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Messages - brewsumore

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General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Pics of recent brews?
« on: September 10, 2017, 03:03:46 PM »
Looks great.  Prost!

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Imperial Rustic
« on: September 10, 2017, 03:01:13 PM »
I went back to Markowski's "Farmhouse Ales" seeking recipe inspiration for a re-pitch batch, and saw that he reports that Blaugies, for their Saison d'Epeautre (OG 1.048) primary ferments at 77 - 80F, and that their storage period is only five days at 41F.  I'm not sure if that "storage" immediately follows primary fermentation, but that's the way I read it.  Interesting tidbit.

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Harvest this yeast cake for reuse or no?
« on: September 09, 2017, 10:49:15 AM »
Excellent!  Thanks all.  Once again, RDWHAHB!

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Harvest this yeast cake for reuse or no?
« on: September 08, 2017, 11:42:15 PM »
Thanks Flars.  I guess where I was going with this is I don't know if the veg material in the stored yeast would potentially pick up bacteria, or otherwise contribute to off flavors in its next use, or subsequent generations. 

It does make sense that having been boiled, the veg matter became completely sterilized along with any trub that went into the fermenters before commercially purchased yeast was pitched, and so bacterial risk of any harvested would be equivalent to that of the yeast itself.

As you suggest, either decanting the top-off beer in the canning jar, before re-pitching, or better yet adding some leftover bottled light beer would further reduce any flavor impacts from the spice/veg component.

Seems pretty low risk to me too!   :)

Yeast and Fermentation / Harvest this yeast cake for reuse or no?
« on: September 08, 2017, 09:51:53 PM »
I've read it's not recommended to harvest and store for later re-use, a yeast cake from the bottom of a fermenter if any fruit or spice was used.  I'm curious if there are degrees of grey here.

Tomorrow I will begin to cold crash two 5-gallon buckets of saison (OG 1.055) and then rack the beer into kegs a couple days later.  The remaining two yeast cakes will undoubtedly have a tiny amount of non-yeast particulate that is not from malt. 

That is, for an 11-gal yield of wort runoff from the kettle (after leaving behind a gallon of hop/break/spice/peel spooge in the kettle), I had added with at least 5 minutes remaining in the boil 1.3 oz of lightly ground coriander, an ounce of dried bitter orange, a small amount of fine zest from a couple fresh sweet oranges, and 2 grams cracked grains of paradise.  And when I ran off the wort from the kettle into the fermenters, all was first strained through a fine-mesh strainer.

I'm pretty much looking for three basic options for a response, as follows:

1) in my experience, or from reading articles and/or other forum threads it's not worth the risk,

2) I've done the same thing a time or two with no problem or read, or know from industry practice that it's not very risky,

3) I've done this plenty of times with no problem.


Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Imperial Rustic
« on: September 08, 2017, 03:19:19 PM »
Similar here and far from one dimensional.  I get fruit, pepper, and this woodsy, cassia type thing that I could see some call earthy.  I would call 3711 one dimensional tho.  Quick, dry, but blah.  I can see it working with a spice or fruit version. 

I tend to think the magic is formed early on so maybe you missed out?  You owe it to yourself to try solo Blaugies before ruling it out.

I was looking at some old brew notes (Nov 2011) for a Kaffir (lime leaf and ginger) Saison, which is the only time I brewed solo 3726 or ever even used it before, and at that time fermented one bucket with the 3726 (77F pitch eventually up into low 80's), and the other bucket with 3711.  I kegged the 3711 batch and bottled the Blaugies batch - both of which attenuated well. 

I recall that what has been stated here is true, namely that the 3726 was flavorful and enjoyable more so young, and had a smoother fruitier profile than the 3711 (no surprise there), but that after probably a year in the bottle, it became uninteresting.  My notes said that at kegging the 3726 had a smooth, lemony, vinous flavor if that sounds at all familiar at lower ferment temp.

Anyway, I'll drink this current batch more quickly, and straight from the kegerator after maybe 2 weeks conditioning. 

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Imperial Rustic
« on: September 07, 2017, 05:02:42 PM »
Thanks stpug - right to the gist of my question -- and I hope i'm not hijacking here.  I'm getting a bit tired of 3711 and looking to get more into "classic" saison, although as others have said 3711 works very well with some fruit or spice background saisons - and is great in one of Major's beers I have brewed at least a couple times -his lime leaf ginger saison.

No doubt this beer will have plenty going on - will check in later.  I'm actually pretty excited and happy.

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Imperial Rustic
« on: September 07, 2017, 03:41:35 PM »
I would be surprised if you haven't been dialing in closer to the sweet spot, and gathered from others' posts too.  I just figured I might as well keep it high, also in hopes that the 3724 would kick back in for more of a duplex co-ferment.  I'm sure it will be fine and good though.  I'll report back in a few weeks.

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Imperial Rustic
« on: September 07, 2017, 12:41:26 PM »
I know a lot can change from hydro sample to conditioned beer, but based on my last couple hydro samples I'm hoping that the Bluagies isn't a little one dimensional.

I realize that fermentation temps and schedule, yeast health, etc. all play into what you can squeeze out of a yeast in terms of getting a full spectrum, i.e. earthiness, spice, fruit, esters and phenols, of course specific characteristics of the yeast(s) used.

But would any of you characterize the Blaugies fermented at high temp as a bit one dimensional - as in juicy fruity?

I'm hoping the yeast profile flavors will become more complex than what I'm tasting now.

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Imperial Rustic
« on: September 07, 2017, 09:57:33 AM »
Thanks guys.  I'll try to be patient.   ::)

General Homebrew Discussion / Re: My new hydra chiller
« on: September 06, 2017, 11:30:52 PM »
My custom 25" tall, 10" at widest point hydra chiller arrived today apparently in perfect condition and it's gorgeous, and will fit in the top hole of my two keggles.  And I like the extra height that will distribute cooling better for my typical 12 - 12.5 gallons of hot wort.  I immediately soaked it in a bucket of hot PBW solution for most of the day, gave it a lite sponge rub, rinsed well and set it in it's rightful place among the basement brewing gear, lovingly stored in a Home Depot bucket.

Can't wait to try it. 

Thanks JT.  Excellent.

All Grain Brewing / Re: Over shot pre boil gravity
« on: September 06, 2017, 11:23:52 PM »
I only use my refractometer for a quick and ballpark full kettle pre-boil reading.

Yeast and Fermentation / Re: Imperial Rustic
« on: September 06, 2017, 11:06:41 PM »
I was brewing with a chest crud and somehow let my starters of WY3724 (started the night before) get up to one at 97F, the other at 101F, by leaving the temp controller probe outside of the fridge for an hour or two before pitching.  doh!

Anyway, pitch temp in each of 2 buckets including starter + one additional activator packet (59% viability) into 1.055 SG wort, was at 92F.  I held it via 2-stage temp controller and thermowell to 91F for a day and then dropped it to 90F, and as expected both fermenters stalled at 1.032, as recorded on day 5 of the ferment.

FWIW, it was Mosher's Saison Buffoon recipe, mashed at 149F for 90 minutes, and 10% piloncillo sugar added at the beginning of the boil.

One day later I totally lucked out and from my LHBS got two cans of 4-days-since-canned Rustic Saison and pitched them pretty cold (1 per 5.5 gal bucket), per their pitching directions, and since then have maintained the 90F ferment beer temp.

3 days later beer was at 1.016, and 2 days after that, which is today, the beer is at 1.007, and I gently stirred both fermenters for good luck and to hurry it along at the high temp on day 11 of the ferment.

The co-ferment is nice although the Rustic dominates.  The hydro sample today is still quite clean flavor, and the main impression now is that juicy fruity flavor, plus some background flavor from limited additions of orange peel, coriander and grains of paradise added last 5 minutes of the boil.  Based on reading this thread I expect the beer will finish at around 1.004 in 2 or 3 more days, and probably no more than 4 days from now I'm expecting to cold crash a day or 2 and then keg and carbonate in the kegerator, and let it condition for at least 3 weeks.  Do you think that after it's carbed in the kegerator that it would be better to condition in the wine cellar at 57F, or in the kegerator at 34F?  Or would that matter?  I expect that flavors would complex and come together more quickly at the higher temp when conditioning.

I'm used to getting some bubblegum from the 3724, but don't get that any more after the co-ferment yeast addition.

I wish I had not gotten distracted with the temp controller probe on brew day, but I sure hope that at this temp it will still yield a clean enough flavored beer.  So far I'm satisfied that I'll enjoy the final beer.

General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Howdy, and beer share review
« on: September 04, 2017, 11:48:02 AM »
I hear ya regarding feeling sad and blue about the low, low expected steelhead run this year.  As things stand it makes no sense for me to head over to Idaho this season to fish for them, as I normally would on the Clearwater River.  And congrats on losing the weight, and for getting a drift boat.  And I know what you mean about not letting hobby obsession keep you brewing like on a monthly basis (and then drinking it) simply to keep it rolling.  You might have inspired me to brew next once I'm LOW on beer.   8)


General Homebrew Discussion / Re: Pics of recent brews?
« on: September 03, 2017, 03:02:30 PM »
Yum!  I'm curious, mittelfruh or tradition?

Simply labelled Hallertauer. Whichever I'm happy.

You bet!  I wondered if you had a preference.  I've used mittelfruh in the past and like that, but want to try tradition.

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