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Messages - narvin

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1
Beer Travel / Re: It's good to be in Asheville
« on: April 19, 2017, 05:10:05 AM »
FWIW - word on the street is Hi-Wire is killing it currently. Previously they were mediocre at best, but many good friends are giving them high marks. Another in the area is Zebulon Artisan Ales out of Weaverville. There wares are stellar.

Hi-Wire was excellent.  They had some awesome sour and Brett beers when we were there.

2
We all want to drink excellent beer.  I was extremely resistant to the "Shaken not stirred" process, mostly because I was set in my ways.  I think this is a good conversation, and these are good questions, aside from the personal attacks.



I gotta be honest, I was resistant to Mark's delivery at first too, which made it tough to see through to his methods. But he was right and was a wealth of good knowledge, and I use SNS on all my ales. I really think the topic of lowering O2 (hell, any topic) merits being able to share info and debate it in a good way.

The reason I finally decided to try SNS was because ultimately it was easier and less work.  That's not what LODO looks like to me.  It's not because I'm stuck in my ways, it's because making excellent beer is only a part of the reason I brew.

That's a fair critique.  But adjusting water with salts and acids or making starters in the first place was a step away from easy.  Pitching at high krauaen was actuallly less easy for me, since chilling and decanting gave me a multiple day window to brew.

3
We all want to drink excellent beer.  I was extremely resistant to the "Shaken not stirred" process, mostly because I was set in my ways.  I think this is a good conversation, and these are good questions, aside from the personal attacks.



I gotta be honest, I was resistant to Mark's delivery at first too, which made it tough to see through to his methods. But he was right and was a wealth of good knowledge, and I use SNS on all my ales. I really think the topic of lowering O2 (hell, any topic) merits being able to share info and debate it in a good way.

Presentation makes a big difference.  We're here for a hobby and no one wants to be berated.  But the flipside is that it's good to keep an open mind.  Hard to do, I know.

4
This thing is out of control again.

One thing that was emphasized early on is that spunding will actually make the biggest difference.  And this I totally agree with. Oxidation post fermentation has the biggest deleterious effect on my beer.  Charlie Bamforth agrees.  Try some incremental steps for yourself.  I was not disappointed.

He also agrees that mash oxidation *can* be a problem.  It's not the first place to worry about, but it's also far worse at the homebrew level due to the reality of the surface area / volume of a small batch.

As for sulfites, try it yourself.  Lots of people get no egg.  This experiment is a valid data point and it would be nice to figure out what happened here without the political bs.

Denny, I think that no stress is relative.  Was making a starter stressful once you got the hang of it?  There's a difference between no stress and no changes.

If spunding makes the biggest difference, why are people seeing positive results without it, yet not pre boiling your water makes LODO impossible? Sorry man, theres just so much double speak, so many exceptions to the rule.

Have you tried any of this?

The one thing I'll say about the all or nothing is that it was something I never agreed with from the get go.  But, I do see better results after preboiling than not preboiling, and the DO meter did show that in Bryan's experiments.  I'm not ready to dismiss it.

And nothing else really matters.  Each of us gets to decide.

We all want to drink excellent beer.  I was extremely resistant to the "Shaken not stirred" process, mostly because I was set in my ways.  I think this is a good conversation, and these are good questions, aside from the personal attacks.

5
I also think the wort color and clarity resulting from using sulfites showed a significant difference for me, for recipes I've brewed many years.  And it wasn't due to gravity, since I didn't have a lower gravity result.  Granted, I've only done a couple of batches.  Is it something that translates to better beer in the end?  Not quite convinced, but it's worth trying.  I have an excellent Pilsner on tap that was brewed without sulfites.

6
This thing is out of control again.

One thing that was emphasized early on is that spunding will actually make the biggest difference.  And this I totally agree with. Oxidation post fermentation has the biggest deleterious effect on my beer.  Charlie Bamforth agrees.  Try some incremental steps for yourself.  I was not disappointed.

He also agrees that mash oxidation *can* be a problem.  It's not the first place to worry about, but it's also far worse at the homebrew level due to the reality of the surface area / volume of a small batch.

As for sulfites, try it yourself.  Lots of people get no egg.  This experiment is a valid data point and it would be nice to figure out what happened here without the political bs.

Denny, I think that no stress is relative.  Was making a starter stressful once you got the hang of it?  There's a difference between no stress and no changes.

If spunding makes the biggest difference, why are people seeing positive results without it, yet not pre boiling your water makes LODO impossible? Sorry man, theres just so much double speak, so many exceptions to the rule.

Have you tried any of this?

The one thing I'll say about the all or nothing is that it was something I never agreed with from the get go.  But, I do see better results after preboiling than not preboiling, and the DO meter did show that in Bryan's experiments.  I'm not ready to dismiss it.

7
One thing that was emphasized early on is that spunding will actually make the biggest difference.  And this I totally agree with. Oxidation post fermentation has the biggest deleterious effect on my beer.  Charlie Bamforth agrees.  Try some incremental steps for yourself.  I was not disappointed.

He also agrees that mash oxidation *can* be a problem.  It's not the first place to worry about, but it's also far worse at the homebrew level due to the reality of the surface area / volume of a small batch.

As for sulfites, try it yourself.  Lots of people get no egg.  This experiment is a valid data point and it would be nice to figure out what happened here without the political bs.

Denny, I think that no stress is relative.  Was making a starter stressful once you got the hang of it?  There's a difference between no stress and no changes.

8
We've gone down this road before. babrewer is just as passionate about this as we are, just in the opposite direction on many points.

It never ends well. People get fired up. Threads get locked. No good for anyone.

The issue here is not a fight between those who support Low Oxygen and those who don't. It's whether process variables in the experiment may have contributed to the inconsistencies between sample beers.

I'm not necessarily for it or against it.  I've tried it a couple of times.  But when the only posts I see from someone are on a single topic topic and negative (as well as personal), I wish there were an ignore feature.

At this point I think it either has to be "If you don't want to hear about it, stay out of the topic".  Or take it to reddit or somewhere else where people want to interact like this.

9
Hey.. let's get Jake to do the lodo exbeeriment because he's done it a bunch of times and never gotten it right.

seems as though your entire post history involves a very specific theme? Mods, IP check?

Can we check what your problem is? 

10
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Making your own barrel
« on: April 10, 2017, 09:41:54 PM »
This is cool. Whenever I think something can't be done at home, I'm probably wrong.

11
Hahaha.  Ok, I had a good laugh tonight  :D

It's totally possible that something about the SMB, temperature, lower pH, recirculation, or combination of all of it caused the difference.  It's not so much dickchimping, just another difference in process that makes it so hard to quantitatively compare these things across different systems.

12
Kegging and Bottling / Re: Balancing beer line
« on: April 10, 2017, 09:32:27 PM »
It could definitely be the temperature difference between the beer and the line itself at the top of the kegerator.  Either way, better safe than sorry.  5-6 feet seems to be the sweet spot for me.

13
No, and yes... I know, bad answer.

I buy most things there, except when it comes to equipment.  It's hard to beat the best price online when you're a single store. Cooler: Walmart on end of season sale.  I bought a 20 gal pot from instawares and a motor from surplus center. I also bought pumps online.  But aside from some markups on big ticket items, I buy everything there.  Excellent prices and selection for sacks of malt, hops by the 1lb bag, yeast, etc. 

14
Ingredients / Re: Bulk Hops, now that NikoBrew is closed
« on: April 10, 2017, 09:16:58 PM »
It's funny, I have no interest in growing American hops.  The ones I can buy are fresh and varied, and I stick with pellets because they store well. 

I have one Spalt Select plant, which grows surprisingly well for the climate here, and the aroma is pretty awesome when fresh.  Reminiscent of the fresh hops in Poperinge, which is a smell I've never had from any hop I've bought.

15
Interesting, it seems like the brewer has repeatedly seen lower OG with this method?

I've only done a couple of batches (both no sparge) and the gravity was what I expected, almost to the point.  I can recirculate but only do so before draining the tun.

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