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Messages - roguejim

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46
All Grain Brewing / Re: Hefe sulfur
« on: August 19, 2012, 11:08:15 AM »
Yes, it should age out. There isn't much else that's practical anyway.

btw, it's not the yeast that reduces the sulfur notes that you are talking about. if I remember correctly it's actually oxidation. That's why sulfur helps beer stability. But I agree that this aroma is very distracting.

Kai

So, do you let it age out in the fermentation vessel before kegging?  Is there any way to avoid this right from the start?  I dumped almost an entire kegged dunkelweizen due to sulphur.

47
Equipment and Software / Promash help needed...Evaporation rate
« on: August 13, 2012, 03:06:05 AM »
I can't seem to change the Evaporation Rate.  I've been in the System Settings, but can't seem to figure it out.  I want the Evaporation Rate to be 2 gallons per hour.  This is how it currently looks:

Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------

Evaporation Rate:      15.00    Percent Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size:    8.24    Gal
Pre-Boil Gravity:      1.048    SG          11.87  Plato



48
Beer Recipes / Re: Winter warmer with homegrown Chinook?
« on: August 12, 2012, 06:11:45 PM »
Really, Jeff?  9 months?  So you plan on possibly dry hopping after it has been conditioning for 9 months?  I agree that a little time takes away some of the harshness, but I never really considered a 9 month conditioning period.  It sounds like you're treating it as an historic English IPA.  But frankly, I don't understand how Chinook could really pass for an English bittering hop.

49
All Grain Brewing / Re: Efficiency Issues
« on: August 12, 2012, 01:24:56 PM »
Yeah, I'd like to see the recipe's grain bill and SG, and the actual efficiency you're getting, i.e., what %?  You might want to check your grain after it's been crushed for unbroken kernels.  In my past experience, low efficiency has nearly always been the result of a poor crush.  Are you by chance using a large percent of wheat?

50
Equipment and Software / Re: 7 micron filter system
« on: August 11, 2012, 11:22:12 AM »
Here are some remarks from Tasty that I've copied from the BN Forum:

Tasty:
"I use the 6-side plate filter that's available from various retailers. I bought mine at morebeer: http://morebeer.com/view_product/5676/ I use the 7 micron filters that I can only find at Williams Brewing. I've tried lower microns with marginally better results and unneeded problems. I found that with 7 microns and reasonably clear beer (2-7 days at 35F works), I can filter 10 gallons with one pair of filters. I pretty much follow the instructions that come with the filter. Things they generally don't mention are 1. flush the target keg and filter housing with CO2 2. run some of the beer off from the source keg until it's clear. 3. When filtering two kegs, don't let the dregs from the first keg go into the filter. 4. Never leave the area where you are doing the filtering because you will eventually forget and find your finished beer all over the floor. And if anyone ever tells you that filtering strips flavor and color, tell them "Mike McDole said those are recipe issues".

Here was a question by DannyW followed by Tasty's reply:
DannyW:"I wonder if those pads are really 7.0 micron, or are the 0.7 micron? I see the William's brewing site says they sell 7, 3, 1 micron. Morebeer sells "rough" (2 micron), "polish" (0.7 micron) and "sterile" (0.35 micron).  I have a sneaking suspicion that they are actually the same pads, but perhaps William's pads are showing absolute and the B3 pads are showing nominal? I know I have been able to push 10 gallons of beer through both the B3 rough and B3 polish filters without much trouble."
"
Tasty:
"You may be right about the absolute vs nominal micron differences in filter ratings but I know for sure that the Williams filters are about 25% thicker. I feel that I get a better seal with that extra thickness. It may be psychological though."

Tasty:
"I only use the 3 micron pads when the 7 micron pads fail to clear the beer. That usually implies some sort of protein/tannin and unless the beer is for some special purpose like a friend's wedding or competition, I usually just leave the haze, apologize every time I pour someone a pint, and fix the problem in my process or ingredients. (I'm talking about the pads from Williams here. The last time I used MoreBeer pads they were similar but different.)

When I say to adjust the recipe if you feel filtering has an effect, I'm not saying that's an analytical adjustment before you make the beer but instead a subjective adjustment after you taste the filtered beer. If the beer lacks bitterness, aroma, mouthfeel, or whatever, adjust the recipe or process accordingly. When someone gives me a recipe and I know they don't filter, I never make any adjustments because I feel that filtering has no effect on what I like in beer. I don't have any science but I really doubt that anything good in beer is larger than 7 microns. When someone puts a $5.50 pint of cloudy IPA in front of me, I have to wonder why the brewer would want that stuff floating in there to leave the brewery. I definitely don't want it.

So whether is finings or filtering, for me, it's not beer until it's clear.

Just sayin...."

GordonStrong:
"Have you ever noticed any oxidation being introduced from the filtering process, or do you do anything special to mitigate it? I haven't but LHBS people were warning about it."

Tasty:
"Certainly oxidation introduction is the largest risk with any transfer and a filter adds a lot more points of failure. I'm always watchful for bubbles appearing in the transfer tubing. It's easy to assume it's CO2 that has naturally dissolved into the unfiltered beer. There's a plastic "Y" connector that joins the two outbound sides of the filter. I recently heard from a brewer who had a crack in his and was oxidizing all his beers. Not what you want to be doing in the final steps of making the beer.

I always flush the filter with CO2 right before starting the filtering process. I also run about a half pint of beer out into my dump bucket. I rarely use fining agents. I generally store the racked beer at 34F for a week so by the time I filter, it's pretty clear (not bright) to begin with. 7 micron seems to give me just the clarity I'm looking for."

Tasty:
"Cartridge and plate both have their advantages and disadvantages. I'm open to both and have used both. I always go with whatever requires less work and the least chance of contamination unless there's a substantial cost factor.

In terms of does filtering effect flavor, of course it does. If it looks different it probably is different. Can you perceive the difference and is it enough to call for a recipe change? Filter half the batch and do a blind tasting. I've done it and the filtered beer always tastes better to me. Of course, I'm looking for a clean unobstructed bitterness and malt backbone so you would expect I'd like the beer without the yeast and protein."






51
Equipment and Software / Re: 7 micron filter system
« on: August 10, 2012, 06:30:08 PM »
I don't have an answer, but do you mind summarizing his reasons?

I gelatin fine my beers that I want to be crystal clear because, in my experience, conditioning and clearing are two separate things as long as your fermentation is complete.  Fining just makes things easier.  I assume that filtering is the same thing.

I generally wouldn't do this to an IPA or even a Belgian beer because the loss of hop solids or yeast seems to strip some of the flavor from them.

Tasty likes to say "jokingly", "It ain't beer until it's clear".  To a certain degree, he's trying to replicate commercial brewing with his own brewing hardware, hence, a micron filter.  Given that he competes, he probably doesn't like giving away points for hazy beer.  He has complained at being served hazy commercial beers. 

As for your final remarks/objections, Tasty gets a bit irritated since these are easily compensated for in the recipe.  "Leave the process alone, and adjust your recipe to compensate for perceived deficiencies in the process" would be a decent paraphrase of his thoughts on your objections.

52
Equipment and Software / 7 micron filter system
« on: August 10, 2012, 05:05:19 PM »
I've listened to Tasty McDole discuss his 7 micron filter system, and his reasons for using it.  Without getting into the pros and cons of such a system, who on this forum uses one?  Where did you buy it?

53
Ingredients / Re: Now THAT's some fresh yeast
« on: August 09, 2012, 02:16:32 PM »
Denny, do you order your yeast in advance to get fresher product?

54
Ingredients / Re: best way to dry hop
« on: August 07, 2012, 02:43:09 PM »
I took Tasty McDole and Jamil's lead by dry hopping (pellets) near the end of fermentation, no bags/sacks.  Tasty uses a conical however, so he is able to dump his trub from primary; Jamil, I believe, dry hops in secondary.  I've been dry hopping in primary, although I think I would dry hop in secondary if I was reusing the yeast from primary.

55
Ingredients / Re: Hop Hoarder
« on: July 27, 2012, 06:15:15 PM »
The LHBS gave me 1lb of outdated Magnum whole hops.  They are still in their 2oz aluminum baggies, are now 5 years old, and are still very pungent when opened.  Someone at HopUnion told me pellets will keep a couple of years in the freezer, leaf hops...about a year.  Frankly, I think they keep well much longer if vacuum sealed in the freezer.

56
All Grain Brewing / Re: Step Mashing a Hefe...Why?
« on: July 22, 2012, 03:14:15 PM »
In my opinion, unless you setup to do step mashing easily, i.e. HERMS or RIMS, it's more trouble than it's worth.  When I brewed my first hefeweizen, I employed a step mash, and it was a sloppy pain in a miss your numbers sort of way.  Since then, I have done single infusion mashes at 152 fermented at 62 and have turned out many batches that have all of the good qualities I look for in a hefeweizen. 

For what it's worth, I tried Jamil's very straightforward recipe and found it to be not the best I have made.  I have made the Great Bavarian Weissbier project recipe from the NB forum on multiple occasions and have found that to be very good, particularly if you drop the carafa ii addition or even sub in about 2% Melanoidin malt for it. 

As with anything, YMMV.

It seems odd that a straight forward hefe recipe would produce substandard results for you.  What do you attribute that to?  Just for the record, I note that Gordon took an NHC gold for his hefe, which was a straight forward recipe.  Of course, he employed a traditional decoction.  I'm not saying that decoction makes a better hefe, just that you can't blame Jamil's recipe, if that's what you imply. ;)

57
All Grain Brewing / Re: Step Mashing a Hefe...Why?
« on: July 22, 2012, 12:16:41 PM »
On pitch rate?  Honestly, I really don't worry about it very much.  I normally use one XL smack pack of 3068, and may or may not make a starter.  When I make starters, I'm usually making a 1L one, so I'm more interested in getting the yeast active and ready to go than I am in getting a large cell count increase.  I guess I'd agree that repitched 3068 seems to suck in comparison to fresh.  I thought it was because the yeast was unstable (since the beer does seem to go off faster than other styles) but I'll buy the cell count explanation.

I think that's the best advice yet, i.e., not to worry about it.  I have a link below to another thread with conflicting info between yeast calculators, and the yeast lab itself over cell viability.  At best, it's mainly guesswork determining the initial viable cell count, which makes the starter size question, also guesswork.  I seem to recall Denny not worrying too much about this either.

  http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=12311.0

58
I sent out beer to some of the guys on this forum, and the feedback I've received has been really enlightening. I've decided I have no ability to objectively evaluate small changes in my technique. I think I'm cool and smart, with a good palate, but it turns out I'm not capable at all to discern subtle differences in the beer I make. Other homebrewers also think they're cool and smart with a good palate, so I'm really starting to doubt the veracity of some of their claims regarding subtle differences.



Too few people take this objective viewpoint.  That's why I started doing blind group tasting years ago and why I so frequently question people who say that certain things make a definite difference in their beers.

Like decocting lagers, right?  I think that was one of your taste tests...Didn't some in the group actually prefer single infused over decocted lagers?

59
All Grain Brewing / Re: Step Mashing a Hefe...Why?
« on: July 21, 2012, 07:30:14 PM »
Jess was responding to my email, and knows I am a homebrewer.

Gordon, what do you think of Jess's recommendation in light of "El Hefe"?  By the way, thank you for your help in this thread.

60
All Grain Brewing / Re: Step Mashing a Hefe...Why?
« on: July 21, 2012, 12:38:21 PM »
Jess Caudill at Wyeast recommends 6 million cells/ml for WY3068 to obtain optimum ester formation. 

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