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General Category => Zymurgy => Topic started by: boggs6ft7 on July 04, 2011, 06:51:24 pm

Title: Noble Pils Recipe (Mash for 15 minutes?)
Post by: boggs6ft7 on July 04, 2011, 06:51:24 pm
In the last issue there was a recipe for Sam Adams Noble Pils.

The directions for the mash where as follows:

Mash in at 122 F (50 C) for 10 min.  Raise to 154 F (68 C) for 15 minutes. Raise mash to 170 F. 

I realize highly modified malts will convert quickly, but this seems like a typo.  I was just going to mash for an addtional hour or so.
Title: Re: Noble Pils Recipe (Mash for 15 minutes?)
Post by: Jimmy K on July 05, 2011, 07:39:26 am
I noticed that too, I'm pretty sure its an error. Maybe they meant 45 minutes.
Title: Re: Noble Pils Recipe (Mash for 15 minutes?)
Post by: SpanishCastleAle on July 05, 2011, 09:31:02 am
When spoken, 50 sounds a lot like 15.

<Mr. Tudball>"Mrs. Hawhiggins, palease take a de letterrr. Mosh fur fifaty meenutes."
[/jokethatmaybeonepersongot]
Title: Re: Noble Pils Recipe (Mash for 15 minutes?)
Post by: jill on July 08, 2011, 02:24:27 pm
Hi all,

I had a couple people write in with the same question. I asked Gordon Strong (Zymurgy's technical editor) to take a look, and I'm sharing his response here:

"That's what was in their original recipe. Seemed short to me; my system would need at least 30 minutes at that temperature, but conversion speeds vary.  I'm guessing the difference is that on professional systems, they likely achieve a much more complete grind of the grain so that the starches convert quickly.  On the average homebrew system, that duration is likely too aggressive.  I would extend the 154F rest to 45 minutes to be safe.  The 122F rest is a protein rest; 10 minutes is fine.  The mash out temp (170F) is fine.  The 154F rest is the last saccharification rest, so brewers should always interpret a recipe to include the phrase "or until conversion is complete" on the last rest. That's similar to a food recipe saying "cook until done" after giving a time estimate.  An iodine test can confirm, but most mashes will fully convert in 30-60 minutes at the homebrew level.  So, that's a good catch, and shows a difference between what can be accomplished on a professional system vs. the average homebrew system."

Hope that helps! (And sorry I'm late to the game on this; just got back from vacation).

Jill Redding
Zymurgy Editor-in-Chief
Title: Re: Noble Pils Recipe (Mash for 15 minutes?)
Post by: chaz on July 08, 2011, 06:48:00 pm
Russian River was known (still does I assume?) for their 20 minute mashes so I wouldn't be surprised if that was correct.
Title: Re: Noble Pils Recipe (Mash for 15 minutes?)
Post by: James Lorden on August 30, 2011, 03:45:28 pm
also, I wonder how long it takes them to raise temps to mash out?  If if is a long process they would stay in the conversion temperature range for longer then 15 minutes during the rise...
Title: Re: Noble Pils Recipe (Mash for 15 minutes?)
Post by: hopfenundmalz on August 30, 2011, 03:48:19 pm
It also takes considerable time to mash in, and the pros often are mixing the grist and water as they go in, so conversion will be taking place on a portion as the mash in progresses.
Title: Re: Noble Pils Recipe (Mash for 15 minutes?)
Post by: Kit B on August 31, 2011, 02:01:20 pm
When spoken, 50 sounds a lot like 15.

<Mr. Tudball>"Mrs. Hawhiggins, palease take a de letterrr. Mosh fur fifaty meenutes."
[/jokethatmaybeonepersongot]

Thanks, Mr. Conway.