Homebrewers Association | AHA Forum

Other than Brewing => The Pub => Topic started by: blatz on December 04, 2009, 08:10:36 PM

Title: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: blatz on December 04, 2009, 08:10:36 PM
My wife forced me to watch Food Inc. last weekend. 

One word.  WOW.

If you have any inkling of wonder or curiousity about where your food comes from, you should watch this film. 

I know I personally complained about the cost when my wife has us buy everything organic and from farmer's markets, etc.  Never again.  And I can't say never as the situation may dictate, but I will try to never eat at a fast food restaurant again.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: denny on December 04, 2009, 08:17:56 PM
Blatz PM'ed me to see if I thought this topic would be too political and offered to delete it if it was.  At this point, I'm willing to let the post stay.  Please be courteous and respectful in your discussion, or it'll be gone in the blink of an eye!

Personally, we either grow a large % of the veg we eat, or buy organic, local stuff.  Chicken is about the only meat we eat, and we buy locally raised (within a few miles, actually) chicken.  Besides any potential environmental or health benefits, it simply tastes better to me.  I eat fast food only maybe 2-3 times a year when I'm stuck at work with a short break and have no other choice.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: ndcube on December 04, 2009, 08:19:01 PM
So it's about general food from the grocery store like regular canned corn vs orgranic canned corn or mainly about fast food?
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: dbeechum on December 04, 2009, 08:40:49 PM
So it's about general food from the grocery store like regular canned corn vs orgranic canned corn or mainly about fast food?

Its real focus is the giant scale industrial food production system we have going in this country, both meat and veg. If you've read any Michael Pollan (The Omnivore's Dilemma), it won't  come as any surprise. (Particularly since he was a consultant and narrator as was Eric Schlosser - author of Fast Food Nation)

On the one hand you can see it as a scathing indictment of the impact of the whole massive "cheap" food chain we have going here and on the other you can see it as yet another "hippie" attack on American businesses.

Personally, I think what's happening in food is scary from a health, ecological and even flavor perspective. About the one good thing you can say is: "at least it's cheap!"
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: blatz on December 04, 2009, 08:51:04 PM
So it's about general food from the grocery store like regular canned corn vs orgranic canned corn or mainly about fast food?

thanks denny - I hope we can keep it from being derailed (and deleted).

ndcube - its actually about both - its really amazing to see how the advent of fast food has driven the industrial manufacturing of food, meat in particular.  but as a result of the powerful hand of fast food, it has also changed the way the food is grown that we buy at the local grocery store.  

unfortunately, this change has made the wrong food choices very cheap (dollar menu at McDs) and has forced the hand, so to speak, of a lot of lower income families.  the increasing frequency of diabetes is one negative result.

I'm going to check out Omnivore's Dilemma and Fast Food Nation next - the authors of those books contributed/narrated the movie.

I encourage everyone to at least watch it - and take what you want away from it.  I know I personally am very concerned about what I eat, so this has naturally swayed me in one direction, but others may have a different perspective.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: ndcube on December 04, 2009, 08:59:14 PM
Yeah, for example I saw a show on discovery about how they raise chickens/turkeys in mass quantities which was not too pleasant (I won't go into details).  On the other hand my Thanksgiving turkey was something like 29 cents a pound.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: tubercle on December 04, 2009, 09:01:28 PM
My wife forced me to watch Food Inc. last weekend. 

One word.  WOW.

If you have any inkling of wonder or curiousity about where your food comes from, you should watch this film. 

I know I personally complained about the cost when my wife has us buy everything organic and from farmer's markets, etc.  Never again.  And I can't say never as the situation may dictate, but I will try to never eat at a fast food restaurant again.

 

 It's on Netflix if anyone's interested.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: a10t2 on December 04, 2009, 09:02:37 PM
If it's any consolation, when we run out of oil in a few years everyone will be eating local.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: Kaiser on December 04, 2009, 09:09:22 PM
I too am concerned about what I’m eating as well although we don’t buy much organic stuff for financial reasons.

I’m more concerned with where this is heading. The problem is that market forces themselves won’t correct the problem of overly cheap food. For that to happen, food needs to be priced correctly. I.e. producers of food that promotes health problems should pick up part of the future health care bill. If ground beef was $10/lb, many of us would reconsider having it as often as we do. And if the tax that makes it so expensive would be based on its fat content then you would see that the lean beef would be cheaper and farmers might have a stronger incentive to raise leaner cows and pigs.

In the end this means more government intervention with more taxes on things. I do understand that that is something that is not very popular with many but how else can we move the industry into a sustainable direction.

By nature we humans love to eat. It’s only our consciousness that helps us make the right choices.

Kai



Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: bluesman on December 04, 2009, 09:43:51 PM
I'll have to check it out. It's not a blood bath type film...? I can't watch the slaughtering of livestock...it makes me ill.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: beerocd on December 04, 2009, 09:47:21 PM
farmers might have a stronger incentive to raise leaner cows and pigs.

NOoooooooooo! (Just being dramatic) Bring back the heritage breeds before they were laboratized into what they are today. We don't need leaner meat, we need natural meat,grassfed, pasture raised ( not pasturized or irradiated) :D . Eat smaller portions of the real, natural item that is way more nutritous and we'll all be fine. If everybody chose the correct foods, the market would adjust. Unfortunately - cheap and plentiful is hard to get away from.

Fat is not bad for you. The wrong type of fat is, and for that matter too much of anything is not good for you.

-OCD
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: tubercle on December 04, 2009, 09:57:53 PM
I'll have to check it out. It's not a blood bath type film...? I can't watch the slaughtering of livestock...it makes me ill.

  No, its not really that but it touches on the topic somewhat but more from a perspective of quantity over quality.

  This film is basically about the fact that there are just a few top players that control the entire commercial food market and profit trumps safety and quality.

  The Corporate America way of business in a nutshell.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: dbeechum on December 04, 2009, 10:01:25 PM
Bring back the heritage breeds before they were laboratized into what they are today.

Absolutely... on this. I like the Pollan philosophy of "proper" eating - "Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants."

And hertiage breeds are part of that. Of course, I ain't quite there yet.

The problem with cheap and easy is most folks (including myself) don't exercise (or have) much more control over the food intake process than our beloved dogs do. Cheap and easy just makes it easier to shovel more and more calories down your gullet.

Another great read is "Mindless Eating" - That book is based on the reasearch of the Cornell and Brand Lab. Among some of the experiments they've run is the "endless soup bowl" that hooks a soup bowl up to a pot of soup that invisibly refills as a person eats. The results of comparing how much soup people ate (both with the endless bowl and without) and how "satisfied" they felt were astonishing.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: beerocd on December 04, 2009, 10:42:02 PM


Another great read is "Mindless Eating" - That book is based on the reasearch of the Cornell and Brand Lab. Among some of the experiments they've run is the "endless soup bowl" that hooks a soup bowl up to a pot of soup that invisibly refills as a person eats. The results of comparing how much soup people ate (both with the endless bowl and without) and how "satisfied" they felt were astonishing.


I had a similar epiphany recently with wine glasses. I want 2 glasses of wine when I have some wine. I don't drink very fast or with the intention of getting sloshed but 1 glass seems wrong - 2 just right. I switched from the modern Reidel glasses that could hold half a bottle plus - to some european crystal glasses that are WAY smaller. I'm still happy with 2 glasses of wine.

-OCD
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: dbeechum on December 04, 2009, 10:50:31 PM
I'm still happy with 2 glasses of wine.

Yeah, that's exactly the sort of thing he talks about doing. We apparently make about 250 eating/drinking choices through the day, about 20 more than we did in the 50's-60's. By a choice he means the idea of "yes I'll have a hersey's kiss". His argument is that for healthy eating (calorically speaking) we should really onl y focus on dropping 200-300 calories a day from those bad choices.

Another study in the book that cracked me up. They went and put candy dishes in an office at the secretaries desks and filled them with a known number of hersey's kisses. Each evening they came back in and measured the number eaten and refilled the dishes. They experimented with placement and effect on quantity eaten. No big surprise then that the most were eaten when they were right on the desk. Fewer when moved to arm's length and radically fewer when placed at 6 feet away. All of these subtle things including dish size (he mentions how much bigger dishes have become since the 70's too) affect our food decisions.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: denny on December 04, 2009, 11:14:13 PM
I just read an article that talked about how dinner plates have gone from 9" to 11-12" over the last 30 years.  Using a 9" plate pretty much cuts your calories in half since you can't get as much food on it.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: Pawtucket Patriot on December 04, 2009, 11:49:32 PM
I'm currently reading The Omnivore's Dilemma and just watched a documentary called King Corn (with brief commentary my Michael Pollan).  It is definitely eye opening, to say the least.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: capozzoli on December 05, 2009, 02:08:00 AM
Has anyone mentioned "Our Daily Bread"?

That one is really interesting. No narration makes it spooky, almost like a science fiction movie. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozhr__b8OYc

Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: pdbreen on December 05, 2009, 02:47:28 AM
.. just watched a documentary called King Corn (with brief commentary my Michael Pollan).  It is definitely eye opening, to say the least. 

Saw King Corn the other night (Netflix streaming is awesome!).  Interesting to learn that most of the corn that is being grown is totally inedible.  And, since "Super Size Me", it's been pretty easy to avoid the fast food meals.

Looking forward to watching Food, Inc. 
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: majorvices on December 05, 2009, 02:20:43 PM
I'm a pretty healthy eater (and, like Blatz, one of those fitness knucklehead guys). My big beef is with highly processed foods and I try to limit, as much as possible, the amount of processed food I eat everyday. I mostly eat fruits, vegetables and nuts all day long and then I eat one actual meal a day at supper time. I mostly stay away from breads and sugars (except sometimes a little in my coffee) and mostly avoid anything with more than two or three  ingredients in the label during the day. And, during the week that includes beer. I drink very little alcohol, often none, Monday thru Friday.

At night we try to eat organic, but it simply isn't possible to feed a family of four entirely organic. And my youngest son has a penchant for Kraft Mac and Cheese (and I admit, it can be quite tasty when paired with fish and broccoli  ;) ). I also sometimes get a craving for a McDonald's Hamburger - usually only two or three times a year, but when it happens I simply have to have one and I really don't care how that sucker is made as long as no one has spit in it or dropped it on the floor (be nice to people at restaurants - always!).

I don't exactly know what my point is, but I guess it has something to do with making healthy choices as much as possible during the day - but you gotta eat and you gotta feed the family too and sometimes you are just going to have to put something on the table that might not be 100% good for you, or might be made in a factory. At this point we are a one income family and we hit Costco for most of our meat purchases and it crosses my mind every time I buy a pack of chicken there how much junk those chicken are loaded up with, but it does taste good on the grill and I haven't grown a third eye yet.

Stay away from sugars and highly processed food and make most of your food yourself and you are doing better than most Americans. But a frozen pizza from time to time isn't going to hurt you any, even if that pepperoni has more ingredients than stars in the sky.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: a10t2 on December 05, 2009, 02:38:59 PM
Bring back the heritage breeds before they were laboratized into what they are today. We don't need leaner meat, we need natural meat,grassfed, pasture raised ( not pasturized or irradiated) :D . Eat smaller portions of the real, natural item that is way more nutritous and we'll all be fine.

+ As many as I'm allowed. Fun fact: grass-fed beef has about the same Omega-3 ratio as salmon.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: blatz on December 05, 2009, 03:16:08 PM
Keith's got some really good advice there, as do a lot of the posts.

And I think I may have been a little too extreme before when I said I want to start buying everything organic- its just not possible to buy everything organic - but I am trying to be a lot more conscious of what I get, whereas I scoffed at my wife before when she insisted.   The ironic thing is where I live, outside of places like Costco, the organic stuff isn't that much higher priced than conventional (was at the store last night - difference for a ribeye was $2 per lb) - and that premium isn't too bad when you only have one meat eater in the house (well, the dogs are but don't count).

It'd be nice if the Costcos/Sams would start carrying organic.  Perhaps hey might one day.

Oh and I have a sore spot for KM&C too, Keith, but with fish and broccoli??

Interesting note on the Omega-3s.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: beerocd on December 05, 2009, 04:59:31 PM


It'd be nice if the Costcos/Sams would start carrying organic.  Perhaps hey might one day.

Oh and I have a sore spot for KM&C too, Keith, but with fish and broccoli??

Interesting note on the Omega-3s.

Costco ORGANIC Broccoli is from.....    CHINA
Omega3 comes largely from GREEN PLANTS. So grass fed animals are full of Omega 3's. Grains are Omega6; feedlot animals are full of that VS the 3's. "We" eat feedlot animals mostly and LOTS of grain - we are mostly full of Omega6. Unbalanced.

-OCD

Disclaimer: I don't want to incorrectly portray myself as one of those who eats properly. Knowing and doing are two different things entirely.


Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: a10t2 on December 05, 2009, 05:17:33 PM
The other thing that's important to remember is that when the USDA started talking about implementing an "organic" label in the early 90s, the industry lobbyists went to work and the final standard was neutered so much that it's essentially meaningless, especially for livestock. It tells you basically nothing about what the animals were fed or their living conditions.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: denny on December 05, 2009, 05:36:57 PM
We're fortunate here in OR to have an organization that does organic certification to higher standards than the fed regs.

http://www.tilth.org/
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: lonnie mac on December 05, 2009, 10:14:42 PM
Just to let yall know where I stand, I personally do not think that there are enough Pancho's Mexican restaurants in America today! If we can ALL go out and eat tonight at a Pancho's Mexican restaurant, maybe they will build more Pancho's Mexican restaurants, and I won't have to drive like 5 miles to one!!

So with that said, I have read this thread and it honestly has me thinking about the way I eat. Man I am a fast food junky. Breakfast, or lunch at micky D's, supper at DQ, I don't care... Whatever will get me back to work the fastest.

Shopping with Moonbeam this afternoon, she thought I was nuts! I was running around the whole store looking for organic stuff! Our Krogers has a pretty good supply of which apparently, I usually have avoided!

So the stuff is not really cheap but that is a given. We don't pay farmers to grow good foods after all, we pay them to grow fast foods... Guess I realize that.

So tonight is the following...

A gallon of some cool organic whole milk... Moonbeam took this and made a pound of Mozzarella cheese in less than an hour!

Homemade cheese and organic Ritz... Ok...

I went for the good beef as I usually do though when I Q. Apparently some good grass fead, but that's not too hard to find here in Tehas...

Some home grown potatoes, zucchini all from some organic shelf, (I hope)

And some homemade bread from some spent grains and using the whey left over from the cheese she made...

Gawd I feel good! Really, I really do! I don't hardly ever concern myself with what I eat on a daily basis. But when I stop and think, and add up what it is that I eat, I should pay much more attention to it...
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: denny on December 05, 2009, 10:58:19 PM
Where I live, organic/natural/local is the norm.  But there's nothing like having a heart attack to make you rethink how and what you eat!
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: lonnie mac on December 05, 2009, 11:28:43 PM
Where I live, organic/natural/local is the norm.  But there's nothing like having a heart attack to make you rethink how and what you eat!

I think I know what you mean my friend. Haven't had one yet but I am working on it! :)

Yea, you know I will be eating that little fat tip off of my ribeye first as usual!
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: denny on December 05, 2009, 11:41:28 PM
Where I live, organic/natural/local is the norm.  But there's nothing like having a heart attack to make you rethink how and what you eat!

I think I know what you mean my friend. Haven't had one yet but I am working on it! :)

Take my advice and try to avoid it....it's not all it's cracked up to be!  ;)
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: beerocd on December 05, 2009, 11:53:24 PM
Man I am a fast food junky.
Shopping with Moonbeam this afternoon, she thought I was nuts! I was running around the whole store looking for organic stuff!

A gallon of some cool organic whole milk... Moonbeam took this and made a pound of Mozzarella cheese in less than an hour!

Funny how a lot of people who don't care tend to live forever.
Mozzarella in a hour - man don't tell me that was microwave mozz!  :'(  Do we need to start a Microwave thread?
After having said that - I just got back from the grocery store.... Boneless rib eye roast 2.99/lb for a big ol' slab.
Yep, wrong kinda meat. Industrial, grain fed, on a feed lot, global warming and everything. But it tastes so good.  :P
I do buy grass fed too, ground beef is $4/lb the rest is sold in quarters only. So gotta plan the freezer space and timing.


-OCD
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: lonnie mac on December 05, 2009, 11:56:43 PM
Man I am a fast food junky.
Shopping with Moonbeam this afternoon, she thought I was nuts! I was running around the whole store looking for organic stuff!

A gallon of some cool organic whole milk... Moonbeam took this and made a pound of Mozzarella cheese in less than an hour!

Funny how a lot of people who don't care tend to live forever.
Mozzarella in a hour - man don't tell me that was microwave mozz!  :'(  Do we need to start a Microwave thread?
After having said that - I just got back from the grocery store.... Boneless rib eye roast 2.99/lb for a big ol' slab.
Yep, wrong kinda meat. Industrial, grain fed, on a feed lot, global warming and everything. But it tastes so good.  :P
I do buy grass fed too, ground beef is $4/lb the rest is sold in quarters only. So gotta plan the freezer space and timing.


-OCD


Actually, that's all it takes to make mozzarella... We started learning from a kit from Austin Homebrew! :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5odBodQ0pZM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5odBodQ0pZM)

Know your cheeses man!! :)
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: beerocd on December 06, 2009, 12:53:39 AM
Know your cheeses man!! :)


I know my cheeses.  ;)
I am aware of that technique, it's just not for me.
Know your conspiracy theories man!!!
Microwaves scare me.

-OCD
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: boulderbrewer on December 06, 2009, 04:38:48 AM
The only Flesh we will eat is what we grow ourselves. Our Heritage breeds for the monment right now are Deleware chickens. This spring we will add Midget White and Bourbon red turkeys. We also have goats and ducks to help provide our meals. We try to raise our own food, Heritage or not. The best food you you can eat is the food you grow yourself. Just remember what you put in it is what you get out of it!. (Just say no to milorganic=Milwaukee's sh*t)
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: majorvices on December 06, 2009, 11:42:20 AM


Funny how a lot of people who don't care tend to live forever.



FTR I eat healthy and work out so I can enjoy life now, not so that I can live forever. The things I enjoy doing, besides drinking and brewing, require me to be in pretty good physical shape. It ain't about living forever - for me, it's about enjoying life to its fullest today.

(And I will also admit, there is a little bit of vanity that fits in there somewhere too.  ;))
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: pwaters3 on December 06, 2009, 05:27:58 PM
Yes I have heard off this film, I also have heard that it is very biased. I don't watch much propaganda.

I'm really not sure where to start.

So lets start with grass fed Beef? to those who buy grass fed beef why is this you preference? I have eaten it and it really hasn't made me go wow that's good. Great beef is a passion of mine!!

On the heritage breeds, one person commented that they raise them for their personal consumption what's the reason.

Micheal Pollan: Omnivore's Dilemma, really what is the dilemma. It seems a little neurotic to me or worse, guilt mongering. I have no dilemma when it comes to eating, I eat very well  ;D

Now a quick bit about me,  I am owner and operator of a small family farm in the NE mainly raising beef along with chickens, meat and dairy goats (yes, we have made the microwave Mozzarella and made pizza for dinner that night also makes good lasagna). I belong to the 60% of Farmers that are small under $1mill in sales, that percentage will vary depending on who's reporting. This is were my passion for great beef comes from I LOVE a great steak and i eat it on a regular basis.

I hybrid feed my steers they get grain and pasture. The reason is, and there are many studies dating back to the late 50's and early 60's that grass feed animals will be on average 25% tougher then grain feed steers. That's why I grain my steers, the single most satisfying factor surveyed by the NCBA (National Cattlemens Beef Assoc.) is tenderness, it beats out tatse!! .

It's true and I wont argue that grass feed beef will have a "healthier" fat profile then grain fed, but here's a little bit of info that isn't well known that profile is gene dependent, meaning a grain fed steer can have a "healthier" fat profile then an all grass fed steer. Waygu cattle, the breed that can be called Kobe beef, if raised in Kobe, Japan. Kobe beef is fed all grain and has the healthiest fat profile.

Cheap food, think of how you feel after a good a filling meal, you are kind of complacent. if we had a lot of hungry people Washington would have a very different political profile. I have read that the cost for a dozen eggs if adjusted for inflation since the 50's would cost about $7.00/dozen how many would pay $7.00. I struggle to sell free range eggs at $2.50, I have eaten free range eggs before free range was a buzz word. They definitely are richer tasting.  What the average American pays as a percentage of the income dollar has dropped from +/- 40% at the start of the 20th  the century to now a decade into the 21st century which is around 10% - 20% ( the 20% I think includes eating out and fast food) a significant change

The agricultural system is in a precarious position. The cost of land far exceeds the value of any product that could be produced on, it except for maybe drugs.

Processing of meat is held by 2 companies and 1 which is a Brazilian company is trying to buy the other. Processing is the biggest headache I face. I have to schedule a slot at the USDA inspected facility (which I have to legally if I want to sell to the consumer) a year in advance at least I the animal I am scheduling is actually on the ground. One facility that I talked to is scheduling 2 years in advance,  that means the animal is barely just conceived!!

I do not process any animals myself, I cant do it, not that I lack the skill, I just cant do it. I take good care of my animals as do 99% of all farmers, the mistreatment is once the animal leaves the farm and is under some one else's care. The video that came out from the political action group PETA of the worker using a forklift the roll a cow enraged me. But, a lot and i do mean alot of the workers in those large processing facilities are immigrant workers mostly form South America. I was once at the Largest goat and sheep processing facility in the US and I didn't see any English speaking people and the door on the USDA inspectors office was closed. Read into that what all you want The workers at the facilities have a different cultural view of the animals and just working in the processing facility desensitizes you.

Just a little perspective a good year selling calves that weight around 600# and are about 6-8months old will be a profit of $100-$150, typical is about $50.00, this year will be about -$100 with no improvement in site. It is approximately 17months from conception before selling it as a 600# calf.

Just remember that all life is carbon based, once carbon has been regulated and controlled, all life will be regulated and controlled.

A little glimpse of reality

Paul W
Mad Cow Brewing
Have a cow Man!
;)







Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: beerocd on December 06, 2009, 06:41:52 PM
There's way too much to quote - thanks for a look into the life of a farmer.

We'll buy grass fed occasionally because it's supposed to be better for you. If it's stew or chilli it doesn't matter much. For just straight T-bones and filet grain fed is absolutely better tasting Haven't you heard the things that don't taste good are the healthiest for you. Seems that way often.

With the eggs - aren't eggs MASS produced now? Like computers, if you adjust the first PC for inflation it'd be tens of thousands of dollars by now. Production got massive, and cheap. The eggs we eat these days for $.99/dozen  I'm sure are much different than the eggs of the 50's. We'll buy farm fresh, at $4/dozen as a treat. The yolks are SO different, dark yellow to orange compared to the light yellow of the mass produced stuff. Big taste difference.

My reasonong, right or wrong, is to try and cancel out at least some small portion of my unhealthy choices with these healthier choices. I'm not saying I think a screwdriver is healthy because of the OJ. Just that a little organic, raw, grassfed something added to the diet must be better for me than a happy meal.

-OCD



Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: nicneufeld on December 06, 2009, 09:57:29 PM
I'm not saying I think a screwdriver is healthy because of the OJ.

 :o  ...but...but...here I was downing a double screwdriver every night for my health!  :D
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: a10t2 on December 07, 2009, 01:16:43 AM
:o  ...but...but...here I was downing a double screwdriver every night for my health!  :D

Well there's your problem right there. I'm going to tell you the same thing my doctor told me: vodka in the morning, *scotch* at night.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: glitterbug on December 07, 2009, 04:54:56 PM
:o  ...but...but...here I was downing a double screwdriver every night for my health!  :D

Well there's your problem right there. I'm going to tell you the same thing my doctor told me: vodka in the morning, *scotch* at night.

I always start my day with a virgin screwdriver  :D
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: maxieboy on December 10, 2009, 01:38:03 AM
I'm currently reading The Omnivore's Dilemma and just watched a documentary called King Corn (with brief commentary my Michael Pollan).  It is definitely eye opening, to say the least.

Just finished The Omnivore's Dilemma. Enlightening and a bit worrisome. There is a huge price to be paid (is being paid now) for what's happening concerning corn based and industrial food production. I know that I'll be making even more changes in my food choices!
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: pinnah on December 10, 2009, 02:23:44 AM
This really is
meaningful and thoughtful discussion.  Thanks.

I guess for me,
I fear the soiling of the "organic" label
and that in the future
it may be become blatant propaganda
er, are we there already?

I think, if you are able, the most valuable step
may be to look LOCALLY for these goods.

I will be supporting my local farmer, just up the road, who can sell me beef that are sustainably raised on his own pasture.

Mind you, it is spendy flesh
and I would likely be driven to collards if I was not wealthy.
Is that not the dilemma?

Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: tappedout on December 15, 2009, 05:59:31 PM
There was a fascinating Science Friday discussion w/ Pollan on food sustainability.  Podcast linky:
http://www.sciencefriday.com/program/archives/200908216

best show on radio, IMO
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: rep on December 16, 2009, 03:39:19 AM
Blatz PM'ed me to see if I thought this topic would be too political and offered to delete it if it was.  ....

At some point we as citizens need to begin distinguishing between discussions that are political and those that are public policy.

I have not viewed the video so I cannot offer an opinion on whether it is political or public policy.

If we do not begin to be able to have adult conversations about public policy, there are major forces out there that will have won.  And, we will have lost.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: denny on December 16, 2009, 05:01:33 PM
If we do not begin to be able to have adult conversations about public policy, there are major forces out there that will have won.  And, we will have lost.

Agreed completely.  What needs to happen is to end the blame game and name calling that too many of these conversations engender.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: blatz on December 16, 2009, 05:05:17 PM
What needs to happen is to end the blame game and name calling that too many of these conversations engender.

Hope I don't jinx this, but I think this thread is evidence that we can do that from time to time  ;)
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: denny on December 16, 2009, 05:37:13 PM
That's why I let it go ahead....to prove that we could rise above that stuff and have a useful discussion.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: rep on December 16, 2009, 06:27:19 PM
If we do not begin to be able to have adult conversations about public policy, there are major forces out there that will have won.  And, we will have lost.

Agreed completely.  What needs to happen is to end the blame game and name calling that too many of these conversations engender.

And a big player in the blame game is us.  When we no longer want to participate in the process because, "I can't do anything", or, "It does not mater because, "they" will do what they want anyway" we as a people lose big time.

In my most skeptical moments I believe that we are getting exactly what we want.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: denny on December 16, 2009, 06:49:05 PM
In my most skeptical moments I believe that we are getting exactly what we want.

Or deserve....
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: scottyb on December 17, 2009, 11:43:53 AM
http://www.storyofstuff.com/
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: beerocd on December 17, 2009, 04:06:24 PM
Just can't do 20 minutes. She annoyed me in less than 2  :-\
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: scottyb on December 17, 2009, 10:16:37 PM
Just can't do 20 minutes. She annoyed me in less than 2  :-\


That is the exact reason humanity has doomed itself should it remain in its present mentality.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: nicneufeld on December 17, 2009, 10:32:14 PM
Two minutes twenty seconds...it felt like a lot longer, I thought I had outdone you by a fair ways OCD, but that's what the clock read when I threw in the towel.  Blues Clues mixed with Third Way politics is how that struck me, but to each his own!  For many who ascribe to her politics, her explanations might be more appreciated and useful.  But its hard to lodge counterarguments with a Flash animation so I gave up.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: beerocd on December 17, 2009, 11:23:06 PM
Just can't do 20 minutes. She annoyed me in less than 2  :-\


That is the exact reason humanity has doomed itself should it remain in its present mentality.

We're doomed because I can't stand to watch bad acting a-la Barney the dinosaur and the Wiggles?
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: a10t2 on December 18, 2009, 12:44:14 AM
Just can't do 20 minutes. She annoyed me in less than 2  :-\

Gotta agree with that. From what I watched, her viewpoints are perfectly valid (although apparently it's just anti-everything). And I actually liked the animation, but reading it in the same tone of voice as a kindergarten teacher isn't going to win her any fans.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: boulderbrewer on December 19, 2009, 04:45:32 AM
To answer pwaters3  question about Heritage breeds. Why them? They are self reproducing. Most of the tukeys sold can not reproduce naturally, that will not work without factory farming. Anyone know how to artifically inseminate a turkey? The same with other poultry. The goal is to produce a self reproducing animal that will provide the meat and eggs that you need. It is all about balance with nature.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: a10t2 on December 19, 2009, 06:53:59 AM
Anyone know how to artifically inseminate a turkey?

Turkey baster?  ;D
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: dbeechum on December 19, 2009, 10:14:34 AM
Anyone know how to artifically inseminate a turkey?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vo2tQ6IL0mA&feature=related
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: beerocd on December 19, 2009, 03:25:45 PM
boulderbrewer is right, with non-self propagating food supplies we are at the mercy of the big corporations. Everything will belong to Monsanto eventually, as nothing will remain that has not been infected with their patented DNA. They're even patenting PIGS!
It'll kinda be like Demolition Man where everything is TACO BELL, except in our case it will be MONSANTO.
Title: Re: Eye Opening Documentary
Post by: boulderbrewer on December 21, 2009, 02:36:10 AM
Anyone know how to artifically inseminate a turkey?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vo2tQ6IL0mA&feature=related

Alot harder than it looks. ;)

Never take a deep breath. :P