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Messages - klickitat jim

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Beer Recipes / Re: Berliner Weisse Methods
« on: July 09, 2015, 06:15:56 PM »
Maybe it's time to develop some new terminology? I would call Martin's method Spontaneous Souring, and my method Controlled Souring, or Selective Souring. When you do it would be Preboil or Postboil. No one is right or wrong, they're just different. I happen to prefer the clean predictable sour, but I appreciate the wild nature of spontaneous too.

When I harvest yeast from my 30L Speidels that's how I do it. I figure the cap and everything under it was sanitized when I put the beer in, so it should be just fine. I rack, then swirl, then remove the cap and pour into a sterile 1/2 gallon mason jar. Spigots give me the willies and they are a potential leak point.

Ingredients / Re: Saison w/ fruit - hop suggestions?
« on: July 09, 2015, 05:09:34 PM »
Sounds about perfect to me. You might even dry hop a gallon just to compare. When it's all done and bottled and carbed, try one fresh and take thorough tasting notes. Then try one at a year and compare. Would be interesting to see what the Brett does to it over time.

Ingredients / Re: Saison w/ fruit - hop suggestions?
« on: July 09, 2015, 03:46:14 PM »
No expert, but I would not worry much about bittering. Dry plus bitter kinda doesnt work for me. So maybe a half ounce of magnum at 60. Then I'd go with something that will compliment the berries in whirlpool. Fruity or herbal but not piney or citrus. Brett is going to mutate the flavors anyway, so I wouldn't go hog wild.

Equipment and Software / Re: PH Meter
« on: July 09, 2015, 03:26:53 PM »
First real use of Matt's pH meter today. Mashed in my blonde sour, 17lbs of GW Pils in 6.75 gal well water, gypsum and CaCl, and phosphoric per Brewer's Friend. At about 5 minutes of stiring I pulled a sample and chilled to 70F. 5.2 pH!  Woo hoo!

Thanks Matt!

Edit: I cut the suggested phosphoric for the sparge in half because it seemed like a lot. 20ml vs 40ml of 10%, and my sparge ph was 5.2 again!  Loving my new meter!


Bingo! Its a hopping experiment. I would expect the trial beer to be a hoppy one. You wouldn't try to debunk or prove a malt related issue, like decoction, in an IPA, right?

why not?
Well, how would that sound? "Decoction doesn't work because only 5 out of 10 can tell decocted from non decocted in an IPA." Thats how this sounds to me, FWH doesnt make a difference... in a beer style that you can barely detect hops in anyway.

Beer Travel / Re: RV Trip 2015
« on: July 08, 2015, 09:48:31 PM »
Flash backs! I had words with my teenaged stepson one time. Explained that I had no expectation of becoming the new dad, or even be a parent to him. Then explained that if he ever made my wife cry again he would find out what happens when I loose my cool. It never happened again.

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Brett Bottle Bombs in the making ?
« on: July 08, 2015, 07:08:52 PM »
No experience with that strain, but my Brett finishes between 1.006 to 1.002. It takes a while to get down there so with Brett beers my two final gravity readings are usually a month apart to be sure there's no change.

I'd be very concerned that your beer is going to drop still and over pressure


Bingo! Its a hopping experiment. I would expect the trial beer to be a hoppy one. You wouldn't try to debunk or prove a malt related issue, like decoction, in an IPA, right?

I'm also interested to see if (and if so,how much) the differences would be magnified using IPA type hops and IBU range. It seems like the differences would be more apparent in the IPA realm, but who knows. Guess we'll see.

Beer Travel / Re: RV Trip 2015
« on: July 08, 2015, 04:37:30 PM »
Glad you enjoyed it. Sounds like a heck of a journey

Beer Recipes / Re: Berliner Weisse Methods
« on: July 08, 2015, 02:50:06 PM »
I do a version of option one on all of my sour beers.

Normal wort production but with sours I dont use hops. My lacto strain requires <10 IBUs and at that level they dont really shine through. I dry hop however,,,

Chill to 90-100F and check wort pH. I've added a step of manually adjusting my wort pH to 4.5 with lactic acid before transfer to the fermenter to reduce the chance of some wild bug taking off.

Transfer to fermenter and pitch my entire lacto starter, which has been working for 5-7 days.

Set temp at 90-100F and I let my lacto go for a week.

Reduce temp to 70F and pitch my brett, or dregs. Here is where I would pitch wy2007 of 1056 if I was doing a berliner type beer.

For my lacto-brett American sours I let the brett go two months before I start looking for terminal gravity. With brett my terminal gravity means two hydrometer samples the same gravity a month apart. If I add fruit, I add it a month after pitching brett, and let the fruit go two months before checking gravity. This year I will be using oak spirals and those will go in a month before hydrometer samples start.

Equipment and Software / Re: PH Meter 101
« on: July 08, 2015, 02:19:47 PM »
Thanks for all that info! I'm new to pH meters too and learning and relearning really helps.

Yeast and Fermentation / Gelatin V.S. Brett Pelicle
« on: July 08, 2015, 02:13:15 PM »
Thought I'd share my experience with gelatin fining through a brett pelicle. I just bottled two batches of Saison with Brett last night. Both had a nice classic brett pelicle. A few days ago I chilled them to o 30F, then pitched my typical 150F cup of gelatin right through the pelicle. I gave each fermenter a little 2 second rocking to get the gelatin spread out. Then it rested at 30F for a few days till I bottled. On bottling day the pelicles appeared totally unaffected. And the beer beneath was nice and clear as expected from the gelatin.

So, gelatin does its job. Pelicle does its job.

Commercial Beer Reviews / Left Coast Brewing - Voo Doo
« on: July 07, 2015, 03:57:45 AM »
Anyone try this? I found a bomber last weekend at the camp store outside Beverly Beach, $8 yikes! With all tge great Anchor beers I had found at Dallas Walmart, I didn't get to this one till this morning after work. Noticed the 2012 World Cup Bronze for Foreign Stout marker... 

Its rare I can down a bomber of stout much less a big one. Very tastey. My only mistake was following it with a Black Butte. In comparison the Black Butte was thin, and coppery. Good job LCB!

All Grain Brewing / Re: Saison attempt
« on: July 06, 2015, 09:36:23 PM »
Just took my terminal gravity which ended up being 1.002 on the 100% pils and 1.003 on the 100% red x. Both held a great balance between saison character and pineappley lambicus bret character. The red x is slightly hazy and the pils is crystal clear. These will be awesome to enjoy on a hot august evening! I'll have to hide a few to see how the bret evolves over time.

Sounds good, man. I'm enjoying my 3724 saison (non-bretted) right now - came out really nice. I cracked a Boulevard Saison-Brett last weekend, though. I kept it long enough (a year-ish) to let the brett get nice and funky. Just a killer beer.
Haven't tried Boulevard yet but I love Logsdon Saison Bretta

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