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Messages - narvin

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61
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Message to the forum. from me.
« on: January 30, 2017, 10:41:42 AM »
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.... http://www.beerandloafing.org/hbd/search.php?bodytext=bamforth+oxidation

62
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Pics of recent brews?
« on: January 29, 2017, 05:48:35 PM »


Pilsner, 100% Barke Pils. 

63
Yeast and Fermentation / Re: The Chimay Yeast
« on: January 29, 2017, 05:44:52 PM »
I don't remember a lot of great head retention on higher gravity Belgian ales, especially the Trappists.  Obviously this is a big generalization -- Duvel and some others (usually light in color and body) can be pillowy and long laating.  The high carbonation can mask it due to constant foam.

64
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Message to the forum. from me.
« on: January 29, 2017, 05:31:12 PM »
I love your input and generally have no problems with the moderation here, Keith.  I think that there's a lot of frustration going around in general right now (and not just about brewing).  My take is that there's some lingering bitterness around the way the German brewing folks acted last year, and I was also guilty of taking it out on them in the past.

Just remember, it's a new year.  Bryan has been helpful and answered questions from me, however stupid, with enthusiasm.  I think there is curiosity and the dogma has mostly been dialed back.  I'm the first to say that not everything applies at the homebrew scale, but, on the other hand some things are worse on the small batch size.

People ARE still stirring the pot, and that can't go on.  So, really, ask yourself if you're being helpful or being defensive when you post.  This goes for everyone. 

65
All Grain Brewing / Re: Introduction to Low Oxygen Brewing
« on: January 29, 2017, 05:02:08 PM »

I'd also like to see any case where a beginner question was answered with low oxygen being crammed down their neck. I just don't see it.

We certainly can but make sure you understand that you posed a direct question that was not related to LODO brewing.

There are posts like this: https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=28551.0

Yeah, it's not extract brewing but it is an instance where personal experience is over ruled by complete dogma. Instances like this aren't about discussion. Sorry. It is about shutting peoples experiences down based on something read in a text book and not really even applicable to 5 or 10 gallon batches.

I'm going to respectfully disagree.  I'm not a low oxygen fanatic and I'll be the first in line to say that some of the German brewing forum members were jerks when they first appeared.

But 1) Bryan came back, answered the questions I asked (no more secrets), and did it respectfully.  Gripes about the original behavior is in the past

2) That thread has multiple people saying that, in their experience, cranking up a direct fire boil on the 5-10 gallon scale can cause wort darkening and flavor changes.  Regardless of the literature.

I see one jackhole in that thread, and it's bayareabrewer.  I understand the mods are very busy and don't envy their job, but I think you should look again at what's going on right now.

If this crosses the line, I don't care, I don't need this s*** right now and I have other things in life to do.  This is also a "free time activity" for me.

66
All Grain Brewing / Re: Introduction to Low Oxygen Brewing
« on: January 29, 2017, 07:43:28 AM »

2/  Deliberately and very obviously disrupting a thread about low O2 brewing with uninformed negativity, having not actually DONE IT FULLY. I look forward to the days when a lot of people here have tried it and we can debate respectfully on whether or not it makes a damn bit of difference. Because, know what? THAT is progress, this BS is not.

Uh, I'm not sure what triggered this rant in this thread, but if #2 was aimed at me, you need to read what I wrote again.

I'm interested in using AA in an AntioxC like mixture, however I have copper in my system and I'm not getting rid of it. There is valid science regarding AA and the Fenton reaction.  I don't really think it's anyone's place to decree that a certain procedure isn't worth discussing because you haven't DONE IT FULLY, whatever that even means.

A useful contribution would have been to describe your system and process a little, to help nate debug and give me another data point to consider when throwing something new in a 10 gallon batch that will have $50 worth of hops.  Saying "It works, I did it, stop talking about it" is NOT useful.

Edit: I do agree that the behavior of a lot of people on here has gotten ridiculous, and share your frustration.  What I hoped would happen when I asked the question was people would answer whether they use it with copper.  Well, that, and Bryan would chime in  :)

67
All Grain Brewing / Re: Introduction to Low Oxygen Brewing
« on: January 28, 2017, 04:09:24 PM »
This is a question for those using AA and SMB.  Have you ever noticed any flavor that you would attribute to the ascorbic?  I have one batch that I did with the blend (hoppy pale ale) and it has an odd chemically taste to it in the "far aftertaste".  By that, I mean after I swallow it I get kind of a chemically thing on on my tongue and throat that lasts for a long time. 

The recipe is basically the same as others I have made but this time I used different hops (zythos, azacca, and el dorado), but I haven't encountered this before.  I'm curious if the AA could be causing this to happen (directly or indirectly), but it seems unlikely. 

For reference, I used about 35ppm SMB and 25ppm of AA, assuming I didn't screw up the calculation.


This is interesting.  I've only used SMB so far, but was planning on a mix for the next brew.  I know Bryan mentioned some caveats, so I was doing some digging and there are references to AA *increasing* oxidative reactions in the presence of Iron and Copper.

http://www.beerandloafing.org/hbd/fetch.php?id=64148

"Ascorbic acid on metabite treated beers increased the oxidation of
polyphenols [via the Fenton reaction/copper] and increased the sulphite
oxidation 5X"

Both the Bamforth paper and the one from Belgium were looking at post fermentation (cold side) treatment.

68
It's possible that you've changed.  Some IPAs that I used to think were killer seem just ok now.  Higher standards, plus older palate, I suppose... how fast do taste buds die?  :)

69
All Grain Brewing / Re: To spund or not to spund...that is the question
« on: January 28, 2017, 02:29:49 PM »
Going back to your keg purge, one question that keeps nagging me is - aren't you always leaving at least some sanitizer behind in the keg?  Even my kegs with untrimmed dip tubes leave at least a few ounces of sludge when the keg kicks.  I know StarSan is not toxic, so you guys are simple rolling with it and incorporating some sanitizer into your beer?  I can see how it maybe wouldn't matter in a standard-size batch, but I would think it would make a difference with the small batch brewers.

The only reason that much sludge gets left behind is because it's sediment, not liquid. If your dip tube goes to the center of the divot like it should, you won't leave more than a teaspoon of sanitizer.

I'm also not concerned about star san at that dilution; if anything, it's acidic which will brighten your beer up  ;)

70
All Grain Brewing / Re: Boil temps - do they matter?
« on: January 28, 2017, 05:49:57 AM »
To get back on topic....

In my experience, I do see differences in wort darkening based on boil intensity.  I'm using a direct fire system, and at hombrew scale the kettle bottom in contact with the wort has a very high surface to volume ratio. 

71
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: State of the Forum
« on: January 28, 2017, 05:35:47 AM »
I asked for more information about making beers with "IT", and people have answered.  Eveyone was annoyed when it was a secret, so what are you complaining about now?

I haven't seen anything combative or snarky recently, so get over IT already  :)

72
All Grain Brewing / Re: To spund or not to spund...that is the question
« on: January 27, 2017, 12:34:46 PM »
One of the issues with spunding is timing, and another I have is with beers I want to dry hop, but would rather not do in the keg.  An alternative is priming, but why not add the sugar before transferring to get more yeast action to be more like spunding?

73
The Pub / Re: Horrible beer products
« on: January 27, 2017, 11:34:10 AM »
My mom gave me one of those last year. It's the thought that counts, I guess.

Haha, me too.  I haven't tried it yet.  Maybe I can adapt it to something useful, like a lodo bottling gun  :)

74
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: State of the Forum
« on: January 27, 2017, 09:43:21 AM »
I like turtles!

... sorry, I had to.  I agree that it's good to stay on topic but i'm not sure it's any worse than it's ever been.

75
All Grain Brewing / Re: Low Oxygen Conclusions?
« on: January 27, 2017, 05:10:15 AM »
I think it's been established that the oxygen introduced by a stir plate is minimal due to CO2 off gassing and the shape of an Erlenmeyer flask.  In my experience, the smell/taste of stir plate wort that I decant is not too bad, while hitting it with pure O2 leaves an unpleasant, acrid taste.

But, either way, I don't see how you could be introducing much oxygen by pitching a fermenting starter.  Sure, there's a possible issue with diluting it with something that tastes bad, but it's not oxidizing the rest of your wort.

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