results?
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: corkybstewart on June 28, 2011, 03:42:04 AM
Good bump.  I have a friend who turned up gluten intolerant a few months ago and she's been bummed about it.  At our local grocery store I found some sorghum beers and showed her where to find them.  Today at the gym she told me one of them is really very good so I make try to brew her a batch.  Has anybody all grained a sorghum beer or have any experience at all with sorghum?
Title: Re: Charlie's gluten free recipe....
Post by: Kit B on June 29, 2011, 03:02:04 PM
Good bump.  I have a friend who turned up gluten intolerant a few months ago and she's been bummed about it.  At our local grocery store I found some sorghum beers and showed her where to find them.  Today at the gym she told me one of them is really very good so I make try to brew her a batch.  Has anybody all grained a sorghum beer or have any experience at all with sorghum?

I made a sorghum beer, using the following recipe:

6.6# White Sorghum Extract (from Midwest Supplies)
1# Dark Candi Sugar
4 oz Molasses
1.5 oz Horizon - 45 min
.5 oz Horizon - 20 min
1 oz Fuggles - 20 min
1 oz Cascade - 5 min
White Labs WLP001 California Ale Yeast

Initially, it tasted like pink grapefruit...Not in a good way, either.
It was quite over-powering & not easy to drink.
After aging it for a couple months, it became drinkable.
My friend that can't have gluten said it was great.
I thought it was okay, in comparison to the commercial gluten-free beers.
IMHO Bards & Redbridge are both disgusting crap.
My recipe is very close in flavor to Redbridge, but my friend & I think it is superior.

I'm currently experimenting with Clarity Ferm & my friend has volunteered to be a test subject.