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Other than Brewing => The Pub => Topic started by: dean on May 01, 2011, 01:40:30 PM

Title: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 01, 2011, 01:40:30 PM
$4.18 here for regular unleaded.

I ran out of gas about 50 feet from my driveway Friday night.  I was coming home from work, I had stopped at the gas station across the steet before heading home but they had sold out of regular and mid-grade and the clerk couldn't get the pump to turn on for some reason so I chanced it coming home... glad it made it that far.  I put it in first gear and used the starter to get it into my driveway... uphill.   :P
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: jamminbrew on May 01, 2011, 01:48:54 PM
The average here is 3.60 for regular, 3.90 for premium
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Hokerer on May 01, 2011, 02:04:34 PM
Just paid $3.87 here this morning.  Not as nice as the $3.56 I paid during a trip last weekend.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hopfenundmalz on May 01, 2011, 02:13:35 PM
I use gasbuddy.com before buying. 

Paid $4.03 yesterday.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: gmac on May 01, 2011, 03:02:18 PM
$5.22 CAN for 1 US gallon.  Add on the exchange rate and it jumps to $5.53 US/gal.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: euge on May 01, 2011, 04:29:55 PM
It was $3.87 for regular at home and out in West Texas it was that price and higher. Think I paid $3.97 per to fill my car up for the drive back.

Didn't even look at prices on I-10 where there's usually 20+ cents added to the local price.

The current prices are supposed to be temporary and trend back down, but I think we'll see $5 gas this year. :(

Dean, ya'll are running out of fuel?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: theoman on May 01, 2011, 04:38:20 PM
1.50 euros/liter=5.69 euros/gallon= $8.42/gallon.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tubercle on May 01, 2011, 04:42:55 PM
  ~$3.65
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 01, 2011, 05:11:23 PM
$4.59 for 87 octane
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: phillamb168 on May 01, 2011, 05:14:56 PM
$8.30 / Gal for 98

But then I have trains to take me everywhere (except groceries & church)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: boulderbrewer on May 01, 2011, 06:34:32 PM
4.099 in Northern WI
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: corkybstewart on May 01, 2011, 06:48:12 PM
$3.69 for regular around here.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: denny on May 01, 2011, 06:50:39 PM
3.91 average here
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tygo on May 01, 2011, 07:56:25 PM
$3.97 last time I filled up about a week ago.  The car was telling me it's thirsty this morning and will only haul me another 29 miles until I give it a drink so I guess it's time to find out what the prices are this week.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 01, 2011, 08:48:16 PM
$4.13 near my house yesterday.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Norm! on May 01, 2011, 09:17:41 PM
4.37 a gallon for Diesel here.....filled up my truck to the tune of 130 bucks!!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: bluesman on May 02, 2011, 12:47:48 AM
$3.86 regular
$4.19 diesel
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: beveragebob on May 02, 2011, 01:14:45 AM
$3.66 at Sams Club down here in the sand pit.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: speed on May 02, 2011, 02:10:53 AM
3.94 ethanol and 4.09 diesel here at my station.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 02, 2011, 02:43:21 AM
Here in Hawaii we have E10.  You can get a special use permit to buy ethanol-free gas for boats and small engines.

Anybody out there using E85?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 02, 2011, 04:46:41 AM
Yeah, everything here is E10 as far as I know.  Or it "may contain up to 10% ethanol" for whatever that's worth.

Passed a gas station tonight, $4.139 for 87, diesel was $4.499
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: jeffy on May 02, 2011, 11:07:12 AM
Cheapest I saw on may way to work today was $3.79.9 for regular.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: chezteth on May 02, 2011, 11:19:55 AM
$3.99 for regular here in Appleton, WI
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: atvnfamily on May 02, 2011, 11:58:18 AM
3.65 unleaded 85oct.
4.18 diesel.
Here in Montana, were everything is at least 120 miles away.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 02, 2011, 01:38:33 PM
3.65 unleaded 85oct.
4.18 diesel.
Here in Montana, were everything is at least 120 miles away.

That's about how far I have to drive to go to Costco, but it is an awesome drive getting there.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tygo on May 02, 2011, 01:40:52 PM
$4.07 for regular when I filled up this morning.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: thirsty on May 02, 2011, 02:23:48 PM
$4.12 is the cheapest, but most places are around $4.25
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: homebrewgamecock on May 02, 2011, 03:31:38 PM
$3.67 for 87 octane here in CO.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: pfooti on May 02, 2011, 07:13:22 PM
$4.30 for a gallon of regular at the station I filled up my scooter at. I had to splurge on the high-octane stuff (4.50 for 93 octane), since the scooter runs on that. On the other hand, I get about 50 - 70 MPG, so I'm not sweating the gas prices as much as other people.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hamiltont on May 02, 2011, 07:38:21 PM
$3.89 here.  Patiently waiting for nice weather so I can ride the XT225 to work. Cheers!!!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: maxieboy on May 02, 2011, 08:16:53 PM
$4.01 filling up this a.m. Used Gas Buddy to get a good price a mile away. Station close to my house was $4.29. Sonsab!tches...
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dbeechum on May 02, 2011, 08:27:47 PM
Around my neck of the woods - 87 is $4.39 gallon
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Pinski on May 02, 2011, 09:07:10 PM
$3.90
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: cheba420 on May 02, 2011, 09:10:07 PM
$3.79 yesterday. $68 to fill up my jeep!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: SpanishCastleAle on May 03, 2011, 12:22:38 PM
Found it for $3.83 yesterday but most places are $3.91 and up.  Central Florida.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hamiltont on May 03, 2011, 01:25:31 PM
$3.89 here.  Patiently waiting for nice weather so I can ride the XT225 to work. Cheers!!!

Check that.  $3.99 when I went home last night.   >:(
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Slowbrew on May 03, 2011, 02:05:29 PM
Ethanol Blend is $3.79.
Regular (no ethanol) $4.09

Paul
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 03, 2011, 04:15:43 PM
Saw regular for $4.159 last night, diesel was up to $4.559 . . .
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: maxieboy on May 03, 2011, 04:23:13 PM
Mid to high $4.20s today...  ::)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: The Professor on May 03, 2011, 08:38:02 PM

central NJ reporting...
I paid $3.79/gal this afternoon. It's getting bad, no doubt about it..
   
NJ has the one of the lowest taxes on gasoline in the nation, so we've always gotten a bit of a break.  Still, I'm sure we'll be seeing prices over  $4.00 / gal   by summer, and there's been chatter that it could even reach $5.00 by fall.  Hard to believe that less than a year ago I was paying $2.32 at the same station, and under $2.00 (for a while anyway)  just two short years ago.

When I was in high school and began driving,  the average price per gallon  in NJ was  29¢ /gal. 
As much as prices continued to rise, for years the prices acually remained proportionately lower than the inflation rate,  but according to the calculation I just made comparing my 1968 price to today's price per gallon,  it sure looks like that dream is over. 
The inflation calculator I used  indicated that 29¢  in '68 would be equivalent  to spending approximately  $2.00 in today's money--which sems about right when comparing prices of other items...like beer ;D.

There's no doubt that we got spoiled over the years and took supply and price for granted (which, of course, is the American way).   
We got spoiled, and OPEC got 'hip'.   :o
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: boulderbrewer on May 04, 2011, 02:29:41 AM
Oh my what 3 days and a death makes, we are at $4.25 and growing. BP was the first to raise to this. I would suggest avoiding them not to metion the gulf oil spill like you need an excuse.

Hey why not.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tonyp on May 04, 2011, 03:05:16 AM
$3.73 at the WaWa down the road from me here at the Jersey Shore (08755)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 04, 2011, 03:20:43 AM
$3.73 at the WaWa down the road from me here at the Jersey Shore (08755)

Which exit?

(My wife, the Jersey Tomato, hates when I ask that)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tonyp on May 04, 2011, 03:27:51 AM
$3.73 at the WaWa down the road from me here at the Jersey Shore (08755)

Which exit?

(My wife, the Jersey Tomato, hates when I ask that)

That joke is for the Turnpike, but its Exit 82 on the Parkway :)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 04, 2011, 03:37:31 AM
My wife grew up shelling on LBI.  Even living here in Hawaii she often talks longingly about shelling on LBI.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tonyp on May 04, 2011, 04:26:02 AM
My wife grew up shelling on LBI.  Even living here in Hawaii she often talks longingly about shelling on LBI.

I have fond memories of shelling and searching for "sea glass". Its a shame that its so rare now, but its a side effect of beach parties being illegal since the early 80s. Whodathunk that drunk fools tossing beer bottles into the ocean would create a hobby for others?

Ask your wife what the rarest color she ever found was, I still have jars of white/green/brown with some blue and even a few small pieces of red.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 04, 2011, 05:50:46 AM
My wife grew up shelling on LBI.  Even living here in Hawaii she often talks longingly about shelling on LBI.
Where on LBI?  I lived in Surf City.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: jeffy on May 04, 2011, 11:23:06 AM
Cheapest I saw on may way to work today was $3.79.9 for regular.
Same gas station, two days later - $389.9
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tygo on May 04, 2011, 11:40:19 AM
Cheapest I saw on may way to work today was $3.79.9 for regular.
Same gas station, two days later - $389.9

Now that's just outrageous  :D
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 05, 2011, 10:09:11 AM
Cheapest I saw on may way to work today was $3.79.9 for regular.
Same gas station, two days later - $389.9

Yikes!  More than an order of magnitude increase per day.  And I thought gas prices were bad here!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: beersk on May 05, 2011, 04:46:20 PM
$3.94 here for regular.  I'm lucky I don't drive a car, man powered baby!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: morticaixavier on May 05, 2011, 04:57:06 PM
can I just say what the hell with the .9 cents! I want to pump 1 gallon of gas and ask for my .1 cents change!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Beer Monger on May 05, 2011, 04:58:39 PM
We reached 3.93 at the Arco today - which is, by far, the cheapest gas around. 

The Avg. at most name-brand stations now is $4.06 to $4.10 for regular unleaded. 
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: blatz on May 05, 2011, 05:39:25 PM
$3.989 across the street from my office at sunoco

$4.09 at most of the major brands (BP, Texaco etc)

Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: morticaixavier on May 05, 2011, 07:09:41 PM
4.499(grr) for #2 highway diesel

**EDIT** correction 4.699
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 06, 2011, 05:20:02 PM
Regular Unleaded = $4.29 9/10 ... $4.30 per gallon today.  Anybody wanna bet on it hitting $5.00 before the 4th of July? 
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hamiltont on May 06, 2011, 05:29:35 PM
Anybody wanna bet on it hitting $5.00 before the 4th of July? 
At this rate it'll be there before next month.  GEEEEZ!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: boulderbrewer on May 07, 2011, 03:27:19 AM
A correction in the market is happening. We close our gas making refineries to correct the value of our stock and increase our profits happens every year. Next year we will be screaming about $6 a gallon gas.

Crazy crap that happens every year, it happens to be a fact of life.

Fight back DON'T BUY GAS!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 07, 2011, 05:07:48 AM
Trust me, most of the people I know... drive as little as possible already.  Don't be suprised if more people start driving horse and buggies on the road!   :o  I know a few people that have quit driving cars completely already... no s***, and they say they don't miss it either except for family gatherings.  One guy hasn't drove in two years now.  He walks, rides a bike and catches a ride from others when he needs to go someplace further.

On average it costs me about $40 a week to go to work and get groceries once a week.,, my work place is 14 miles round trip and the grocery store is 42 miles round trip.  Of course we also take our garbage to the dump once every week or two... about 6 miles round trip.  Other than that... we don't go anywhere much.  Road trips are out of the question, especially out of state road trips... who has that kind of money these days?!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 07, 2011, 07:24:03 AM
I drive as much as I always have.  It's just another business expense.  No big ting bruddah.

In the 70s it was different.  You could not get the gas - at any price.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: 1vertical on May 07, 2011, 01:36:32 PM
On average it costs me about $40 a week to go to work and get groceries once a week.,, my work place is 14 miles round trip and the grocery store is 42 miles round trip.  Of course we also take our garbage to the dump once every week or two... about 6 miles round trip.  Other than that... we don't go anywhere much.  Road trips are out of the question, especially out of state road trips... who has that kind of money these days?!

+1 Seems like we are in the same modus operandii.  Same distance from work and about same expense.
I take my trash to the dumpster @ work and save on that particular vector.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: yugamrap on May 09, 2011, 09:17:14 PM
e^n!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 10, 2011, 04:35:16 PM
Good thing an election is coming up, gas prices are supposed to drop... to around $3.50 per gallon.  Wohoooo!  Yippeeeeee!   ::)  Are we sheep or what?!   :-X   
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 11, 2011, 07:35:08 AM
Gas prices dropped 15₵/gal here today.

$4.59 → $4.44
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: 1vertical on May 11, 2011, 02:10:59 PM
They need to drop $3 more!...and that still would be too expensive IMO
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: maxieboy on May 11, 2011, 03:08:44 PM
Gas prices dropped 15₵/gal here today.

$4.59 → $4.44

No prob. It's HAWAII!!  ;)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: theDarkSide on May 11, 2011, 03:10:58 PM
Last week, most places were $3.95, but a couple stations have dropped this week to $3.88...what a bargain!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: 1vertical on May 11, 2011, 03:34:17 PM
 :D ;D The post office raises stamps ONE PENNY and every one comes unglued :-\
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: gordonstrong on May 11, 2011, 03:46:25 PM
:D ;D The post office raises stamps ONE PENNY and every one comes unglued :-\

Who uses stamps?  Gas, I need.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: 1vertical on May 11, 2011, 03:55:19 PM
:D ;D The post office raises stamps ONE PENNY and every one comes unglued :-\

Who uses stamps?  Gas, I need.
No wonder I am gonna be laid off.....don't you order in your brewing suppllies By the U.S. Mail....
tsk tsk tsk,.....keep a brother in a job!  :P
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: corkybstewart on May 11, 2011, 03:58:26 PM
I'd like to see gas hit about $8so we can get cars with decent mileage over here.  When I'm in Europe I can rent a Ford Fiesta diesel that gets over 45 miles per gallon but Ford won't sell it here.
Full disclosure:  I work in oil/gas exploration and have a company car so I don't actually buy gas, but my wife and kids do,
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Slowbrew on May 11, 2011, 03:58:35 PM
Last week prices here in Central Iowa went down $.06 to $.08 due to oil commodity prices going down $11/barrel.  Yesterday they went up $.12/gal when oil commodities went backup $3/barrel.

About 4:00 yesterday afternoon the gas mafia realized people weren't going to buy that story and they decided to say it's because of worries about flooding in Louisiana.  Next week it will be locusts in Kansas of something.  We've seen the end of affordable fuels in the USA.  Oil, banks and Wall Street own the government and they won't give it up without a fight.

Sad state of affairs.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 11, 2011, 04:16:05 PM
:D ;D The post office raises stamps ONE PENNY and every one comes unglued :-\

So they raise the price of a stamp, AND, take the glue off of the back?!

How are they supposed to stay stuck on the envelopes?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: bluesman on May 11, 2011, 04:29:13 PM
Filled up the Jetta TDI last night.

It cost me $57 at $4.19/gal for diesel. I haven't seen a price drop in recent months.  :(
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: gordonstrong on May 11, 2011, 05:08:47 PM
:D ;D The post office raises stamps ONE PENNY and every one comes unglued :-\

Who uses stamps?  Gas, I need.
No wonder I am gonna be laid off.....don't you order in your brewing suppllies By the U.S. Mail....
tsk tsk tsk,.....keep a brother in a job!  :P

Let me ship beer and I'll think about it.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 11, 2011, 05:30:44 PM
I'd like to see gas hit about $8so we can get cars with decent mileage over here.  When I'm in Europe I can rent a Ford Fiesta diesel that gets over 45 miles per gallon but Ford won't sell it here.
Full disclosure:  I work in oil/gas exploration and have a company car so I don't actually buy gas, but my wife and kids do,

What makes you think $8 gas would get you higher gas mileage cars? I've been to Europe several times and I wouldn't buy any of their cars here, if given the choice.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: beersk on May 11, 2011, 06:12:33 PM
Good thing an election is coming up, gas prices are supposed to drop... to around $3.50 per gallon.  Wohoooo!  Yippeeeeee!   ::)  Are we sheep or what?!   :-X   
I need about tree fiddy...

Gas is up to $3.99 here.  The reason I wish gas would go up and up and up is so people start thinking about whether they need to drive somewhere or not, say to the store to get a gallon of milk.  Maybe, just MAYBE they'll think, "Hey, I can walk or ride my bike to the store!  It's free, it's fun, and I get some exercise." 
The thing I don't like about rising gas prices is that our imported food in turn gets more expensive.  But I'm willing to pay a little more for food if people get off their asses and realize their sedentary lifestyle is *gasp* BAD for them.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: phillamb168 on May 11, 2011, 06:30:33 PM
I'd like to see gas hit about $8so we can get cars with decent mileage over here.  When I'm in Europe I can rent a Ford Fiesta diesel that gets over 45 miles per gallon but Ford won't sell it here.
Full disclosure:  I work in oil/gas exploration and have a company car so I don't actually buy gas, but my wife and kids do,

What makes you think $8 gas would get you higher gas mileage cars? I've been to Europe several times and I wouldn't buy any of their cars here, if given the choice.

First for Corky, a lot of the times that's measured in imperial gallons which is not the same as Us gallons. The power plant is almost always exactly the same, also the EU regulations concerning estimation of MPG are different as well. Second ccarlson see above   The car you buy in Europe is the same car you buy in the US.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 11, 2011, 06:31:44 PM
Good thing an election is coming up, gas prices are supposed to drop... to around $3.50 per gallon.  Wohoooo!  Yippeeeeee!   ::)  Are we sheep or what?!   :-X   
I need about tree fiddy...

Gas is up to $3.99 here.  The reason I wish gas would go up and up and up is so people start thinking about whether they need to drive somewhere or not, say to the store to get a gallon of milk.  Maybe, just MAYBE they'll think, "Hey, I can walk or ride my bike to the store!  It's free, it's fun, and I get some exercise." 
The thing I don't like about rising gas prices is that our imported food in turn gets more expensive.  But I'm willing to pay a little more for food if people get off their asses and realize their sedentary lifestyle is *gasp* BAD for them.

I just got back from a 12 and a half mile ride on my bike.  This sedentary lifestyle is fun!  

Now I'm going to drive 220 miles to Kona and back.  I don't care how much gas costs.  It's just another business expense.  If my clients want me in Kona they pay for me to go there.

The price of gas is irrelevant.  The availability of gas is the issue we should be thinking about..
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 11, 2011, 06:55:38 PM
I'd like to see gas hit about $8so we can get cars with decent mileage over here.  When I'm in Europe I can rent a Ford Fiesta diesel that gets over 45 miles per gallon but Ford won't sell it here.
Full disclosure:  I work in oil/gas exploration and have a company car so I don't actually buy gas, but my wife and kids do,

What makes you think $8 gas would get you higher gas mileage cars? I've been to Europe several times and I wouldn't buy any of their cars here, if given the choice.



First for Corky, a lot of the times that's measured in imperial gallons which is not the same as Us gallons. The power plant is almost always exactly the same, also the EU regulations concerning estimation of MPG are different as well. Second ccarlson see above   The car you buy in Europe is the same car you buy in the US.


I wasn't really referring to the Ford, but some of the other ones. I rented an Opal one time. As far as I'm concerned they can keep those in Europe. Edit: Sorry, that got stuck in the wrong place.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: phillamb168 on May 11, 2011, 06:56:57 PM
Good thing an election is coming up, gas prices are supposed to drop... to around $3.50 per gallon.  Wohoooo!  Yippeeeeee!   ::)  Are we sheep or what?!   :-X   
I need about tree fiddy...

Gas is up to $3.99 here.  The reason I wish gas would go up and up and up is so people start thinking about whether they need to drive somewhere or not, say to the store to get a gallon of milk.  Maybe, just MAYBE they'll think, "Hey, I can walk or ride my bike to the store!  It's free, it's fun, and I get some exercise." 
The thing I don't like about rising gas prices is that our imported food in turn gets more expensive.  But I'm willing to pay a little more for food if people get off their asses and realize their sedentary lifestyle is *gasp* BAD for them.

I just got back from a 12 and a half mile ride on my bike.  This sedentary lifestyle is fun!  

Now I'm going to drive 220 miles to Kona and back.  I don't care how much gas costs.  It's just another business expense.  If my clients want me in Kona they pay for me to go there.

The price of gas is irrelevant.  The availability of gas is the issue we should be thinking about..

You guys should be pretty much set I'd think, what with geothermal and all.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: corkybstewart on May 11, 2011, 07:10:28 PM
I'd like to see gas hit about $8so we can get cars with decent mileage over here.  When I'm in Europe I can rent a Ford Fiesta diesel that gets over 45 miles per gallon but Ford won't sell it here.
Full disclosure:  I work in oil/gas exploration and have a company car so I don't actually buy gas, but my wife and kids do,

What makes you think $8 gas would get you higher gas mileage cars? I've been to Europe several times and I wouldn't buy any of their cars here, if given the choice.
I've never seen a diesel Ford Fiesta for sale over here.  And when we're in Europe we tend to drive thousands of kilometers in our rental car.  On the german autobahn the mileage sucks but that's normal at 160kph. Off the autobahn I got around 15-18 kilometers per liter of diesel.
If the price of gas got really obscene people would alter their driving habits, you'd see a lot more natural gas powered cars and more mass transit.  W
First for Corky, a lot of the times that's measured in imperial gallons which is not the same as Us gallons. The power plant is almost always exactly the same, also the EU regulations concerning estimation of MPG are different as well. Second ccarlson see above   The car you buy in Europe is the same car you buy in the US.

Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 11, 2011, 07:35:33 PM

The price of gas is irrelevant.  The availability of gas is the issue we should be thinking about..

You guys should be pretty much set I'd think, what with geothermal and all.

Geothermal provides for about 30% of our electric demand on Hawaii Island.  There could be a lot more but the C.A.V.E. People (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAVE_People) get in the way at every turn.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: pinnah on May 12, 2011, 12:57:10 AM
Paid $4.03/gallon for diesel today.
$100 bucks to fill er up.

Drove 150 miles up the road into ONG Land
(Oil and Gas Land)
where trucks buzz around like flies and the rate there was $ 4.43/gallon. :-\


I am impressed by the prices in Europe.  'Mericans sure are spoiled it seems,
and complain a lot. :'(

Gawd dang I love my truck.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: phillamb168 on May 12, 2011, 07:48:21 AM

The price of gas is irrelevant.  The availability of gas is the issue we should be thinking about..

You guys should be pretty much set I'd think, what with geothermal and all.

Geothermal provides for about 30% of our electric demand on Hawaii Island.  There could be a lot more but the C.A.V.E. People (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAVE_People) get in the way at every turn.

Is that like C.H.U.D.?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 12, 2011, 08:15:48 AM

The price of gas is irrelevant.  The availability of gas is the issue we should be thinking about..

You guys should be pretty much set I'd think, what with geothermal and all.

Geothermal provides for about 30% of our electric demand on Hawaii Island.  There could be a lot more but the C.A.V.E. People (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAVE_People) get in the way at every turn.

Is that like C.H.U.D.?

Naw, there haven't been any cannibals here for many months now.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: 1vertical on May 12, 2011, 02:03:16 PM
Availability of gasoline would not be a problem if there
were a refinery near you.  We have a couple small ones here.
But the "not in my backyarders" have cinched that venue up so
IF availability goes away I place my blame squarely upon that.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 12, 2011, 02:59:45 PM
+1 on not enough refineries here in the states, along with opening up more land for drilling.

Hmmmm... interesting read, explains CAVE People and NIMBY People.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAVE_People

I guess I'm a YIMBY person...  :D   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YIMBY
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 14, 2011, 04:35:41 AM
Gas prices dropped another 12₵/gal here today.

$4.44 → $4.32

That's down 27₵/gal in the last four days.  I'm getting whiplash!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: corkybstewart on May 14, 2011, 04:57:41 AM
Availability of gasoline would not be a problem if there
were a refinery near you.  We have a couple small ones here.
But the "not in my backyarders" have cinched that venue up so
IF availability goes away I place my blame squarely upon that.
We have a fairly large refinery about 35 miles from here, and we are surrounded by producing oil and gas fields(google Permian Basin of NM and TX) and our gas is more expensive than most areas around us.  So standard cost analysis doesn't work with gasoline-we have the raw materials and the infrastructure to turn them into usable fuels, and very low shipping costs but we have to pay more than people in cities 200 miles away(the refinery nearby has a pipeline to Albuquerque where gas is usually 10 cents cheaper than here)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 15, 2011, 07:20:09 AM
Gas prices dropped another 14₵/gal here today.

$4.32→ $4.18

That's down 41₵/gal in the last five days.  TFW?!  (Yoda speak)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 15, 2011, 07:42:13 AM
Gas prices are driven (get it?) more than anything by the futures market.  The speculators control the price.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 15, 2011, 08:01:37 AM
Gas prices are driven (get it?) more than anything by the futures market.  The speculators control the price.

Hmmm... conventional wisdom, but I don't think so.  This does not follow the pattern.  I think it is Overton Window driven manipulation.  By whom and to what end... yo no se.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 15, 2011, 08:58:48 AM
Gas prices are driven (get it?) more than anything by the futures market.  The speculators control the price.

Hmmm... conventional wisdom, but I don't think so.  This does not follow the pattern.  I think it is Overton Window driven manipulation.  By whom and to what end... yo no se.
If it doesn't follow "the pattern" (by which I assume you mean that gas prices rise towards Memorial day) then it is only that we don't see the new pattern that the speculators are following. ;)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: corkybstewart on May 15, 2011, 01:51:34 PM
Historically in SE NM we've been primarily natural gas producers, but for the past 18 months we've been drilling almost exclusively for shallow oil(around 8000-10000' deep), and then going horizontal in the oil bearing rock for another several thousand feet.. This lets us exploit thin rock beds that were not economical in vertical wells, and oil production here is way up over 5 years ago.   I haven't looked lately but I don't think crude oil supplies have dropped much, certainly not enough to justify gas prices where they are.
Everybody I talk to would like to see oil stabilize around $75/bbl but it is the market that makes the price, not the producers.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 15, 2011, 02:36:57 PM
Historically in SE NM we've been primarily natural gas producers, but for the past 18 months we've been drilling almost exclusively for shallow oil(around 8000-10000' deep), and then going horizontal in the oil bearing rock for another several thousand feet.. This lets us exploit thin rock beds that were not economical in vertical wells, and oil production here is way up over 5 years ago.   

I believe you are talking about fracking, there has been some talk of it happening here but there are worries about water wells becoming contaminated and the oil companies haven't much to say to remove those worries.  Maybe they're right, maybe they're not... is it one of those "green" ideas?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 15, 2011, 02:49:18 PM
Here is an interesting story some of you might get a kick out of.  Michigan is used for storage of natural gas as well as oil etc.  Its pumped up here from as far as TX.  Well to make a long story short, the gas companies own thousands upon thousands of acres which have both producing wells and storage wells.  They bought out just about anybody that had a well on their property.  All these fuels being pumped up here are stored in dead wells etc. which some are mega huge caverns or poreous rock etc... well, they weren't paying surrounding land owners beyond whatever certain set-point away from these wells.  You can about guess it from there... some adventurous entrepeneurs drilled on surrounding lands and guess what... they are now raking in the big bucks... selling the gas company the very gas they store below... the fuels were tested and found to be the same being stored.  For years the gas companies used other people's lands to store for free, now they're paying.  Tsk, tsk, tsk.   ;)  They may only be paying storage fees now I'm not sure but thats what happened and I'm sure still happens around the country because land owners typically can't prove what is or isn't going on beneath their own land. 

Btw... just paid $4.25 for gas again.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 15, 2011, 03:30:39 PM
(http://)
Gas prices are driven (get it?) more than anything by the futures market.  The speculators control the price.

Hmmm... conventional wisdom, but I don't think so.  This does not follow the pattern.  I think it is Overton Window driven manipulation.  By whom and to what end... yo no se.
If it doesn't follow "the pattern" (by which I assume you mean that gas prices rise towards Memorial day) then it is only that we don't see the new pattern that the speculators are following. ;)

I think the summer runup will be a small blip lost in the larger price swings, if it is there at all.

What I mean is oil supplies are high, demand is down and yet gasoline prices are setting records.  Doesn't sound like speculation driven pricing.   It's manipulation for another purpose.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: corkybstewart on May 15, 2011, 03:39:41 PM
Historically in SE NM we've been primarily natural gas producers, but for the past 18 months we've been drilling almost exclusively for shallow oil(around 8000-10000' deep), and then going horizontal in the oil bearing rock for another several thousand feet.. This lets us exploit thin rock beds that were not economical in vertical wells, and oil production here is way up over 5 years ago.   

I believe you are talking about fracking, there has been some talk of it happening here but there are worries about water wells becoming contaminated and the oil companies haven't much to say to remove those worries.  Maybe they're right, maybe they're not... is it one of those "green" ideas?
Most of these horizontal wells are fracked, but then so were almost all of the vertical wells.  That's been going on out here for decades and we haven't had any noticeable problems with our groundwater.  Proper drilling and cementing techniques prevent problems, and in New Mexico the BLM is extremely strict with the oil companies.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: oscarvan on May 15, 2011, 08:41:17 PM
$4.11 is the best I can find for diesel......
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 16, 2011, 08:15:08 AM
What I mean is oil supplies are high, demand is down and yet gasoline prices are setting records.  Doesn't sound like speculation driven pricing.   It's manipulation for another purpose.
Another purpose?  You mean one other than the oil companies squeezing every penny out of us that they can?  Gas prices are high because we'll pay it, that is why they continue to have absurd profits.  Exxon Mobil's profits rose 69% year over year for the the first quarter of 2011.

But I really think prices have fallen recently because it's not sustainable.  If they keep it high for too long then people will change their habits, take public transportation, buy hybrids instead of SUVs etc.  We have short memories though, so as long as they keep us on the yoyo we'll tolerate the high prices briefly and go back to our old ways when prices fall, and overall it will creep up and up and up.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: gordonstrong on May 16, 2011, 11:00:27 AM
Exxon Mobil's profits rose 69% year over year for the the first quarter of 2011.

Did the amount of profit follow the same rise in the basic commodity price, or did their profit margin expand?  (It's not a rhetorical question, this is something that can be known since they are a public company and have to report this information.  I just haven't done that research.)

If you buy something for $100 and sell it for $105, then you have a 5% profit margin.  If your cost of that something goes from $100 to $200, you sell it for $210.  So the amount of profit doubled, but your profit margin was the same.  Likewise, if the number of units you sell goes up, your profit goes up without a change in profit margin.

If they jacked up their profit margin, then that's a cause for concern.  If they kept their profit margin constant while the goods they sold rose in price, then I think the issue is with what caused the goods to increase so much in cost.  Did they do anything to manipulate the price of the goods, or the supply?  Or was something else responsible?

I'm all for holding people accountable, but only for those things they can reasonably control.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tygo on May 16, 2011, 11:56:42 AM
Okay, I haven't quite had the necessary amount of coffee yet this morning so this might not be up to my usual standards of financial analysis  ;), but:

Exxon Income Statement for the last four quarters.  The quick and dirty research didn't have data going back farther than four quarters on a quarter by quarter basis so I don't know what the Q1 quarter over quarter comparison looks like.

            Revenue     Cost   Gross
                                                Margin   GM%   Net ProfitNet Profit % Op Income   Op Exp   Op Margin
Q1 FY 11    114,004     70,017     43,987    38.6%    10,650    9.34%    18,946     25,041    16.6%
Q4 FY 10    105,186     63,829     41,357    39.3%    9,250    8.79%    15,437     25,920    14.7%
Q3 FY 10    95,298     57,857     37,441    39.3%    7,350    7.71%    12,912     24,529    13.5%
Q2 FY 10    92,486     56,845     35,641    38.5%    7,560    8.17%    12,746     22,895    13.8%
Q1 FY 10   90,251      55,220       35,031     38.8%       6,300       6.98%         12,123     22,908      13.4%

So based on that their GM% actually went down a bit in the first quarter of FY 11 compared to the preceding three quarters.  Their net profit went up on lower operating expenses.  

Also in total their gross margin for FY 10 was 39.0% and for FY 09 was 40.2%.

Edit - Eh, I said my brain wasn't working very well yet.  With the last three quarters of FY 10 and the annual results I can just back into Q1.  Added to table.

Q1 FY 10 vs Q1 FY 11 GM% was pretty stable.  Net profit % went up by about 33%.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 16, 2011, 12:05:11 PM
Before we crucify the oil companies, we should look into why our tax codes allow companies like GE to pay nothing in taxes. No company or individual should be taxed unfairly, just level the playing field.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 16, 2011, 04:32:38 PM
I think it is reasonable to both crucify the oil companies and talk about the loopholes inserted in the tax codes, but the tax code discussion gets political so I'm not going there.

Gordon - I see what you're saying.  Sure the profit margin as a percent didn't go up in your example, but the profit did.  Is it reasonable that a company makes twice as much money for the same work just because their costs went up?  It doesn't seem reasonable to me.

Tygo, thanks for all of that.  So an increase in profit margin of 33% in one year.  That doesn't seem reasonable either.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: gordonstrong on May 16, 2011, 04:51:52 PM
Gordon - I see what you're saying.  Sure the profit margin as a percent didn't go up in your example, but the profit did.  Is it reasonable that a company makes twice as much money for the same work just because their costs went up?  It doesn't seem reasonable to me.

Doesn't seem reasonable from a consumer POV but that's how just about everything works.  A couple of silly examples that don't involve publicly-held companies:

If you go a restaurant, do you tip a fixed amount or a percentage of the bill?  The server is doing the same amount of work, right?

If you get a cost of living salary increase, do you still pay the government what you owed them last year?  You're doing the same work, but why is the government entitled to a bigger total?

Not reasonable, but I don't think I'd want to see what would happened if I did it the "reasonable" way.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: bluesman on May 16, 2011, 04:52:17 PM
The bottom line is that the demand is there and we need the product. We are at the mercy of the oil companies and their conglomerates(those whom benefit by profits) and they will manipulate us to their benefit. The only way we can get around "getting raped" is to avoid buying fuel, but as we all know we have no choice and they'll keep taking advantage of us as long as we continue to use it. Ultimately, the only way I can see getting around this is by utilization of renewable energy or some other source of energy that doesn't utilize petroleum products.

I paid $4.15/gal for diesel this past weekend down from $4.19/gal the week prior.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hopfenundmalz on May 16, 2011, 05:24:24 PM
"Big Oil" only controls aboiut 10% of the crude supply.  Hard to control prices if your leverage is only 10%.  The other 90% is controlled by nationalized entities.  Ones like ARAMCO, PEMEX and so on.  Oil is also a global commodity, and the spot price for a barrel is what is paid around the globe.  As China and India develope, their demand goes up, and I think one can figure out the result in the long term.

One needs to think of the supply and demand.  Oil prices are usually quoted for the 30 day delivery price.  There was a $30 risk premium on a barrel of oil when it was at $114.  That was due to the social unrest in the Middle East, especially Libya, which is a fair sized producer of oil.

There is also a saying about gas prices, "Up like a rocket, down like a feather". 
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 16, 2011, 05:50:44 PM
So, is it reasonable to say a business should not make Too Much Profit then?  Should entertainers be paid the Huge amounts of money they make for  "acting" or "playing ball".... which is apparently for our sole benefit?  I mean hey, what else do actors, singers and sports figures provide that is an actual benefit to anyone other than self pleasure?  Perhaps they should have a limit on their wages also?  And then there are the rest of us.... how much is too much and should there be limits placed?  Sounds a bit like communism when you think about it... limiting profits and wages... just saying.   ;)

Not that high prices don't piss me off too...

Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 16, 2011, 05:58:35 PM
So, is it reasonable to say a business should not make Too Much Profit then?  Should entertainers be paid the Huge amounts of money they make for  "acting" or "playing ball".... which is apparently for our sole benefit?  I mean hey, what else do actors, singers and sports figures provide that is an actual benefit to anyone other than self pleasure?  Perhaps they should have a limit on their wages also?  And then there are the rest of us.... how much is too much and should there be limits placed?  Sounds a bit like communism when you think about it... limiting profits and wages... just saying.   ;)

Not that high prices don't piss me off too...



+1 At least oil companies provide something that we really need. Angelina Jolie is only eye candy.

I've always looked at professions as what would happen if they went away today and the fact is, actors and sports figures would not effect me in the least. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy a good movie and football game, but I could certainly live without either of them.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hopfenundmalz on May 16, 2011, 06:03:08 PM
One of the quotes attributed to Babe Ruth around the later 1920's was that when asked if he felt bad that he made more than the President of the US, his answer was "No, I had a better year!". 
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 16, 2011, 06:20:56 PM
Gordon - I see what you're saying.  Sure the profit margin as a percent didn't go up in your example, but the profit did.  Is it reasonable that a company makes twice as much money for the same work just because their costs went up?  It doesn't seem reasonable to me.

Doesn't seem reasonable from a consumer POV but that's how just about everything works.  A couple of silly examples that don't involve publicly-held companies:

If you go a restaurant, do you tip a fixed amount or a percentage of the bill?  The server is doing the same amount of work, right?

If you get a cost of living salary increase, do you still pay the government what you owed them last year?  You're doing the same work, but why is the government entitled to a bigger total?

Not reasonable, but I don't think I'd want to see what would happened if I did it the "reasonable" way.
I thought about the tip at a restaurant, and it is not really the same thing.  You pay more for (theoretically) better service.  A more knowledgeable server, more attention from multiple people waiting on you, a new fork practically before the old one hits the floor.  It's more than just taking an order and delivering food.

So, is it reasonable to say a business should not make Too Much Profit then?  Should entertainers be paid the Huge amounts of money they make for  "acting" or "playing ball".... which is apparently for our sole benefit?  I mean hey, what else do actors, singers and sports figures provide that is an actual benefit to anyone other than self pleasure?  Perhaps they should have a limit on their wages also?  And then there are the rest of us.... how much is too much and should there be limits placed?  Sounds a bit like communism when you think about it... limiting profits and wages... just saying.   ;)
Just to be clear, you are the only one that has suggested limiting profits and wages, I made no suggestions for remedies at all.  You are arguing with yourself.  But if you think that sounds like communism than you have no idea what communism is.  ;)

Actors and athletes are massively overpaid.  Should we limit their salaries?  No.  But neither should we pay for stadiums so that the athletes and owners can all get rich.  They make enough money selling luxury boxes and $75 seats to build their own damn stadiums.  But at least I get a vote on that - I get no vote over whether we should subsidize the oil companies.  :(
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: corkybstewart on May 16, 2011, 06:30:42 PM
"Big Oil" only controls aboiut 10% of the crude supply.  Hard to control prices if your leverage is only 10%.  The other 90% is controlled by nationalized entities.  Ones like ARAMCO, PEMEX and so on.  Oil is also a global commodity, and the spot price for a barrel is what is paid around the globe.  As China and India develope, their demand goes up, and I think one can figure out the result in the long term. 
Here in New Mexico we don't work for a single oil company that refines and sells gasoline, all of our clients are just exploration and development companies and they're doing quite well right now.
As for increasing domestic production it may or may not be a great idea but regardless it won't affect the price of oil or gasoline.  For every barrel we produce here somebody like Saudi Arabia will take a barrel off the market to keep prices stable.  Why should they keep selling more of their only asset at lower prices?  The Saudi's did that just last month when they decided that regardless of how high prices had gotten there's still a glut of oil available so they held back 800K bbl/day.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 16, 2011, 06:35:26 PM
Here in New Mexico we don't work for a single oil company that refines and sells gasoline, all of our clients are just exploration and development companies and they're doing quite well right now.
As for increasing domestic production it may or may not be a great idea but regardless it won't affect the price of oil or gasoline.  For every barrel we produce here somebody like Saudi Arabia will take a barrel off the market to keep prices stable.  Why should they keep selling more of their only asset at lower prices?  The Saudi's did that just last month when they decided that regardless of how high prices had gotten there's still a glut of oil available so they held back 800K bbl/day.
I think it's also worth pointing out that oil is sold on the global market, so drilling here doesn't mean the oil will be used here.  It goes to the highest bidder.  From what I've read anyway, I have no direct experience.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: corkybstewart on May 16, 2011, 06:39:12 PM
Here in New Mexico we don't work for a single oil company that refines and sells gasoline, all of our clients are just exploration and development companies and they're doing quite well right now.
As for increasing domestic production it may or may not be a great idea but regardless it won't affect the price of oil or gasoline.  For every barrel we produce here somebody like Saudi Arabia will take a barrel off the market to keep prices stable.  Why should they keep selling more of their only asset at lower prices?  The Saudi's did that just last month when they decided that regardless of how high prices had gotten there's still a glut of oil available so they held back 800K bbl/day.
I think it's also worth pointing out that oil is sold on the global market, so drilling here doesn't mean the oil will be used here.  It goes to the highest bidder.  From what I've read anyway, I have no direct experience.
Great point.  When we boycott oil from Iran they sell it to the Japanese, then Saudi Arabia sells us the oil they would have sold Japan and everybody stays happy.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 16, 2011, 06:51:25 PM
"Speculators are driving up gas prices!"

"Greedy Big Oil is driving up gas prices!"

I'm so confused!

(http://media.screened.com/uploads/0/5125/441290-vinnie_barbarino_thumb.jpg)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 16, 2011, 07:06:45 PM
"Speculators are driving up gas prices!"

"Greedy Big Oil is driving up gas prices!"

I'm so confused!

(http://media.screened.com/uploads/0/5125/441290-vinnie_barbarino_thumb.jpg)
Actually, I was suggesting that speculators are currently driving down the gas prices and are responsible for the recent dip in prices because futures are down.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: bluesman on May 16, 2011, 07:21:05 PM
"Speculators are driving up gas prices!"

"Greedy Big Oil is driving up gas prices!"

I'm so confused!

(http://media.screened.com/uploads/0/5125/441290-vinnie_barbarino_thumb.jpg)
Actually, I was suggesting that speculators are currently driving down the gas prices and are responsible for the recent dip in prices because futures are down.

I need one of these.  ;D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FyinD6ZDqeg
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 16, 2011, 07:30:29 PM
I need one of these.  ;D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FyinD6ZDqeg

Oh man!  That's a cartoon.  ::)  Here is what it will really be like.  What kind of gas prices do you suppose they pay?  ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IJhlD6q71YA
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hopfenundmalz on May 16, 2011, 09:42:56 PM
"Speculators are driving up gas prices!"

"Greedy Big Oil is driving up gas prices!"

I'm so confused!

(http://media.screened.com/uploads/0/5125/441290-vinnie_barbarino_thumb.jpg)

This scheme would collapse if the "Man" was not keeping the water powered cars off of the market.



Had some one tell me that at Big Brew.  Really.   8)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 16, 2011, 10:10:37 PM


This scheme would collapse if the "Man" was not keeping the water powered cars off of the market.


Had some one tell me that at Big Brew.  Really.   8)

Well... fuel cells

hydrogen + oxygen → fuel cell → electricity + water

and

water + electricity → hydrogen + oxygen


Shuttle Endeavor is using the first part to generate electricty and potable water on orbit as I write this.
Electricity generated by solar panels can store energy as hydrogen - to be used to generate electricty via fuel cells when there is no light (at will). 

Or by direct combustion of the hydrogen and oxygen.


Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hopfenundmalz on May 16, 2011, 10:34:10 PM


This scheme would collapse if the "Man" was not keeping the water powered cars off of the market.


Had some one tell me that at Big Brew.  Really.   8)

Well... fuel cells

hydrogen + oxygen → fuel cell → electricity + water

and

water + electricity → hydrogen + oxygen

Shuttle Endeavor is using the first part to generate electricty and potable water on orbit as I write this.
Electricity generated by solar panels can store energy as hydrogen - to be used to generate electricty via fuel cells when there is no light (at will).  

Or by direct combustion of the hydrogen and oxygen.
I had mentioned to the guy that I actually have driven a fuel cell vehicle.  Really, I have driven one.

He was talking about the tank of water and some gizmos to turn the water into fuel (i.e. hydrogen).  The probelm with this is water has been already "burned".  There are some laws of thermodynamices that say what the guy was talking about is essentially Perpetual Motion.  The conversation was along the lines of something for nothing.  The supposed inventor had guys show up on his door step in black suits and sunglasses.

What you talk about will work, as the energy comes from the solar panels. That does not violate any laws of nature.

Edit - this was fill your tank with water, all of mankind's problems solved.  Nothing about the source of energy.  Google "water powered cars".  It is entertaining.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: weazletoe on May 16, 2011, 10:37:28 PM
Still holding steady at 3.60 here in Pocatello. But, the way things work here is it will hold for a few weeks, then jump  0.20 in a week. I'm just waiting for that 0.40 spike here for memorial day.  ::)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: maxieboy on May 16, 2011, 11:27:44 PM
Hit $3.98. Woot!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: theDarkSide on May 17, 2011, 12:10:53 PM
Prices have dropped a few cents in the last couple days.  A local Shell station is at $3.85 per gallon.

When are they going to perfect Methane burning cars?  I love Mexican food.  ;D
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Beer Monger on May 17, 2011, 01:08:50 PM
Went down 2 cents at the Arco in Federal Way, WA yesterday.  Regular is now $3.91. 
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 17, 2011, 02:34:30 PM
When I hear or read about water powered vehicles it makes me laugh.  Supposedly these vehicles would exhaust water, onto the road... if you live in the north this could be a problem.  Jmo.   ;D
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Beer Monger on May 17, 2011, 02:57:44 PM
When I hear or read about water powered vehicles it makes me laugh.  Supposedly these vehicles would exhaust water, onto the road... if you live in the north this could be a problem.  Jmo.   ;D

Actually it's hydrogen powered vehicles which would expell water - or rather water vapor as their exhaust.  And only small amounts. 

I think hybrids are a huge step in the wrong direction.  We need to devote more resources to hydrogen powered vehicles. 
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 17, 2011, 03:55:41 PM
Actually it's hydrogen powered vehicles which would expell water - or rather water vapor as their exhaust.  And only small amounts. 

I think hybrids are a huge step in the wrong direction.  We need to devote more resources to hydrogen powered vehicles. 

+1 on that!  Hybrids are for people who want to feel good about themselves.  My gasoline powered Accord gets as good gas mileage as most hybrids (33 mpg) without all of the battery BS.

I've been a proponent of hydrogen power since my 6th grade teacher (1967) showed my class about electrolysis and hydrogen combustion.  The main engines of the space shuttle are powered by hydrogen combustion.

The main drawbacks are swithching infrastructure from petroleum to hydrogen filling stations, and overcoming the strangle-hold oil companies have on the fuel markets.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Beer Monger on May 17, 2011, 04:09:29 PM
Actually it's hydrogen powered vehicles which would expell water - or rather water vapor as their exhaust.  And only small amounts. 

I think hybrids are a huge step in the wrong direction.  We need to devote more resources to hydrogen powered vehicles. 

+1 on that!  Hybrids are for people who want to feel good about themselves.  My gasoline powered Accord gets as good gas mileage as most hybrids (33 mpg) without all of the battery BS.

I've been a proponent of hydrogen power since my 6th grade teacher (1967) showed my class about electrolysis and hydrogen combustion.  The main engines of the space shuttle are powered by hydrogen combustion.

The main drawbacks are swithching infrastructure from petroleum to hydrogen filling stations, and overcoming the strangle-hold oil companies have on the fuel markets.

Yep.  Though I believe Schwarzenegger started making sure CA had some hydrogen fill up stations before he left office.  How many I'm not sure.

Mercedes has a fully funcitonal, 100MPH hydrogen powered car (prototype that never went to production, obviously) in the early 60's.  The tech is there, but like you said, the oil companies have a stranglehold on the market it seems, and try their best to hold hydrogen tech back. 

If we went hydrogen, you could even get a hydrogen 'power plant' to power your home (would hook to the natural gas line & extract hydrogen from the natual gas).  Theoriteically, you could generate enough hydrogen to run a generator to power your home, fuel your car and even sell some power back to the grid. 
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hopfenundmalz on May 17, 2011, 04:57:49 PM
Hydrogen is an attractive fuel.  One drawback is that it either has to be stored in cryogenic tanks if liquid like the shuttle, or stored at high pressure to get the energy density one wants.  The fuel cell vehicle I drove had 3 tanks to store the hydrogen at 10,000 PSI.  They had to allow for expansion around the tanks as they grew considerably when filled.  The range was only about 200 miles, if I remember correctly.

Hydrogen can also be burned in an IC engine, which was what one BMW show vehicle did.  Or you can burn it in a rocket, like the shuttle main engines, or the upper stages of the Apollo rockets, the J2 engines.

Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 17, 2011, 04:59:51 PM
Hydrogen is an attractive fuel.  One drawback is that it either has to be stored in cryogenic tanks if liquid like the shuttle, or stored at high pressure to get the energy density one wants.  The fuel cell vehicle I drove had 3 tanks to store the hydrogen at 10,000 PSI.  They had to allow for expansion around the tanks as they grew considerably when filled.  The range was only about 200 miles, if I remember correctly.

Hydrogen can also be burned in an IC engine, which was what one BMW show vehicle did.  Or you can burn it in a rocket, like the shuttle main engines, or the upper stages of the Apollo rockets, the J2 engines.



Just make sure your O-Rings are okay on a cold day.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 17, 2011, 05:17:16 PM
If hydrogen powered vehicles ruled the road, then it wouldn't be just a little bit of exhausted water on the roads and anyplace with temps below freezing there are sure to be accidents due to black ice... some of which if not most would be contributed by hydrogen fueled vehicles.  Should we heat the roads to prevent it... at what cost?

Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 17, 2011, 05:19:44 PM
If hydrogen powered vehicles ruled the road, then it wouldn't be just a little bit of exhausted water on the roads and anyplace with temps below freezing there are sure to be accidents due to black ice... some of which if not most would be contributed by hydrogen fueled vehicles.  Should we heat the roads to prevent it... at what cost?



I'm sure the engine heat could be used to vaporize most, if not all, of the water. You already get a little moisture with gas engines. It's a byproduct of combustion.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: theDarkSide on May 17, 2011, 05:27:14 PM
Maybe the car could have a collector to catch the water "exhaust"...and a special button to eject the water towards the sidewalk when you see someone you don't like  :P
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 17, 2011, 05:30:51 PM
 :D at Darkside!   Now thats too Funny!! 

Yeh, I guess it would depend on how much is a little etc?  I have to admit I don't know jack squat about hydrogen... how much can we get from a gallon of water anyway?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: denny on May 17, 2011, 05:37:43 PM
:D at Darkside!   Now thats too Funny!! 

Yeh, I guess it would depend on how much is a little etc?  I have to admit I don't know jack squat about hydrogen... how much can we get from a gallon of water anyway?


Well, since water is 2 hydrogens to an oxygen, maybe 2/3 of a gal. would be a reasonable guess?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 17, 2011, 06:07:38 PM
So sooner or later we will all have to quit brewing beer if we use water to extract they hydrogen right... I mean water shortage or perceived water shortage?


Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 17, 2011, 07:08:18 PM
:D at Darkside!   Now thats too Funny!! 

Yeh, I guess it would depend on how much is a little etc?  I have to admit I don't know jack squat about hydrogen... how much can we get from a gallon of water anyway?


Well, since water is 2 hydrogens to an oxygen, maybe 2/3 of a gal. would be a reasonable guess?

Well... no, for several reasons. One reason is hydrogen is a gas, and as such is highly compressible.  Water is a liquid and is very nearly incompressible.  Comparing volumes of hydrogen to volumes of water is complicated.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 18, 2011, 06:31:03 AM
:D at Darkside!   Now thats too Funny!! 

Yeh, I guess it would depend on how much is a little etc?  I have to admit I don't know jack squat about hydrogen... how much can we get from a gallon of water anyway?


Well, since water is 2 hydrogens to an oxygen, maybe 2/3 of a gal. would be a reasonable guess?

Well... no, for several reasons. One reason is hydrogen is a gas, and as such is highly compressible.  Water is a liquid and is very nearly incompressible.  Comparing volumes of hydrogen to volumes of water is complicated.
But it's for that reason that Denny is absolutely right!  A gallon of water is 2/3 gallon of hydrogen (given the proper pressure and temperature). ;)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 18, 2011, 11:28:49 AM
:D at Darkside!   Now thats too Funny!! 

Yeh, I guess it would depend on how much is a little etc?  I have to admit I don't know jack squat about hydrogen... how much can we get from a gallon of water anyway?


Well, since water is 2 hydrogens to an oxygen, maybe 2/3 of a gal. would be a reasonable guess?

Well... no, for several reasons. One reason is hydrogen is a gas, and as such is highly compressible.  Water is a liquid and is very nearly incompressible.  Comparing volumes of hydrogen to volumes of water is complicated.
But it's for that reason that Denny is absolutely right!  A gallon of water is 2/3 gallon of hydrogen (given the proper pressure and temperature). ;)

Sorry, but you can't relate the volume of water with that of hydrogen. Punatic is correct.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: theDarkSide on May 18, 2011, 01:05:39 PM
Come on guys...let's not split atoms  :P
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Beer Monger on May 18, 2011, 01:18:16 PM
Come on guys...let's not split atoms  :P

Unless they can come up w/ something like "Mr. Fusion" so we could run our cars on the energy it produced!  ;) 

Hey!  I guess Miller Lite IS good for something!  Go Dr. Brown!
(http://mp4nation.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/mr-fusion.jpg)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 18, 2011, 03:14:25 PM
Sorry, Beer Monger... but thats NOT Miller Lite.... thats Miller High Life in the pic.   ;)   ;D

Punatic and CCarlson... I'm a refrigeration guy so P/T is almost second nature to me and what you two said is exactly why it confuses me.   ???
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 18, 2011, 04:45:09 PM
Come on guys...let's not split atoms  :P

Oh... allright.  But splitting molecules is OK, yah?   ;D

And ideally,  it's PV=nRT.   ;)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 18, 2011, 05:31:45 PM
Gas prices jumped up 11₵/gal overnight here last night..

$4.18→ $4.29

Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 18, 2011, 05:57:37 PM
:D at Darkside!   Now thats too Funny!!  

Yeh, I guess it would depend on how much is a little etc?  I have to admit I don't know jack squat about hydrogen... how much can we get from a gallon of water anyway?


Well, since water is 2 hydrogens to an oxygen, maybe 2/3 of a gal. would be a reasonable guess?

Well... no, for several reasons. One reason is hydrogen is a gas, and as such is highly compressible.  Water is a liquid and is very nearly incompressible.  Comparing volumes of hydrogen to volumes of water is complicated.
But it's for that reason that Denny is absolutely right!  A gallon of water is 2/3 gallon of hydrogen (given the proper pressure and temperature). ;)

Sorry, but you can't relate the volume of water with that of hydrogen. Punatic is correct.
Yes, he is correct that it is complicated.  But of course you can relate the two.

I'm not using actual numbers right now, but if we assume 1 gallon of pure water at a given temp, that will be n moles of water.  When split, that will give n moles of H2.  PV=nRT.  If V = 2/3 gallon, n is what was calculated, R is a constant.  The only variables left are pressure and temperature.

So as I said "Denny is absolutely right!  A gallon of water is 2/3 gallon of hydrogen (given the proper pressure and temperature). ;)"
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 18, 2011, 08:52:05 PM
:D at Darkside!   Now thats too Funny!!  

Yeh, I guess it would depend on how much is a little etc?  I have to admit I don't know jack squat about hydrogen... how much can we get from a gallon of water anyway?


Well, since water is 2 hydrogens to an oxygen, maybe 2/3 of a gal. would be a reasonable guess?

Well... no, for several reasons. One reason is hydrogen is a gas, and as such is highly compressible.  Water is a liquid and is very nearly incompressible.  Comparing volumes of hydrogen to volumes of water is complicated.
But it's for that reason that Denny is absolutely right!  A gallon of water is 2/3 gallon of hydrogen (given the proper pressure and temperature). ;)

Sorry, but you can't relate the volume of water with that of hydrogen. Punatic is correct.
Yes, he is correct that it is complicated.  But of course you can relate the two.

I'm not using actual numbers right now, but if we assume 1 gallon of pure water at a given temp, that will be n moles of water.  When split, that will give n moles of H2.  PV=nRT.  If V = 2/3 gallon, n is what was calculated, R is a constant.  The only variables left are pressure and temperature.

So as I said "Denny is absolutely right!  A gallon of water is 2/3 gallon of hydrogen (given the proper pressure and temperature). ;)"

That's kind of like saying a gallon of sugar will produce a gallon of cotton candy. Uhhhh, nope.

The correct answer is that a gallon of water will produce approximately 4700 liters of hydrogen. You could say you will compress that to 2/3 of a gallon, but I could argue that you could compress it to 4000, 3000, 2000, liters, etc, That answer is meaningless.

If you went to your gas station  and paid for 1 gallon of gas and you only ended up with a few drops you wouldn't be very happy.  But what if the owner told you that you purchased 1 gallon of gas vapor, would you feel any better?  :)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tubercle on May 18, 2011, 10:35:12 PM
I appeal to Denny to amend his answer to "2/3 of the total". ;D

 Sir, the floor is tended to you....
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 18, 2011, 11:05:56 PM
The correct answer is that a gallon of water will produce approximately 4700 liters of hydrogen. You could say you will compress that to 2/3 of a gallon, but I could argue that you could compress it to 4000, 3000, 2000, liters, etc, That answer is meaningless.
It isn't meaningless at all - given a pressure, volume, and temperature it is a precise amount of gas.  In fact, your answer of 4700 liters is just as "meaningless", because you have not specified pressure and temperature. 

Obviously the volume can be pretty much whatever you like, I never said it made practical sense to think of it that way.  The point was to make sure Denny was right.  And he is, under the right circumstances. ;)  Just accept that Denny was right and we can move on.  ;D
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: corkybstewart on May 18, 2011, 11:16:26 PM
Let's move on.  This morning I left Carlsbad and gas was $3.59.  I got to Midland TX 2.5 hours later and gas here is $3.97.  This afternoon I left a meeting and saw gas for $3.79.  But then I heard oil rebounded to back over $100 so who knows where the price will be tomorrow.  BTW that's the first time in recorded history that gas in Carlsbad was cheaper than another place within 300 miles.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 18, 2011, 11:16:57 PM
:D at Darkside!   Now thats too Funny!!  

Yeh, I guess it would depend on how much is a little etc?  I have to admit I don't know jack squat about hydrogen... how much can we get from a gallon of water anyway?


Well, since water is 2 hydrogens to an oxygen, maybe 2/3 of a gal. would be a reasonable guess?

Well... no, for several reasons. One reason is hydrogen is a gas, and as such is highly compressible.  Water is a liquid and is very nearly incompressible.  Comparing volumes of hydrogen to volumes of water is complicated.
But it's for that reason that Denny is absolutely right!  A gallon of water is 2/3 gallon of hydrogen (given the proper pressure and temperature). ;)

Sorry, but you can't relate the volume of water with that of hydrogen. Punatic is correct.
Yes, he is correct that it is complicated.  But of course you can relate the two.

I'm not using actual numbers right now, but if we assume 1 gallon of pure water at a given temp, that will be n moles of water.  When split, that will give n moles of H2.  PV=nRT.  If V = 2/3 gallon, n is what was calculated, R is a constant.  The only variables left are pressure and temperature.

So as I said "Denny is absolutely right!  A gallon of water is 2/3 gallon of hydrogen (given the proper pressure and temperature). ;)"

That's kind of like saying a gallon of sugar will produce a gallon of cotton candy. Uhhhh, nope.

The correct answer is that a gallon of water will produce approximately 4700 liters of hydrogen. You could say you will compress that to 2/3 of a gallon, but I could argue that you could compress it to 4000, 3000, 2000, liters, etc, That answer is meaningless.

If you went to your gas station  and paid for 1 gallon of gas and you only ended up with a few drops you wouldn't be very happy.  But what if the owner told you that you purchased 1 gallon of gas vapor, would you feel any better?  :)

Guess I must be getting ripped-off when I buy propane then ay?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 18, 2011, 11:26:44 PM
All this gas reminds me of a ditty from the 60s:

"STP - It's the Racers' Edge!"
(http://www.seeklogo.com/images/S/STP-logo-BC208E006F-seeklogo.com.gif)

                 ;)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 18, 2011, 11:31:43 PM
The correct answer is that a gallon of water will produce approximately 4700 liters of hydrogen. You could say you will compress that to 2/3 of a gallon, but I could argue that you could compress it to 4000, 3000, 2000, liters, etc, That answer is meaningless.


  The point was to make sure Denny was right.  And he is, under the right circumstances. ;)  Just accept that Denny was right and we can move on.  ;D

Oh, I didn't know that was a requirement,.In that case you're both right..:)

If you are paying for 5 gallons of propane in gas form, then we need to discuss some land in Florida you might be interested in. :)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 18, 2011, 11:39:33 PM
I gotta say, this is one of the most amusing discussions I've read in quite a while.  ;D
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 19, 2011, 12:03:29 AM
I gotta say, this is one of the most amusing discussions I've read in quite a while.  ;D

I agree.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: maxieboy on May 19, 2011, 02:54:49 AM
I gotta say, this is one of the most amusing discussions I've read in quite a while.  ;D

I agree.

You guys gotta get out more...  ;)  $3.94.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 19, 2011, 05:57:14 AM
I gotta say, this is one of the most amusing discussions I've read in quite a while.  ;D

I agree.
Me too.  ;D

Except now that we've moved on it's back to boring old gas prices.  Regular is $4.11, diesel is still at $4.49.  I get to fill the van with regular tomorrow, should only be about $75.  ::)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 19, 2011, 06:03:43 AM
I gotta say, this is one of the most amusing discussions I've read in quite a while.  ;D

I agree.
Me too.  ;D

Except now that we've moved on it's back to boring old gas prices.  Regular is $4.11, diesel is still at $4.49.  I get to fill the van with regular tomorrow, should only be about $75.  ::)

It's good to know there is a fellow engineer out there who gets it.  ;)




Hydrogen combustion power applied:
(http://www.mnn.com/sites/default/files/user-12957/EndeavourPhoto_entry_0517.jpg)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 19, 2011, 11:15:46 AM
The correct answer is that a gallon of water will produce approximately 4700 liters of hydrogen. You could say you will compress that to 2/3 of a gallon, but I could argue that you could compress it to 4000, 3000, 2000, liters, etc, That answer is meaningless.


  The point was to make sure Denny was right.  And he is, under the right circumstances. ;)  Just accept that Denny was right and we can move on.  ;D

Oh, I didn't know that was a requirement,.In that case you're both right..:)

If you are paying for 5 gallons of propane in gas form, then we need to discuss some land in Florida you might be interested in. :)

Oh I don't know... 5 gallons of vapor can be quite expansive.  How much LAND are we talking about here?   ;D
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dean on May 19, 2011, 11:19:27 AM
So I'm taking it that asking how much hydrogen is in a gallon of water is akin to asking how much a bag of air weighs?   
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Steve on May 19, 2011, 03:45:10 PM
$3.85 - $3.95/gal locally until you get to the intersection of any major road with US 20 $3.95+
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hamiltont on May 19, 2011, 04:37:31 PM
All this gas reminds me of a ditty from the 60s:

"STP - It's the Racers' Edge!"
(http://www.seeklogo.com/images/S/STP-logo-BC208E006F-seeklogo.com.gif)

                 ;)
Some of you might remember this one too. "You can trust your car to the man who wears the star. The big red TEXACO Star." And of course a gallon of gas for a quarter.

Cheers!!!
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 19, 2011, 04:53:44 PM
So I'm taking it that asking how much hydrogen is in a gallon of water is akin to asking how much a bag of air weighs?   
No, just that the proper answer would be in moles of H2, not as a volume.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 19, 2011, 05:02:17 PM
So I'm taking it that asking how much hydrogen is in a gallon of water is akin to asking how much a bag of air weighs?   
No, just that the proper answer would be in moles of H2, not as a volume.

Now you're getting it. :)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 19, 2011, 05:29:12 PM
So I'm taking it that asking how much hydrogen is in a gallon of water is akin to asking how much a bag of air weighs?   

Determining how much a bag of air weighs is pretty straight foward.

BTW - STP can stand for standard temperature and pressure.  Kind of a common ground thing when discussing gas states and reactions. 
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 19, 2011, 05:33:09 PM
But what's a duck weigh?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: theDarkSide on May 19, 2011, 05:38:24 PM
Just filled up for $3.82 at lunch.  At that price, I'd be willing to dump a gallon or two in the trash bin to get that free hot dog ( Super Trooper reference  ;D )
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: dak0415 on May 19, 2011, 05:44:04 PM
Ok then, how many BTUs are in the H2 from a gallon of water VS gallon of gas VS gallon of propane?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 19, 2011, 05:56:57 PM
Now you're getting it. :)
Like I said, the point was that Denny was right!

But what's a duck weigh?
The same as a witch. ;)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 19, 2011, 06:39:45 PM
Now you're getting it. :)
Like I said, the point was that Denny was right!



I sure hope he pays you for unconditional backup. :)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tschmidlin on May 19, 2011, 06:41:52 PM
Now you're getting it. :)
Like I said, the point was that Denny was right!

I sure hope he pays you for backup no matter what he says :)
As long as he doesn't start babbling about wet hops. ;D
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hopfenundmalz on May 19, 2011, 07:03:53 PM

Some of you might remember this one too. "You can trust your car to the man who wears the star. The big red TEXACO Star." And of course a gallon of gas for a quarter.

Cheers!!!

Yeah I bought gas for a quarter a gallon.  Those  were often silver quarters, which I read recently would buy 2 gallons of gas at the price of silver and gas recently.

Bought gas for $3.82 in Kalamazoo this AM, and it is $3.81 now back home.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 19, 2011, 07:21:11 PM
But what's a duck weigh?

Is it flapping its wings or just standing there?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Steve on May 19, 2011, 08:48:40 PM
Mario Andretti was the spokesman for STP with his Indy car. No?
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: tubercle on May 19, 2011, 09:31:53 PM
Mario Andretti was the spokesman for STP with his Indy car. No?

King Richard
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: denny on May 19, 2011, 10:15:34 PM
As long as he doesn't start babbling about wet hops. ;D

No, no, you're doing fine on your own.... :D

BTW, I don't have to pay for backup when I'm right.... ;)

Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: hopfenundmalz on May 19, 2011, 10:51:00 PM
Mario Andretti was the spokesman for STP with his Indy car. No?

King Richard

That depends on the time and place of your reference.

I remember Andy Granatelli, and Mario won in Andy's car in 1969 after the turbine cars failed the 2 previous years.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Steve on May 20, 2011, 03:07:59 PM
Mario Andretti was the spokesman for STP with his Indy car. No?
King Richard
That depends on the time and place of your reference.
I remember Andy Granatelli, and Mario won in Andy's car in 1969 after the turbine cars failed the 2 previous years.
Yes Andy Granatelli!  "STP is the racer's edge."
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Slowbrew on May 20, 2011, 03:27:58 PM
But what's a duck weigh?

The same as a witch, of course.   ;D

Edit:  Should have read further before making a remark.  I was beat to the punch.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 20, 2011, 03:49:26 PM
You ever tried to get STP out of the can? Unless you're extremely patient, use a stove or microwave.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: Hokerer on May 20, 2011, 04:01:34 PM
You ever tried to get STP out of the can? Unless you're extremely patient, use a stove or microwave.

You want somebody to microwave a can of STP  ???
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 20, 2011, 04:08:58 PM
You ever tried to get STP out of the can? Unless you're extremely patient, use a stove or microwave.

You want somebody to microwave a can of STP  ???

I remember it coming in a cardboard type of container years ago and yes, it could be "gently" microwaved, when opened. Or maybe I dreamed that and just used the stove. I do know that I heated it.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: SpanishCastleAle on May 20, 2011, 04:15:24 PM
It's good to know there is a fellow engineer out there who gets it.  ;)


Hydrogen combustion power applied:
(http://www.mnn.com/sites/default/files/user-12957/EndeavourPhoto_entry_0517.jpg)
That low cloud cover kinda ruined our view from the ground...but it was still plenty loud.  We got just few seconds of it then...gone...then...the rumble.

Gas has been going down a tiny bit, we're at $3.75 this morning.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: denny on May 20, 2011, 04:27:57 PM
I heard on the radio that wholesale prices are down 22%
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 20, 2011, 04:33:08 PM
I heard on the radio that wholesale prices are down 22%

How about down $.22? At least that's what it is for wholesale gasoline.

 http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/  (http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: denny on May 20, 2011, 05:07:12 PM
I heard on the radio that wholesale prices are down 22%

How about down $.22? At least that's what it is for wholesale gasoline.

 http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/  (http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/)

That makes a lot more sense.  I was listening to the radio in the other room as I was kneading bread and obviously misheard.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 20, 2011, 05:09:26 PM
I heard on the radio that wholesale prices are down 22%

How about down $.22? At least that's what it is for wholesale gasoline.

 http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/  (http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/)

That makes a lot more sense.  I was listening to the radio in the other room as I was kneading bread and obviously misheard.

I wished you were right. I knead some lower gas prices. :)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: theDarkSide on May 20, 2011, 05:56:24 PM
Gas is only $.22?!?!?!  WOOHOO!!!!  :D

Whoops...read that one wrong!  ;)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 20, 2011, 07:02:52 PM
Gas is only $.22?!?!?!  WOOHOO!!!!  :D

Whoops...read that one wrong!  ;)

22 cents per gallon - in vapor form!   ;D
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: punatic on May 20, 2011, 07:20:39 PM
It's good to know there is a fellow engineer out there who gets it.  ;)


Hydrogen combustion power applied:
(http://www.mnn.com/sites/default/files/user-12957/EndeavourPhoto_entry_0517.jpg)
That low cloud cover kinda ruined our view from the ground...but it was still plenty loud.  We got just few seconds of it then...gone...


From what I saw from here, I think they must have suspended their cloud cover launch limit.

Watching launches in person is something I really miss about living there.  I was watching them live from my back yard even before Sheppard went up.
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: ccarlson on May 20, 2011, 07:26:41 PM
Gas is only $.22?!?!?!  WOOHOO!!!!  :D

Whoops...read that one wrong!  ;)

22 cents per gallon - in vapor form!   ;D

Just remember, that would be a good deal given the proper temperature and pressure. :)
Title: Re: Post your local Gas Prices here...
Post by: SpanishCastleAle on May 20, 2011, 07:38:35 PM
From what I saw from here, I think they must have suspended their cloud cover launch limit.

Watching launches in person is something I really miss about living there.  I was watching them live from my back yard even before Sheppard went up.

Yeah, it did seem quite low. There were some gaps where we could see blue sky.

Having worked out here since '93 you start to take them for granted but the end looming changes that a bit. :-\