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Messages - Brewtopalonian

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31
All Grain Brewing / Re: LODO and Decoction Mashing
« on: July 02, 2019, 11:25:07 PM »
All the stirring and then the scooping it out and returning it to the mash are all points where you can pickup oxygen exposure.   I suppose that there could be some sort of amazing piece of equipment that would do it all in a closed system that never exposed it to air...but I certainly don't have that.
Cool, yeah it was a long shot, but I had to ask if anyone figured a way to do it without too much O2 pickup.  I am kinda bummed because I really don't think there's a way to impart the typical Bavarian toasty flavors without Decoction mashing, at the same time I know a lot of big breweries use LoDO in Germany....  Catch 22 here.

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Try the low oxygen routine and you may be surprised.  It's not about GETTING those flavors in there, it's about KEEPING them in there, they're already in the good Pilsner malt.  Just don't want them all running off with the oxygen before you get to enjoy them.
Well I'm making a Munich Dunkel this go around so I will just utilize the decoctions as I normally do for this style.  But maybe I try it with a Pilsner.  Thanks Robert!

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If I ever tried decoctions, it would surely be with a Dunkel.  As I understand it the dark malt can really have a lot more color and flavor drawn out by the boiling.  With Pilsner malt, there's just none of that to draw out.  You can boil it all day and it won't turn into dark malt!

Back in 2006, when I did my decoction experiment, one of the beers I brewed was a dunkel, one version single infusion, the other single decoction.  No one could tell the difference.  FWIW, same results with a German pils.
Huh, cool!  For whatever reason, I've done the experiment myself with a pils Urquell clone and could definitely notice the difference.  Can't argue with results though.  If you had a bunch of people not be able to tell the difference then it definitely wouldn't be worth the extra effort.

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Start on pg. 25.....http://www.ahaconference.org/wp-content/uploads/presentations/2008/DennyConn.pdf
Super cool!  Thanks for that!  So, what's your opinion on LODO then Denny?  Should I forgo Decoction for LoDO?  Should I skip both and just infuse? 

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32
All Grain Brewing / Re: LODO and Decoction Mashing
« on: July 02, 2019, 11:18:59 PM »
All the stirring and then the scooping it out and returning it to the mash are all points where you can pickup oxygen exposure.   I suppose that there could be some sort of amazing piece of equipment that would do it all in a closed system that never exposed it to air...but I certainly don't have that.
Cool, yeah it was a long shot, but I had to ask if anyone figured a way to do it without too much O2 pickup.  I am kinda bummed because I really don't think there's a way to impart the typical Bavarian toasty flavors without Decoction mashing, at the same time I know a lot of big breweries use LoDO in Germany....  Catch 22 here.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
Try the low oxygen routine and you may be surprised.  It's not about GETTING those flavors in there, it's about KEEPING them in there, they're already in the good Pilsner malt.  Just don't want them all running off with the oxygen before you get to enjoy them.
Well I'm making a Munich Dunkel this go around so I will just utilize the decoctions as I normally do for this style.  But maybe I try it with a Pilsner.  Thanks Robert!

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
If I ever tried decoctions, it would surely be with a Dunkel.  As I understand it the dark malt can really have a lot more color and flavor drawn out by the boiling.  With Pilsner malt, there's just none of that to draw out.  You can boil it all day and it won't turn into dark malt!

Back in 2006, when I did my decoction experiment, one of the beers I brewed was a dunkel, one version single infusion, the other single decoction.  No one could tell the difference.  FWIW, same results with a German pils.
Huh, cool!  For whatever reason, I've done the experiment myself with a pils Urquell clone and could definitely notice the difference.  Can't argue with results though.  If you had a bunch of people not be able to tell the difference then it definitely wouldn't be worth the extra effort.

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33
All Grain Brewing / Re: LODO and Decoction Mashing
« on: July 02, 2019, 10:26:54 PM »
All the stirring and then the scooping it out and returning it to the mash are all points where you can pickup oxygen exposure.   I suppose that there could be some sort of amazing piece of equipment that would do it all in a closed system that never exposed it to air...but I certainly don't have that.
Cool, yeah it was a long shot, but I had to ask if anyone figured a way to do it without too much O2 pickup.  I am kinda bummed because I really don't think there's a way to impart the typical Bavarian toasty flavors without Decoction mashing, at the same time I know a lot of big breweries use LoDO in Germany....  Catch 22 here.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
Try the low oxygen routine and you may be surprised.  It's not about GETTING those flavors in there, it's about KEEPING them in there, they're already in the good Pilsner malt.  Just don't want them all running off with the oxygen before you get to enjoy them.
Well I'm making a Munich Dunkel this go around so I will just utilize the decoctions as I normally do for this style.  But maybe I try it with a Pilsner.  Thanks Robert!

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
If I ever tried decoctions, it would surely be with a Dunkel.  As I understand it the dark malt can really have a lot more color and flavor drawn out by the boiling.  With Pilsner malt, there's just none of that to draw out.  You can boil it all day and it won't turn into dark malt!
I disagree a little.  Color isn't the only reason for Decoction.  I am a firm believer that boiling of the grain really draws out that bread crust delicious toasty flavor we all drool over in a good pilsner. 

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34
All Grain Brewing / Re: LODO and Decoction Mashing
« on: July 02, 2019, 10:11:31 PM »
All the stirring and then the scooping it out and returning it to the mash are all points where you can pickup oxygen exposure.   I suppose that there could be some sort of amazing piece of equipment that would do it all in a closed system that never exposed it to air...but I certainly don't have that.
Cool, yeah it was a long shot, but I had to ask if anyone figured a way to do it without too much O2 pickup.  I am kinda bummed because I really don't think there's a way to impart the typical Bavarian toasty flavors without Decoction mashing, at the same time I know a lot of big breweries use LoDO in Germany....  Catch 22 here.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
Try the low oxygen routine and you may be surprised.  It's not about GETTING those flavors in there, it's about KEEPING them in there, they're already in the good Pilsner malt.  Just don't want them all running off with the oxygen before you get to enjoy them.
Well I'm making a Munich Dunkel this go around so I will just utilize the decoctions as I normally do for this style.  But maybe I try it with a Pilsner.  Thanks Robert!

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


35
All Grain Brewing / Re: LODO and Decoction Mashing
« on: July 02, 2019, 09:53:31 PM »
All the stirring and then the scooping it out and returning it to the mash are all points where you can pickup oxygen exposure.   I suppose that there could be some sort of amazing piece of equipment that would do it all in a closed system that never exposed it to air...but I certainly don't have that.
Cool, yeah it was a long shot, but I had to ask if anyone figured a way to do it without too much O2 pickup.  I am kinda bummed because I really don't think there's a way to impart the typical Bavarian toasty flavors without Decoction mashing, at the same time I know a lot of big breweries use LoDO in Germany....  Catch 22 here.

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36
All Grain Brewing / Re: LODO and Decoction Mashing
« on: July 02, 2019, 09:46:51 PM »
Decoctions are basically incompatible with low oxygen brewing due to the oxygen you will pick up during those steps.  If you want to try out low oxygen brewing I would stick with a non-decoction mashing regiments.
Thanks Nate!  Kind of what I thought.  I was thinking that the boiling of the thick mash might negate that.

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37
All Grain Brewing / LODO and Decoction Mashing
« on: July 02, 2019, 09:26:07 PM »
I am in a dilemma right now as I want to try my hand at low dissolved oxygen brewing but I also want to use a Decoction mash schedule.  My question is fairly simple, does Decoction mashing destroy the purpose of low oxygen brewing?  Secondary question; if not, is there a Best practice I should be utilizing?

Thanks for your input!

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38
Beer Recipes / Re: First Attempt at Recipe-Making
« on: July 02, 2019, 09:10:02 PM »
Looks pretty okay... I would cut back significantly on the honey and Cara malts.  I'd do less than 2.5% honey and get rid of your c-80 and instead use debittered black patent at around .15# to bring in those beautiful garnet/Ruby colors. 

I'm not sure how I feel about Perle as your bittering hop with American hop additions.  I might consider bittering with Cascade instead. Just my .02¢

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39
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Is my fermentation contaminated?
« on: June 23, 2019, 03:19:59 PM »
Looks fine to me.  Is this the first really hoppy beer you've made?  That looks like bits of hops floating.

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40
All Grain Brewing / Re: increasing abv
« on: March 27, 2019, 10:48:03 PM »
Yes it's absolutely possible any convertible sugar will suffice.  Most obviously, dextrose comes to mind.  If you want to increase your complexity, black strap molasses is a good idea, though be wary, it is a very strong flavor.  Maybe combine blackstrap molasses with some dextrose.  Honey is also another viable option that can add a lot of depth of flavor.  As for how much, you need to look up how many points per pound per gallon each will provide.  Most I believe are 35 ppg/p.  I don't know if I helped at all, but if it we're me I'd do a combination of both molasses and honey.  Bear in mind that a higher alcohol beer will require a longer aging/maturation period in order to smooth out.  Good luck and I look forward to hearing how it turns out and what you decided to do!

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41
All Grain Brewing / Re: First Time All Grain Questions
« on: March 27, 2019, 03:35:26 PM »
Good Morning Scott,

I am brewing as well today, but thought I'd give you some help before I get started:

1) In regards to your whirlpool, if you don't have a brew kettle with a whirlpool port, then you can simply place the hose over the side of the kettle and up against the wall of the kettle pointed in one direction or the other (whichever way you want the whirlpool to go, doesn't matter).  Typically, a whirlpool will come with a time, on this recipe it says 30 mins which means you will begin the whirlpool immediately after flame out and whirlpool for 30 mins after flame out trying to maintain a temperature of 140*F (as per the recipe you sited).  So you can cool to 140 using a counter flow / plate chiller / immersion chiller and then stop cooling and put the heat back on ever so slightly to maintain 140*F for 30 mins.  I think this also answered your question in 2b.

2) a)  It is a complicated recipe to dive into as a first time all grain brewer, however not impossible by any means.  If you have brewing software, I recommend simply putting the ingredients into the software with their percentages and then scaling the recipe for your setup to reach the desired OG and BU/GU ratio.  This would be the easiest way to do it.  Otherwise you'll have to do some math, and lets face it, no one likes to do math!  Basically you keep the percentages the same (ratio of grist) and adjust to get to the gravity in the volume you want. I hope this makes some sense to you.

c) The dry hopping assumption you made is correct.  Wait until terminal gravity is reached, then add your first (5 day dry hops) then after three days, add your 2 day hops.  Then it's time to rack to keg/bottle and pull the dry hops bag.  Also, don't forget to add your blueberry puree BEFORE doing this dry hop schedule to allow fermentation to kick off again and reach terminal gravity.  I would be very careful about handling the puree and maintain a sanitary environment.  If you're worried about it, you can always pasteurize your blueberry puree with some gentle heat or use some campden tablets to stabilize the puree. 

Good luck, you've got your work cut out for you for your first brew, but it should be rewarding! 

42
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: BJCP entrance exam
« on: March 22, 2019, 02:32:18 PM »
Thanks Jeff, that's some excellent information and certainly going to adjust how I study. 

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43
You can certainly dilute your water with distilled. 

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44
I would get an RO unit and build from scratch.  You've got very hard water and a lot of Sulfate.  It could lend to harsh flavors with hops.  Calcium looks good for brewing though.  I also suffer from very hard and mineralized water.  I bought an under sink RO unit relatively cheaply and it's improved my brewing ten fold.

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45
All Grain Brewing / Re: ph meter
« on: March 18, 2019, 08:34:15 PM »
Appreciate the device recommends fellas.  I will check them out. 

dmtaylor - which chinese cheap meter are you talking about? 

[quote author=BrewBama link=topic=33253.msg424425#msg424425 date=1552936725
However, I do take my sample at 20 min and let it cool to room temp before checking pH. By the time it’s cooled off I am well into the mash and any pH adjustment at that point would be shutting the gate after the cow has left the barn.

I guess this is what confuses me.  I really dont see the point in spending $100+ for an instrument, for readings that are too late in teh process.  I mean, what am I learning by waiting to test a sample at room temp?  Am I missing something here?
[/quote]You can cool your sample quickly in an ice water bath.  You don't need much to test. 

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