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Messages - goschman

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Beer Recipes / Re: first saison
« on: July 14, 2016, 07:09:00 AM »
     Although it is way over style at 48.8 IBUs, only 21.2 come from the bittering charge, so to me it does not come off as overly bitter. When I first made it, it was the first saison I had made. It came out as I had expected, thus I have remade it 1x and again in 2 weeks. The Nelson at 20 minutes adds 27.6 IBUs, but with the Nelson character added that late, I really dont perceive too much bitterness from that charge.
     I guess I am wondering most about whether or not the secondary ingredients will drown out the Nelson completely, making it easy to drop it from the recipe. In that case, I would likely up the Willamette to keep the IBUs up there to offset some of the sweetness from the blackberries. The lemon balm is just something we have growing in the garden after reading about someone adding it to a saison a couple years back. I really have no strong idea about what it will bring or how powerful it will be in the finished product, hence my questions. Just trying to learn something new everyday I guess

In my experience, if you are trying to highlight a particular flavor I would back off or remove the late hops. I would likely remove the Nelson @ flameout. I am basically in the same predicament which is why I chose willamette and centennial in smaller amounts at the end of the boil than originally planned. Take my advice with a grain of salt since I have no experience with those hops or secondary ingredients. Sounds like nelson could work well with fruit and lemon balm and someone can likely chime regarding that.

Often, I want to brew a beer that achieves several things and encompasses the ideas of what should be 3 different beers but in the end (with a few exceptions) it usually ends up more muddled. For some reason, I think I can somehow brew a hoppy saison with lemon and basil but in the end I realize that is probably not a good idea...

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Oktoberfest Ale
« on: July 13, 2016, 01:41:19 PM »
Before I could do lagers I did a mocktoberfest using US05. It may have not be 'lager-like' per se but it was still clean, damn good, and tasted very German to me. If it was me, I would just go with what is the easiest and least stressful for you out of the options presented. Sometimes it's better to go the path of least resistance instead of worrying about the semantics of a style. In short, a good ocktoberfest recipe with ale yeast will still be very tasty.

Beer Recipes / Re: first saison
« on: July 13, 2016, 12:47:50 PM »
Hijack away. I think I got what I needed. Just need to make a decision regarding the amount of rye and possibly the hops.

Not trying to start a 3724 vs 3711 argument as that is obviously a personal preference.

69franx: how is that hop character at 48 IBUs? I have been going back and forth with the prospect of using basil/lemon or going hoppy instead.

Beer Recipes / Re: first saison
« on: July 13, 2016, 11:10:59 AM »
As rare as it might be, I prefer 3711 against 3724 in saisons I have tasted and don't want to worry about the dreaded stall. I really like 3711 and heard that Belle is similar. I have had a packet in the fridge for quite a while that needs to be used.

Beer Recipes / Re: first saison
« on: July 13, 2016, 10:11:39 AM »
Personally, I would go with a higher percentage of Rye. Anything below 20% I do not find to be noticeable. Looks good otherwise.

That's solid advice.

Beer Recipes / Re: first saison
« on: July 13, 2016, 09:18:54 AM »
Sasion is a pretty wide open style so you'll get lots of different answers. Don't worry about it being too light - sasions are all over the map in terms of color (and flavor). Mine is light, too. But it needs to be highly attenuated, and Belle will get you there. Mashing @ 147-148F/ 90 mins will get it down to the 1.004-1.002 range or slightly lower, but Belle will leave a nice mouthfeel. As for the hops, it's personal preference. I wouldn't go too heavy with late hops given the lemon and basil additions. But if it sounds good, go for it.

Thanks Jon. I thought I might get a wide range of responses since it is such an open style. I will plan on extending my mash to 90 min.

Beer Recipes / first saison
« on: July 13, 2016, 09:01:33 AM »
First go round at a saison as my last attempt didn't have the proper yeast and turned out to be closer to a wit. Kind of going for a kitchen sink type thing here with a couple of questions.

First, will the hops clash with the lemon and basil additions? Should I scale the finishing hops back or remove them all together? I wanted to do something more hop forward but figured I shouldn't go too hoppy with the basil and lemon...

Second, can I expect 90% or greater attenuation from Belle Saison? What mash temp should I use? Should I add any sugar?

Lastly, do I need to even worry about color? This is calculated to be super light at around 3.7 SRM

72.1% pilsner
9.3% rye
9.3% wheat
9.3% flaked oats

~24 IBU
magnum 60 min
1 oz willamette 5 min
1/2 oz centennial 5 min

1/2 oz fresh sweet basil 5 min
zest of 2 lemons 5 min

Belle Saison started at 64F then let free rise above 75F after the first few days.

OG 1.052
FG 1.005? (considering 90% attenuation)

Consumption has gone up over the summer so trying to squeeze in a couple of sessions sooner than usual. Sunday is an APA formed with the help of others here.

100% golden promise
Bravo 60 min bittering to ~50 IBU
1 oz each of comet, cascade, ahtanum @ 0 min
1 oz each of comet, cascade, ahtanum @ dry hop

K97 (only because I don't have any US05 on hand)
~5.9% ABV

Ingredients / Re: Adding Citrus Peel to light ale
« on: July 08, 2016, 12:21:15 PM »
Just brewed a saison with a small amount of lemon zest added with 5 min left in boil. Jury is still out as it is in primary chugging away.

How much did you use? I am planning on this for an upcoming saison.

Ingredients / Re: Advice on adding Basil to a Saison
« on: July 08, 2016, 08:29:16 AM »
I've landed on half ounce with mine. I used an ounce once and it was killer, but a buddy did the same and it was way too strong. Different basils? Flowering homegrown versus commercial?

I add at flame out. See above.

Thanks! I think I will go with 1/2 oz basil and the zest of a couple of lemons at flameout. Thinking a couple ounces of cascade or centennial too...

Ingredients / Re: Adding Citrus Peel to light ale
« on: July 08, 2016, 07:22:42 AM »
I have had good success with adding zest at the end of the boil or after fermentation has slowed. When added to the fermenter, the character will come through a lot more. I have done a lime/lemongrass blonde that was great when added at the end of the boil but too much when added in the fermenter.

You will get the most control as dmtaylor suggests...

Ingredients / Re: Advice on adding Basil to a Saison
« on: July 08, 2016, 07:19:19 AM »
Also any advice on hops to pair with it? I wanted to brew a hoppy saison with a citrusy character but am thinking that it may clash with the basil. Should I stick with something more noble?

Ingredients / Re: Advice on adding Basil to a Saison
« on: July 08, 2016, 07:08:40 AM »
Resurrecting this old thread. I am planning on incorporating some sweet basil and possibly citrus zest into an upcoming saison.

I am planning to keep it very simple and just mince it and add it to the end of the boil. I want to keep the basil flavor reasonably light so was thinking maybe 1/2 oz. Any other advice regarding amounts of fresh basil to use?

All Grain Brewing / Re: 100% base malt for APA
« on: July 07, 2016, 11:08:30 AM »
to me it won't turn out any more complex than and English golden ale 12A

Never had one. You tell me. APA or EGA? Malt complexity is not the goal here.

50 IBUs
100% GP
K97 yeast
~5.9% ABV
bravo - bittering 50 IBUs
comet, cascade, ahtanum - flameout
comet, cascade, ahtanum - dry hop

All Grain Brewing / Re: 100% base malt for APA
« on: July 06, 2016, 09:42:44 AM »
Golden Promise is the winner. Thanks! Hoping to brew this weekend or next.

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