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General Category => Yeast and Fermentation => Topic started by: pmallory on February 19, 2011, 02:05:34 AM

Title: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: pmallory on February 19, 2011, 02:05:34 AM
Has anybody had any successful dreg-pitching stories? Or has anyone cultured and propogated up from dregs out of a bottle? I want to know some of the bottles that can be used that don't use a different strain to carbonate. I guess the best way is just to try it out.

I recently used a Bam Biere from Jolly Pumpkin and had great success. I just pitched the last inch into my fermenter with another Belgian yeast. Since I didn't propagate up, it didn't dry my beer out. It finished at 1.010 after five months and had a nice brett pelicle when I kegged it. I could have let it go longer but it just tasted great so I'd rather drink it than watch it. Anyways, all of Jolly Pumpkins beers are sour and have pitchable yeast. The sour is a little bit subtle and it has a good amount of brett.
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: corkybstewart on February 19, 2011, 03:58:36 AM
I use Orval dregs at least once a year to make a Brett Saison.  2 years ago I made a starter and for a week my daughter and I drank brett and sour beers and poured the dregs in.  Then I brewed a hefeweizen, at about 1.020 I pitched the starter and let it sit for a couple of months.  Great stuff, it didn't last long.  right now I don't have a brett beer on tap and I'm getting kind of antsy about it, it's a taste I really crave.
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: tschmidlin on February 20, 2011, 05:57:54 PM
I've gotten yeast from Rogue Chocolate stout and Chimay beers, a few others that escape me at the moment.  Since those strains are now available from Wyeast it's not really a big deal, but at the time Pacman wasn't available and I didn't know 1214 was the Chimay yeast.
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: hopfenundmalz on February 20, 2011, 06:09:24 PM
I have cultured the Bells yeast from some of the lower gravity beers, such as the Amber or Pale.

One of the local brewers who should know says that Jolly Pumpkin uses WLP-550 as the primary.  It is what happen sin the barrels that is the brand character.  Those bugs and critters are in the botlle, so you could do a primary with 550 and pitch the dregs to funkify.
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: denny on February 20, 2011, 06:17:22 PM
I've done Pacman from Shakespeare stout and Chimay from the Premiere (red label).  But, like Tom, I don't bother any more since you can buy them both.
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: CASK1 on February 22, 2011, 03:20:29 AM
Here's a good list of beers with viable sour and wild dregs: http://www.themadfermentationist.com/2010/06/harvesting-sour-beer-bottle-dregs.html
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: 1vertical on February 22, 2011, 02:35:11 PM
New Belgium Abbey Ale has a good strain in the bottle if you like Belgium biers.
But it is not pitchable per se....you have to culture it up to pitchable amounts.
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: narvin on February 22, 2011, 05:21:38 PM
Although there's some disagreement about whether Delerium Tremens yeast in the bottle is their primary strain(s), I and other people have had great results fermenting with it.  I've also successfully cultured from Dupont Foret.  Both of these I stepped up multiple times to grow a large, healthy starter.  

I've failed both times I tried to culture from Rochefort 6/8.

As others have mentioned, Orval dregs work wonderfully straight from the bottle to add some Bretty complexity in the secondary.  Lambic dregs (Cantillon, Boon, and other unpasteurized versions -- not Lindemanns Kriek/Framboise/etc) can also be used to sour beers in the secondary or to add complexity to already sour beers started with a WY/WL blend.
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: morticaixavier on February 22, 2011, 05:27:12 PM
I made a Cali-Common using the dregs from a bottle of lucky hand cali-common that turned out nice. I don't know if they use a different bottling strain but It threw lots of sulfur during fermentation and stank the house up which leads me to beleive they don't as that is pretty classic for the california lager type yeast as I understand it. A couple of weeks after that though I bought a bottle of the lucky hand and it was a gusher. don't know if they got an infection or just over carbed a bit but I would try it again.
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: trevorjn on March 03, 2011, 07:24:42 PM
@ 1vertical: New Belgium doesn't allow their Belgian yeast strain used for Abbey and Tripel to leave the brewery,  they filter these beers and then use the Fat Tire/Sunshine Wheat ale yeast to bottle condition.   On another note,  I have had great success culturing dreggs from bottles of Fantome,  I have 2 saisons fermenting right now that are developing nice funky,  fruity and tart flavors/aromas from this yeast (and bugs).
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: 1vertical on March 04, 2011, 05:28:05 AM
I have never tried the Tripel, but the beers I have brewed using Abbey are sure belgian yeast
and make good beer in their own reguard. I have done it several times FWIW YMMV.

Perhaps this is first hand insider information ???

@ 1vertical: New Belgium doesn't allow their Belgian yeast strain used for Abbey and Tripel to leave the brewery,  they filter these beers and then use the Fat Tire/Sunshine Wheat ale yeast to bottle condition.   On another note,  I have had great success culturing dreggs from bottles of Fantome,  I have 2 saisons fermenting right now that are developing nice funky,  fruity and tart flavors/aromas from this yeast (and bugs).

 ???

Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: trevorjn on March 06, 2011, 12:42:10 AM
Quote
I have never tried the Tripel, but the beers I have brewed using Abbey are sure belgian yeast
and make good beer in their own reguard. I have done it several times FWIW YMMV.

Perhaps this is first hand insider information Huh
I cultured up a bunch of yeast from a bottle of Trippel and email the brewery to ask about specifics on the yeast, here is the response I got;

Hey Trevor,

Thanks for the kind words about our beers and for your question about yeast.

 
I have to break it to you though that our Belgian yeast strain that we use to brew Abbey and Trippel is a proprietary strain.
For this reason we do not use that particular yeast strain for bottle conditioning Abbey and Trippel.

 What you probably have is the yeast used to brew Fat Tire, Sunshine Wheat and a few of our other ales.
That being said, this is still a fine yeast strain!
Some of its characteristics describe it as a clean fermenting yeast with some esters building as the fermentation temperature grows warmer. You might get some estery notes like green apple, licorice, fruity, maybe a bit solventy if the fermentation temp is really high.
It is a highly flocculent yeast that starts fast if pitched in a sufficient quantity. Ferment at 17 – 20C for a cleaner profile and 25 – 28C for a more fruity/estery profile.
If I were brewing a Trippel with this yeast, I would ferment on the warmer side and turn more to spices and/or citrus peel for a Belgian-esque character.

 Good luck and have fun brewing.

If I can answer any more of your questions, let me know,

Cheers,
Chris Holbrook
Brewer/QA
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: 1vertical on March 06, 2011, 01:21:51 AM
Right on trevor and thanks for clarifying that.  I just wonder in the filtration process for beer,
if ALL the yeast gets removed or if somehow, some cells pass thru the filtration medium and
may be left in the bottle ???

From New Belgium Website
Quote
Winner of four World Beer Cup medals and eight medals at the Great American Beer Fest, Abbey Belgian Ale is the Mark Spitz of New Belgium s lineup - but it didn t start out that way. When Jeff and Kim first sampled the beer at the Lyons Folks Fest, reviews were mixed at best. One of founder Jeff s first two Belgian style homebrews (along with Fat Tire), Abbey is a Belgian dubbel (or double) brewed with six different malts and an authentic Belgian yeast strain. Abbey is bottle-conditioned, weighs in at 7.0% alcohol by volume, and pairs well with chocolate (or boldly served by itself) for dessert.
So it is Bottle conditioned....and who can say if all the proprietary stuff gets gleaned out....
Title: Re: Pitchable Dregs
Post by: tschmidlin on March 06, 2011, 07:03:01 AM
It depends on the filter they use, some might pass through.  But unless you are plating and picking singles, you most likely have almost entirely the bottling strain.