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Messages - dmtaylor

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466
Oh yeah... here's the thread I was really looking for.  Too bad I didn't find this until AFTER I already brewed my experiment.

Bring out your dead..... KLACK!

If anyone's interested, I got a round tuit.  Experiment formally in progress.  Tee hee.   ;D 8)

It will be a tale of two Marzens, same recipe, different mashes and different efficiencies:

Batch #1: Decocted, sparged, 81% efficiency.

Batch #2: Single infused, no-sparge, 64% efficiency.

You could say that it's a double or triple variable test, not suitable for blind triangles, and I don't care.  I just want to see if no-sparge is as awesome as I think it is, and decoction as much a waste of time as I think it might be, even if I did do a fast one in less than 4 hours.  Git er done and raise more questions than answers, or something.  ;D

I was shooting for an OG of 1.054 originally.  Unfortunately, Batch #1 the gravity was a touch low, 1.049.  Then I adjusted the malt bill down slightly for Batch #2, but it still turned out just a tad high, 1.053.  You figure that's close enough for comparison purposes?  The efficiencies are still way different with a spread of 17% with only 4 gravity points difference.  Or should I add extract to Batch #1 to match Batch #2?  I don't want to fiddle too much if I can help it.  I'm thinking I'll just leave it, cuz you can't probably taste 4 gravity points difference especially after it's all fermented out -- final gravity points will still be pretty close within 2-3 points of each other probably in the low teens.

Also got around to finally bottling that cyser today that I made last Oct/Nov.  Smelled great.  Too bad I can't drink today.  But ahh.............. it was a really, really good day today.  I feel like I've redeemed myself slightly.  :D

More facts and figures:

Both batches were BIAB on my stovetop, 1.3 gallons each.  Yeah, yeah, I don't drink much and wanted the day done before midnight.  What time is it?  The clock on the wall says 12-o-clock.

Adding up all the rests for the Batch #1 double decoction, I determined that for the average molecule in contact with enzymes in a temperature range of 140-165 F, the total time in that temp range was about 55 minutes, plus or minus 5 minutes.  Overall average rest temperature was about 153-154 F for the most time.  So...

For Batch #2, I went ahead and did the single infusion at an average 153 F, with a range of about 147-156 F for various readings.  Temperature was stable in the 150s until the last ~10 minutes of the mash, which is way beyond the 40 minute mashes that I'm used to anyway so I know it didn't really matter much.

And oops.  I forgot to vorlauf Batch #1.  Batch #2 was real chunky so I just HAD to vorlauf.  Batch #1 looks like 80% scrambled eggs in the fermenter.  Batch #2 just got done, looks hazy still.  EDIT: After 12 hours, they looked basically identical -- see photo below.

Recipe.... not these exact ingredients, I had to make a couple minor substitutions and didn't use any chocolate malt, but in the spirit of the following:



Speaking of which.... the only hops used were my homegrown Hallertau, 2015 crop, estimated alpha 4.8%, 60-minute addition only, no late hops.

Boil lengths were identical, 65 minutes each.  Hop additions were identical, 0.33 oz each at 60.  Used same salts in each to hit Munich water profile.

Malt bills had all the same percentages of each, but single infusion no-sparge Batch #2 had more total mass 2.95 lb versus decocted sparged Batch #1, 2.18 lb.  Yes, I crunched a ton of numbers to come up with all this junk, and it turned out reasonably awesome I think.

I've gotta go to bed.  Talk to some of ya'll tomorrow.

467
All Grain Brewing / Re: Hochkurz vs 150F - The 'play nice' thread
« on: July 31, 2016, 09:32:40 PM »
you certainly can't taste efficiency!  ;)

Ah.... but can't you?!  Again, more experiments are needed!  I've been meaning to run such an experiment for a long time, but haven't gotten around to it yet.

Bring out your dead..... KLACK!

If anyone's interested, I got a round tuit.  Experiment formally in progress.  Tee hee.   ;D 8)

It will be a tale of two Marzens:

Batch #1: Decocted, sparged, 81% efficiency.

Batch #2: Single infused, no-sparge, 64% efficiency.

You could say that it's a double or triple variable test, not suitable for blind triangles, and I don't care.  I just want to see if no-sparge is as awesome as I think it is, and decoction as much a waste of time as I think it might be, even if I did do a fast one in less than 4 hours.  Git er done and raise more questions than answers, or something.  ;D

468
All Grain Brewing / Re: double kolsch attenuation
« on: July 28, 2016, 01:38:24 PM »
Average water that is not too soft or too hard should be just fine for a Kolsch style.  If in doubt, shoot for chloride and sulfate both around 100-150 plus or minus a little.  If you're already close to that with your source water, don't even worry about it, it's not essential IMHO.

469
All Grain Brewing / Re: BIAB spent grain
« on: July 28, 2016, 11:16:32 AM »
One of the big advantages of dry yeast is that you don't need yeast starters.  But yeah, selection is limited, but getting better all the time.  If I could use dry yeast for every recipe, I would.  But some liquid yeasts are still better or required for certain styles.  Eventually probably within the next 5 years, this will no longer be the case and we'll be able to use dry for everything.  I look forward to it.

470
All Grain Brewing / Re: double kolsch attenuation
« on: July 28, 2016, 11:13:17 AM »
There'll be plenty of yeast left to do the job. Gelatin just drops the amount of yeast below the visible threshold, but plenty are left in the beer. If it were a really big beer, adding some dry yeast at bottling might be helpful.

+1 Yes, true.

471
All Grain Brewing / Re: BIAB spent grain
« on: July 27, 2016, 12:25:42 PM »
how long should I let it sit before pitching the starter? until I see some activity?

Yeast starters are most effective if you can let them ferment for a good 12-24 hours before using them.  Definitely wait until you see some good high foam on top before using.  Otherwise the yeast could be dead and you wouldn't know it.

472
All Grain Brewing / Re: double kolsch attenuation
« on: July 27, 2016, 09:05:57 AM »
I think your plan will work just perfectly.  Go for it.

473
All Grain Brewing / Re: BIAB spent grain
« on: July 27, 2016, 09:02:41 AM »
Thanks! That helped a lot! That's a great idea using the drippings for a starter, however, how long can this be stored. I usually only brew three or four times a year with my current situation. Can the wort be stored for a few months in the fridge if its sealed well?

Secondly, if I am not worried about haze like with darker beers or wheat beers, should be OK to squeeze just based off of how you explained this right?

Great questions again.  Wort will only keep in the fridge for 2-3 weeks before it begins to go sour all by itself.  Plus it's prone to botulism bacteria if not fermented for a few months -- potentially dangerous.  Freezing it might be a perfect option though.

Sure, if you don't care about haze, then squeeze away.  Would work well for wheat beers.

474
All Grain Brewing / Re: BIAB spent grain
« on: July 27, 2016, 07:15:24 AM »
I think the "tannins" thing is a bit of a crock.  However squeezing can indeed cause starch haze in the final beer if your mash hasn't fully converted.

Personally I incorporate a dunk sparge for improved efficiency.  And I always, always, always add every single drop from the draining of the bag.  Without any squeezing required.  Often times 30 or 45 minutes into the boil, I am still finding a cup or two of wort below the grain bag and I simply add it to the boil.  This will maximize efficiency.  Alternatively, sometimes I have saved the extra wort for making yeast starters, which is a great purpose for it as well but sacrifices 1 or 2 points of efficiency.

Caveat: Efficiency really isn't all THAT important anyway.  Consistency is way more important.  If you can skip a sparge or do a sloppy sparge and still get more than 70% efficiency on a consistent basis, then you've already won, keep on doing what you're doing.

I really am not a big advocate for squeezing the bag though.  It just isn't necessary.  Get yourself a colander and let gravity do all the work for you.  Then there's negligible chance for squeezing anything weird out of the grains, whether that's starch or tannins or anything else.

Great questions.  Cheers.

475
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: isovaleric acid - sweaty socks
« on: July 27, 2016, 06:30:27 AM »
Dave, do you use iodophor or bleach occassionally for sanitizing? After Mark's illustration that Starsan doesn't work on all spoilers, I've been more open to iodophor use. I'm still leary of using bleach on my plastics and hoses, but it sure is an effective sanitizer. Occassional Hose replacement is probably still a good policy.

I haven't used bleach for many many years.  I agree, it would probably be a good idea to switch sanitizers more often.  This advice applies to all homebrewers of course, not just me or people who are having problems.  Maybe every 5 or 6 batches or so we should be switching it up.  And the hose thing, definitely more often than I've been doing (I think it's been about 5 years now).

476
Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Yeast Stored Hot
« on: July 26, 2016, 03:51:34 PM »
Dead yeast will smell meaty, brothy, or of burnt matches.  This usually takes longer than 3 weeks, even at elevated temperatures.

477
General Homebrew Discussion / Re: isovaleric acid - sweaty socks
« on: July 26, 2016, 02:16:58 PM »
I got isovaleric in a recent batch.  I've decided I should replace my transfer hoses and racking cane.  It's been a few years, so a contaminant from rubber & plastic components might possibly be the culprit.  Otherwise I have a really hard time figuring out how else it might have happened.

EDIT: It actually could be old hops.  That might be an even more likely culprit.  But, I'm going to replace the old rubber & plastic regardless because it's time.

478
All Grain Brewing / Re: Red Ale
« on: July 26, 2016, 11:31:38 AM »
I'm unable to verify the SRM from where I'm sitting at work but assuming your calcs are correct...

Looks great to me.  Enjoy it.

479
Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Yeast Stored Hot
« on: July 26, 2016, 04:43:23 AM »
It's probably fine.  Making yeast starters is still the best idea as some of the cells might have died.  But many of the cells probably survived.

480
All Grain Brewing / Re: More pedestrian questions
« on: July 25, 2016, 11:53:25 AM »
When I saw that the Duvel recipe included pear extract, I gave up.
Yeah, just lame. If you ferment it right you get that from the yeast.   :)

FYI --- WLP400 witbier yeast throws a lot of pear ester.  I'll bet it would be wonderful in a Duvel clone.

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