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Messages - hopfenundmalz

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1
As far as time, you get everything cleaned up and put away, and the fermenters and yeast ready before you chill. So it adds a little but not a lot of time.


+1.  I get everything possible cleaned and put up during the stand, so the time loss isn't big for me either.

By the time I get to the stand, all I have left to clean up is the kettle....which you obviously can't do until after!
I also need to flush out the pump and hoses,, but that adds <5 minutes. That includes hooking up tap water, flush with the pump running, tear down. Doing that anyway.

2
93-100 much too hot for a hop stand - might as well put them in the boil and cut 20 mins off the brew day. I usually add hops when the temp falls below 80C as the rate of isomerzation is negligible at that point and hop oils aren't vapourized.

Very interesting discovery about clarity. The haze could come from the bittering hops being in the wort for 20 mins extra rather than the average hop stand temp difference of 3.5C, which I doubt would make significant impact.

I get excellent results with hop stands in that temperature range. Hop oils don't exactly vaporize instantly at those temps. I think the vigorous action of the boil has a lot more to do with driving off the hop volatiles at that point. I've done hot hop stands as long as 90 minutes with truckloads of hop flavor (I actually feel that 60-90 minutes gets me significantly more flavor than 30 minutes). A 90 minute addition of hops isn't going to come close to that.

Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if hop oils are contributing to the haze.

From what i see of big breweries, they go into the whirlpool pretty hot, and go for a good amount of time before they go to the heat exchanger. 100 or 200 barrels stay pretty hot though out the whirlpool.

I have done long whirlpool/stands and thought the results were good for flavor. One can also add more hops towards the end of the whirlpool, as I am dropping into the 180F range. As far as time, you get everything cleaned up and put away, and the fermenters and yeast ready before you chill. So it adds a little but not a lot of time.

3
One thing that popped into my head is the metals such as iron, copper and manganese are catalysts for oxidation, so keeping them out of the mash might be beneficial. Copper later in the process will be good for the yeast as trace amounts are needed. Using a copper wort chiller in the boil should not be a problem for this technique.

One of my false bottoms is copper, and I have been using it in the mash tun when I step mash. I am too lazy to try and run an experiment one vs the other. I don't know if I could pick out a difference.






4
Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Lager X
« on: May 02, 2016, 04:59:16 AM »
I might brew using mine next week!

5
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Orval Brewing
« on: May 01, 2016, 05:41:50 PM »
The yeast will find their food. Then they eat it!

Perhaps not always true.  I've had vigorous 3787 Quad fermentations where D-180 added to the boil was found on the bottom of the fermenter.  Unsure as to the why...
That is a head scratcher.

6
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Ridiculous recipes on AHA
« on: May 01, 2016, 02:25:12 PM »
When I see things like this, I wonder if it is scaling up or down, or converting from SI units to English. I have not done any math to see which it is.

7
All Grain Brewing / Re: Using wort chiller to reduce mash temp
« on: May 01, 2016, 02:22:48 PM »
This one crosses my OCD threshold. I know my sanitation is good enough that leaving wort to chill shouldn't be an issue, but I brew late at night and my OCD won't let me sleep until the yeast it pitched. Once I actually nodded off and woke up in a panic at 4am to pitch yeast.

Yeah, I had the same reaction first time I tried it.  I guarantee ya that if you get past that threshold, you'll be hooked.
And it it's not uncommon for German Brewers to have settling tanks (flotation tanks), where the trub is allowed
to settle from the cold wort, rack off the next day, pitch yeast. I have done this.

8
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Orval Brewing
« on: April 30, 2016, 06:47:31 PM »
Quote
"It is in the cold wort that we add liquid sugar candy"

Wait a minute!  Doesn't it all sink to the bottom when added to cold wort?  Perhaps it's just stirred in.

Wonder if Candi Syrup out of the package is sanitary enough to just pour in cold wort.  Probably is, haven't tried it though.
The yeast will find their food. Then they eat it!

9
General Homebrew Discussion / Orval Brewing
« on: April 30, 2016, 04:58:50 PM »
Hadn't seen this before. The translation is a little rough. Nice pictures. Horizontal tanks.
http://www.orval.be/en/58/How-Orval-beer-is-made

10
I asked a few about US breweries that use DO water. DO water is produced for boiler feed water and pushing beer long distances. The macros use it to also dilute the high gravity brews down to packaged strength. Since it it the water in the brewery, they use it for mashing. A guy with the initials JP said Sierra Nevada and Firestone Walker use DO water for the mash. Both of those also have GEA Huppmann brew houses with Millstar wet mills.

So US breweries mash with DO water. I'm not sure if they use the same ingredients (malt), or other processes like Augustiner. I do think Sierra Nevada makes some tasty lagers, and they did get a WBC Gold for a German Pilsner in 2010. They had it that year.

11
Beer Travel / Re: Denver
« on: April 29, 2016, 03:59:11 PM »
Two weeks ago we drove from Santa Fe to Denver, knew we would hit some snow, but not blizzard conditions. Had a meet up with a friend who just started a new job in Broomfield. 4-Noses was pretty good. Went to The Post, and had good beer and really good food, Louisville I think. Stopped into a couple places in Erie the next day, that is where his house is being built, and those were Good to.

12

Did you say mill? This is German, many craft breweries have these. Sierra Nevada, Bells, Firestone Walker to name three. I remember from Sierra Nevada Beer Camp back in 2009, they said they were milling under N2.

http://www.gea.com/global/en/binaries/MILLSTAR_0813_EN_tcm11-12176.pdf

There is quite a bit in that marketing brochure about minimizing contact with oxygen.

Yah think? Yeah. I wonder what brewhouse Augustiner has?

13

Did you say mill? This is German, many craft breweries have these. Sierra Nevada, Bells, Firestone Walker to name three. I remember from Sierra Nevada Beer Camp back in 2009, they said they were milling under N2.

http://www.gea.com/global/en/binaries/MILLSTAR_0813_EN_tcm11-12176.pdf

Is that done for freshness? Or for safety? Grain dust is a major fire hazard, milling under an inert gas would prevent a far more explosive form or oxidation.

It is optional if you look at the file. Wet milling means no dust, so no explosion. So it is done to keep O2 out.

14
Mash in a modified Sanke keg purged with Nitrogen, or better yet Argon.  Boil is a pressure cooker, likewise purged.  Use an inline chiller to transfer to fermentation vessel to avoid all Oxygenation prior to reaching pitch temp.  Simple right?

The whole thing is silly, there is enough air trapped in your grist to reach saturation in your strike water and plenty of surface area for dissolution to occur across.  The campden tablet is the only thing that seems to make any sense at all, and then wouldn't you be creating sulfides rather then oxides anyway (or would they replace peroxides...)?

Can you please expound on your gas choices?  IE why argon over nitro or CO2.  Heavier/safer/cheaper?  I am curious if purging mill setup/cooler/kettle would also be worthwhile...

Did you say mill? This is German, many craft breweries have these. Sierra Nevada, Bells, Firestone Walker to name three. I remember from Sierra Nevada Beer Camp back in 2009, they said they were milling under N2.

http://www.gea.com/global/en/binaries/MILLSTAR_0813_EN_tcm11-12176.pdf

15
Do commercial breweries aerate their wort? If yes, how? I have never seen this during any brewery tour.

I believe they usually sparge oxygen inline as the cooled wort travels to the fermenter.

Yep. Maybe another case of what commercial brewers do not being applicable to homebrewers.

I know a guy who did inline O2 injunction at home, one his 1 bbl system before going pro.

I would consider 1 bbl. on the verge of being a commercial brewery.

That was the point!

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