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General Category => General Homebrew Discussion => Topic started by: tomsawyer on May 15, 2011, 06:17:53 PM

Title: Question About Procedure in "Gone Firkin"
Post by: tomsawyer on May 15, 2011, 06:17:53 PM
I really enjoyed the episode of Brewing TV where they put together some real ale kegs at Summit Brewery.  My question is, when they add isinglass during kegging, what happens to it?  I know it settles out but how do they keep from drawing it out when they tap the keg?  Is there enough of a low spot in those old style kegs to let it settle out in the belly area?  And how would one accomplish something similar with a corny keg?
Title: Re: Question About Procedure in "Gone Firkin"
Post by: brewallday on May 17, 2011, 09:33:50 PM
Glad to see more interest in Real Ales

This is from a BYO article (http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/article/indices/23-clarity/1687-would-fining-with-gelatin-have-an-adverse-effect-on-naturally-conditioned-beer) (http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/article/indices/23-clarity/1687-would-fining-with-gelatin-have-an-adverse-effect-on-naturally-conditioned-beer))

"These beers carbonate during the same time that the yeast is being pulled down to the bottom with the isinglass. The other key to recognize with fined cask beer is that the cask has a belly where the yeast can collect without flowing to the tap. Since isinglass forms a fluffy yeast layer it is important not to disturb a cask that is being dispensed".

I know some people do use Corny Kegs as a firkin but I've never done it.  IIRC you lay the keg on it's side and cut the out diptube or bend it up.  This video has more information: http://youtu.be/YiwmlktdRpA (http://youtu.be/YiwmlktdRpA)

Cheers!
Title: Re: Question About Procedure in "Gone Firkin"
Post by: phillamb168 on May 18, 2011, 08:44:07 AM
Glad to see more interest in Real Ales

This is from a BYO article (http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/article/indices/23-clarity/1687-would-fining-with-gelatin-have-an-adverse-effect-on-naturally-conditioned-beer) (http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/article/indices/23-clarity/1687-would-fining-with-gelatin-have-an-adverse-effect-on-naturally-conditioned-beer))

"These beers carbonate during the same time that the yeast is being pulled down to the bottom with the isinglass. The other key to recognize with fined cask beer is that the cask has a belly where the yeast can collect without flowing to the tap. Since isinglass forms a fluffy yeast layer it is important not to disturb a cask that is being dispensed".

I know some people do use Corny Kegs as a firkin but I've never done it.  IIRC you lay the keg on it's side and cut the out diptube or bend it up.  This video has more information: http://youtu.be/YiwmlktdRpA (http://youtu.be/YiwmlktdRpA)

Cheers!

Hey, great video link, thanks! This sounds like it'd be worth converting a spare keg to try. Sounds like aspirators are difficult to find, though, at least for Corny kegs. Any thoughts on where I could find one?
Title: Re: Question About Procedure in "Gone Firkin"
Post by: johnf on May 18, 2011, 12:35:21 PM
Glad to see more interest in Real Ales

This is from a BYO article (http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/article/indices/23-clarity/1687-would-fining-with-gelatin-have-an-adverse-effect-on-naturally-conditioned-beer) (http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/article/indices/23-clarity/1687-would-fining-with-gelatin-have-an-adverse-effect-on-naturally-conditioned-beer))

"These beers carbonate during the same time that the yeast is being pulled down to the bottom with the isinglass. The other key to recognize with fined cask beer is that the cask has a belly where the yeast can collect without flowing to the tap. Since isinglass forms a fluffy yeast layer it is important not to disturb a cask that is being dispensed".

I know some people do use Corny Kegs as a firkin but I've never done it.  IIRC you lay the keg on it's side and cut the out diptube or bend it up.  This video has more information: http://youtu.be/YiwmlktdRpA (http://youtu.be/YiwmlktdRpA)

Cheers!

There is no reason to turn a soda keg on its side if you have a hand pump. Seems like a really bad candidate for gravity. Why not just use mini-kegs?
Title: Re: Question About Procedure in "Gone Firkin"
Post by: phillamb168 on May 18, 2011, 01:19:34 PM
Glad to see more interest in Real Ales

This is from a BYO article (http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/article/indices/23-clarity/1687-would-fining-with-gelatin-have-an-adverse-effect-on-naturally-conditioned-beer) (http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/article/indices/23-clarity/1687-would-fining-with-gelatin-have-an-adverse-effect-on-naturally-conditioned-beer))

"These beers carbonate during the same time that the yeast is being pulled down to the bottom with the isinglass. The other key to recognize with fined cask beer is that the cask has a belly where the yeast can collect without flowing to the tap. Since isinglass forms a fluffy yeast layer it is important not to disturb a cask that is being dispensed".

I know some people do use Corny Kegs as a firkin but I've never done it.  IIRC you lay the keg on it's side and cut the out diptube or bend it up.  This video has more information: http://youtu.be/YiwmlktdRpA (http://youtu.be/YiwmlktdRpA)

Cheers!

There is no reason to turn a soda keg on its side if you have a hand pump. Seems like a really bad candidate for gravity. Why not just use mini-kegs?

You mean like a firkin? Availability for one. I only have access to cornies.
Title: Re: Question About Procedure in "Gone Firkin"
Post by: tomsawyer on May 19, 2011, 03:41:09 PM
Minikegs, great idea.  That would solve the "drink it fresh" issue and have the right geometry for the yeast settling.
Title: Re: Question About Procedure in "Gone Firkin"
Post by: tschmidlin on May 19, 2011, 04:13:17 PM
You mean like a firkin? Availability for one. I only have access to cornies.
You can avoid modifying a keg by just swapping the gas/liquid fittings (not the diptubes) and conditioning upside down.  The long tube will be in the void at the top of the inverted keg, and you can draw from the short tube.
Title: Re: Question About Procedure in "Gone Firkin"
Post by: tomsawyer on May 19, 2011, 07:10:08 PM
I forgot to add isinglass to my last NB order, can I use gelatin in the same manner?
Title: Re: Question About Procedure in "Gone Firkin"
Post by: narvin on May 20, 2011, 01:45:59 AM
I forgot to add isinglass to my last NB order, can I use gelatin in the same manner?

Are these posts out of order?  See the link in the second post  ;)

I was also going to mention the upside down keg thing that Tom brought up.  I haven't tried it but it seems like a great idea. 
Title: Re: Question About Procedure in "Gone Firkin"
Post by: tomsawyer on May 20, 2011, 03:01:53 PM
I forgot to add isinglass to my last NB order, can I use gelatin in the same manner?

Are these posts out of order?  See the link in the second post  ;)

My bad, I read the quote but didn't check out the link.  Question answered.