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Messages - thcipriani

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Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Wyeast 1469...Sulphur??
« on: March 23, 2012, 01:57:53 AM »
you can also try hooking the gas up to the beer out post (use some lube here so it comes off after) and push the co2 through the beer. keep bleeding it off as you do it and see if that speeds it up at all.

That's been my experience with sulfur – tends to blow off after a week or two of purging and refilling the headspace of the keg.

Never turns out the best beer, but it is OK after sulfur dissipates.

My suspicion is that most sulfur comes from yeast stress due to over-pitching AND/OR insufficient FAN.

Recent Trial—German Hefe
  • Pitching rate: 15e6 cells/mL (common is 5–7e6 cells/mL)
  • Result: Complete loss of banana & huge sulfur production & green-beer diacetyl production.
  • Reasoning: Older (less healthy) cell population resulted in stressed yeast – coupled with lack of necessary nutrients to support such a large population of yeast (particularly amino-acids which may be lacking in wheat)

Edit – also saw this article on overpitching/diacetyl – may not be directly useful:

My 2¢

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Wyeast 1469...Sulphur??
« on: March 22, 2012, 01:06:14 PM »
OG is 1.056.  8oz DME in a 1/2 gal starter.  I've always used a wine degasser for aerating the carboy.  Maybe 60 seconds of continuous aeration.  It was a fast starting fermentation.  I've emailed Wyeast to see if this yeast throw sulphur.

That all seems normal.

Did you use any adjuncts, sulfites (campden tablets) or nutrient (DAP, Fermaid K, Wyeast BCN etc)?

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Wyeast 1469...Sulphur??
« on: March 22, 2012, 03:54:31 AM »
Someone tell me I don't have a damned infection.

I doubt you have a damned infection.

Anyone else had anything similar happen with WY1469?

Nope. Never with that yeast.

I am curious – what was your original gravity and what was your approximate pitching rate? Did you oxygenate and, if so, for how long and by what method?

Equipment and Software / Re: Cheapest/best wort chilling device.
« on: March 17, 2012, 04:16:17 PM »
The cheapest chilling method is the one you covet – you're going to, at some point, buy the chiller you want so just forgo a few batches and save up for that Therminator you want.

You'll waste a lot of money buying "cheaper" chilling methods.

This is from experience.  I own two IC's, one counterflow and a therminator – could have saved a lot just buying what I wanted in the first place.

Ingredients / Re: Minty hop taste?
« on: March 17, 2012, 03:24:12 AM »

I've heard people smarter than me say that there is little to no change in the molecular weight of proteins in the mash. Don't know if I believe it.

Not sure I understand that, you are aparently changing the protein enough that it no longer functions as a foam-promoting protein.  But I haven't researched this.

Check out Charlie Bamforth on the BeerSmith podcast:

At ~31:25 Bamforth talks about a study done by Michael Lewis that argues that there is actually no protein breakdown in mashing – only in malting.

I've heard people smarter than me say that there is little to no change in the molecular weight of proteins in the mash. Don't know if I believe it.

Do winemakers use a formol assay or use a spectrophotometer typically?

Another point is that excess FAN can result in the formation of diacytel.

Fermaid K has something like 17ppm YAN as does Wyeast's BCN – not sure about servo.

Pitching rate, to some extent, determine if you have excess of FAN (i.e. if you pitch 15e6/mL you have too much FAN – the yeast won't use it, you'll have a diacytel problem).

All Grain Brewing / Re: Mike McDole...Brew System...Recipes?
« on: March 15, 2012, 07:22:18 PM »
Can't find it now, but I know I saw some pics of his brewing setup on TBN forums. I think it had something to do with Big Brew Day a couple of years back.

IIRC, it was 2 keggles, 3 pumps, 3 bayou burners and 1 Italian kettle. Could be wrong – can't find the pics about which I was thinking. 

The pics were probably from ~'08.

EDIT: found -

If you're looking for KOH check out essentials depot – they have food grade they'll ship you.

Be sure to add the KOH to water and not the other way around. You'll do 112.22g in 1L distilled water for a 2N solution.

I did it in a PP nalgene – you'll want something heat-safe it's an exothermal reaction. I think I remember reading you want to avoid storage in glass, too. Goggle and glove up!

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Crazy pH drop during fermentation
« on: March 12, 2012, 04:38:21 PM »
I'll do a more detailed write-up later, but the initial results were shocking.

I'm very interested in your write up. I've been using Steve Piatz's water recommendation from a recent zymurgy (200ppm hardness as CaCO3) but I don't actually add any carbonates to the water.

I adjust the must to pH >4 pre-ferment with 2N KOH and throughout fermentation (as per the 2008ish Kristen England NHC mead presentation). Never seen that dramatic of a drop in pH though.

Good stuff!

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Determining yeast numbers?
« on: March 06, 2012, 02:14:41 PM »
The question of acquiring a scope and hemocytometer is a decision that's still up in the air for me.

I think everyone ought to own a scope given how cheap they are. You can get a cell count with 400x.
I use this scope and it's been great for years:

WRT eye-strain, I know you can buy adapters for your dslr or other cameras that'll replace the eyepiece.

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Determining yeast numbers?
« on: March 03, 2012, 03:18:12 PM »
The other application that I think would be really awesome is determining FAN content for meads.

Looks like you could also do IBU:

Also, looks like, could be used for carbon-filtered water chlorine, diacetyl, etc

I have to say that the lab part is one of my favorite parts of the process – almost as addictive as the brewing   ;)

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Determining yeast numbers?
« on: March 03, 2012, 05:55:26 AM »
Any good links to resources for using a spec in brewing?

I use the White Labs nutrient for all my batches. Good thought though. Also, the first batch I brewed I fermented around 64. The second I did at 58. The 58 degree one actually had less of the sulphur character. I am totally stumped what the problem was. Definitely open to any suggestions.
What was your pitching rate and O2 rate? I recently pitched a hefe with 3068 at 12E6/mL, O2 to 13 mg/L – really sulfury.

I recently read an abstract on the MBAA site about how beers with pitching rates of 3, 6, 9 and 12E6/mL finished with an even cell count. Higher pitching rates lead to older cell populations. My theory is that a low vitality (resulting from an older cell population) yeast is either more likely to produce sulfur OR is less able to clean sulfur out after creating it.

Tried to brew the same hefe recently with identical process, but pitched at 6E9/mL (and 8.5mg/L O2) and it tastes great.

Grasping at straws, more data points would be helpful.

All Grain Brewing / Re: Decoction Boil Time
« on: January 15, 2012, 07:09:29 AM »
What I'd like to see (what everyone wants) is a definitive experiment. I'm talking controlled, double-blind, triangle-tested, standard-deviation-recorded, ACTUAL experiment. An experiment upon which one, at a homebrew level, could draw a definitive conclusion. My constant rant about homebrewing is that so called experiments don't stand up to scrutiny (i.e. I brewed two beers and one tasted better - really?). Let's go after this like we'd go after FDA approval -- where's Mashweasel? Who knows how to structure and experiment? Who knows statistics? I know that my data points are insufficient. I'll help in any way I can if someone can tell me how to factor out randomness and bias. Let's actually produce something.

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