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General Category => Yeast and Fermentation => Topic started by: Pinski on October 10, 2011, 05:00:22 PM

Title: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: Pinski on October 10, 2011, 05:00:22 PM
Brewed up my first lager last weekend.  Ended up getting much better extraction than my first few all grain batches so it feels like my process is improving.  I'm using the WY2122 SF Lager yeast and wondering;

What temperature and duration do folks like to primary? (I've got the control set to 60*)

Because of the relatively high fermentation temp is a diacetyl rest necessary with this yeast strain?

What temperature and duration do folks like for secondary?

Temp and duration to condition?

Seems like people are all over the place with this yeast so I'm hoping to find a pattern somewhere. Thanks!
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: morticaixavier on October 10, 2011, 05:08:55 PM
Are you after a steam beer? When I am doing a cali-common i do a primary at 60-62f I do a d-rest but I don't know if I really need to. I don't bother with secondary and condition for anywhere from 1 to 6 weeks. This style was historically tapped quite young without any real lagering (think central cali in the 19th century, not a lot of refridgeration)
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: davidgzach on October 10, 2011, 05:15:12 PM
2112 holds lager characteristics up to 68F+.  I use this exclusivery for my Steam Beers.  I've never done a d-rest with this strain and I usually ferment it at around 68.  Primary is typically 5-7 days to ferment, then condition for a week and straight to keg for secondary.  I've tapped it from 1-4 weeks afterwards and always have a great brew.  It's one of my favorite styles and a crowd pleaser.  At 60F it may take a bit longer to ferment, especially if you did not make a starter.

What was the style of beer you were brewing?

Dave
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: davidgzach on October 10, 2011, 05:21:06 PM
Are you after a steam beer? When I am doing a cali-common i do a primary at 60-62f I do a d-rest but I don't know if I really need to. I don't bother with secondary and condition for anywhere from 1 to 6 weeks. This style was historically tapped quite young without any real lagering (think central cali in the 19th century, not a lot of refridgeration)

A little trivia-The name Steam Beer came from the pressure that built up inside the kegs that would "steam" when tapped during gold rush San Fran.  We now legally have to call it "California Common" as Anchor Steam trademarked the term "steam".  From our friend Ray Daniels-Designing Great Beers.......
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: morticaixavier on October 10, 2011, 05:47:44 PM
Are you after a steam beer? When I am doing a cali-common i do a primary at 60-62f I do a d-rest but I don't know if I really need to. I don't bother with secondary and condition for anywhere from 1 to 6 weeks. This style was historically tapped quite young without any real lagering (think central cali in the 19th century, not a lot of refridgeration)

A little trivia-The name Steam Beer came from the pressure that built up inside the kegs that would "steam" when tapped during gold rush San Fran.  We now legally have to call it "California Common" as Anchor Steam trademarked the term "steam".  From our friend Ray Daniels-Designing Great Beers.......

Well WE don't have to call it california common unless we are going to sell it. I actually prefer cali-common now just cause I am grumpy with Mr. Maytag for trademarking the name and don't want to associate my beer with his (Which is good beer, but still grumpy >:()
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: Pinski on October 10, 2011, 06:21:37 PM
"then condition for a week and straight to keg for secondary."

I thought conditioning occured in the keg/bottle after primary and secondary fermentation?

 "What was the style of beer you were brewing?"

Well, the recipe came from a friend that called it a Creemore Clone. I've added some dextrine malt and some Willamette FWH, so needless to say, I've strayed outside the bounds of a Premium American Lager.  So, at OG 1.060 and ~29 IBU, I think I'll call it an EXTRA Premium American Lager. ;)

Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: davidgzach on October 10, 2011, 06:24:46 PM
A little trivia-The name Steam Beer came from the pressure that built up inside the kegs that would "steam" when tapped during gold rush San Fran.  We now legally have to call it "California Common" as Anchor Steam trademarked the term "steam".  From our friend Ray Daniels-Designing Great Beers.......
[/quote]

Well WE don't have to call it california common unless we are going to sell it. I actually prefer cali-common now just cause I am grumpy with Mr. Maytag for trademarking the name and don't want to associate my beer with his (Which is good beer, but still grumpy >:()
[/quote]

Agreed!  I still call it a Steam Beer out of pure disregard...... :)
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: davidgzach on October 10, 2011, 06:32:28 PM
"then condition for a week and straight to keg for secondary."

I thought conditioning occured in the keg/bottle after primary and secondary fermentation?

 "What was the style of beer you were brewing?"

Well, the recipe came from a friend that called it a Creemore Clone. I've added some dextrine malt and some Willamette FWH, so needless to say, I've strayed outside the bounds of a Premium American Lager.  So, at OG 1.060 and ~29 IBU, I think I'll call it an EXTRA Premium American Lager. ;)


Conditioning starts once fermentation is complete.  It's still the same process, just on the yeast cake. 

Sounds like you have quite an interesting brew going here.  You should still get the sour note out of the 2112 but it will be clean at a 62F fermentation.  At 1.060OG did you make a starter?  If not you may get some sulphur and diacetyl.
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: Pinski on October 10, 2011, 06:42:42 PM
I did a 3 qt. starter from 2 smack packs.
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: davidgzach on October 10, 2011, 08:27:35 PM
I did a 3 qt. starter from 2 smack packs.

You are good to go!  Please report back on how this tasted.  Should be a good brew.  I love 2112......
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: 1vertical on June 16, 2012, 08:15:19 PM
I thought I would bump this old thread
1. bc no one ever finished or got back with the requested reply
and
2.  I have a little discussion on experience with this strain.
I fermented a nice 1.056 o.g. mostly pils beer with this and
did make a good 1 qt starter on the stirplate and used med ox
to saturate the wert at pitching....it fermented to barely the
stated attenuation levels with some difficulty and swirling temps
were ambient but within the 60 degree area.

I was some what dissapointed in it's performance.
I kept the yeast cake and dumped fresh oxygenated wert on
the 3 day old yeast cake and barely had any lag time and
fermentation is ongoing with the temperature on the higher
end at 68-70 f.  I will have hopefully if I don't forget
interesting results to report back with.

My main concern or question is what characteristics are
flavor profiles of this strain when fermented at the upper
end of it's reported temp. range?  it seems to be happier
at the 70 degree area IMO.
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: davidgzach on June 18, 2012, 12:41:15 PM
Yep, the whole idea around the strain is that is holds lager characteristics at higher temps.  I typically ferment 2112 around 65F.  70F is a little high but not extreme.  I'd be interested to hear how it comes out.

Dave
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: bwana on June 18, 2012, 02:27:53 PM
Brewed up my first lager last weekend.  Ended up getting much better extraction than my first few all grain batches so it feels like my process is improving.  I'm using the WY2122 SF Lager yeast and wondering;

What temperature and duration do folks like to primary? (I've got the control set to 60*)

Because of the relatively high fermentation temp is a diacetyl rest necessary with this yeast strain?

What temperature and duration do folks like for secondary? There is no need for a D rest with this yeast.

Temp and duration to condition?

Seems like people are all over the place with this yeast so I'm hoping to find a pattern somewhere. Thanks!
No need for a D rest with this yeast.
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: lornemagill on June 18, 2012, 02:46:53 PM
fritz maytag came into a dive bar called the irish bank in sf one afternoon.  just doing a follow up/ seeing if they needed anything, i chatted with him for a bit, we talked about old potrero rye wiskey, he left.  then my friend behind the bar told me who he was, i was impressed he was doing the leg work.
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: beersk on June 18, 2012, 07:35:41 PM
Yep, the whole idea around the strain is that is holds lager characteristics at higher temps.  I typically ferment 2112 around 65F.  70F is a little high but not extreme.  I'd be interested to hear how it comes out.

Dave

The same is true for Wyeast Bohemian lager strain.
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: Pinski on June 18, 2012, 09:08:50 PM
The beer I made with 2112 came out pretty darn good.  Fermented at 60 df, I would say produced strong lager characteristics.  It was not like any ale I had brewed before.  I just kegged a Kolsch that was fermented at similar temps and it came out fantastic. Between the two I prefer the kolsch.
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: 1vertical on June 19, 2012, 05:36:16 AM
What i guess I wonder is....well....
what if it does NOT hold lager characteristics? Does it then morph to ale characteristics?
And if so, will it still make Beer?
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: Pinski on June 19, 2012, 06:36:20 AM
What i guess I wonder is....well....
what if it does NOT hold lager characteristics? Does it then morph to ale characteristics?
And if so, will it still make Beer?
I think you're going to have to be our test pilot regarding this question. Seems like the yeast should produce lager character at ale temps according to what has been discussed.  Regardless, my money says you'll end up with beer. Probably a dern good beer at that. Please do report back with your results.
And congrats on the 2K ;)
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: davidgzach on June 19, 2012, 12:08:08 PM
What i guess I wonder is....well....
what if it does NOT hold lager characteristics? Does it then morph to ale characteristics?
And if so, will it still make Beer?

Definitely, but with some fruity esters.  I had a Steam Beer that got up over 70F on me.  It was still good, but had fruity overtones.   

Dave
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: 1vertical on June 23, 2012, 07:03:23 PM
Ok tasted Hyd sample one week in, this yeast is slow to attenuate. Sweet note
on initial taste.  Needs another week in primary. Needs rousing. still pootin out
CO2 so I will wait a while before kegging.  (once you get past the sweet it ain't bad tho)
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: skyler on June 25, 2012, 06:12:48 PM
I encounter a lot of brewers reasonably new to the hobby (usually having only a few AG beers behind their belt) who want to try out brewing their first lager with one of the SF strains. Usually the reason they want to do this is because they want to brew a clean lager-like beer without temperature control. I generally advise them that it isn't bottom-fermenting that makes the beer clean, but the suppression of yeast-derived flavors which naturally occurs with a cooler, slower fermentation and a massive pitch of yeast. So it reasons that brewing a beer with the Anchor lager strain at uncontrolled temperature (which is rarely under 65F and often over 72F here in the bay area) is going to produce as estery and unpolished a beer as just using a clean ale yeast at the same temperature. Then I tell them that, until they are controlling fermentation temperature, the cleanest fermentation profile they are likely to produce will come from the chico yeast, and that when they do get a hold on their fermentation temperature, they will probably produce a cleaner, more lagery yeast with the Bohemian Lager/German lager strain, as it is less idiosyncratic than the Anchor strain.
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: 1vertical on June 25, 2012, 06:43:49 PM
That sounds like sage advise skyler.  I was just doing uncontrolled fermentation on
the yeast cake pitch as a curiosity...i had the grain, yeast cake was prime, and
an mt keg for the beer...could not resist.
Title: Re: 2112 fermentation plan
Post by: 1vertical on June 30, 2012, 05:10:06 AM
Tasted it today on the way into the keg. That sweet note is gone
and it seems like it will be a good beer.  No fruitiness noted at this time.
More to follow when I tap that keg.