Author Topic: point/counter point yeast experiment.  (Read 1430 times)

Offline firedog23

  • Brewer
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
  • Just taking it one brew at a time!
    • View Profile
point/counter point yeast experiment.
« on: March 24, 2012, 08:04:35 AM »
I assume someone else has had this thought and gone through with it.

I brewed a Belgium Abbey Style Red 1.084 OG 1.026 FG, with a smack pack of Belgium Ardennes.  Out of curiosity, I decided to put a gallon of it in a 1 gal carboy that had one tablespoon of honey mixed with 100ml of water (both boiled) which took it back up to 1.034 and then pitched a hydrated Safale US-05.  I would have liked to use another Ardennes but I had none left so I rehydrated the US-05.

Am I up for disappointment or could this work out?  Will the yeast play nice?  Will/could the two different yeast strains make for a crazy flavor?

The original beer needs some time to condition but it tastes like I had hoped with the seeds of paradise and orange zest really coming out right now.  I know they will mellow out which is what i want but the gallon of it in secondary is my cause for excitement/curiosity.

Any thoughts are more than welcome,

Tim
In the fermenter:


Up coming brews:
First boil in a bag

Offline hokerer

  • I spend way too much time on the AHA forum
  • ********
  • Posts: 2639
  • Manassas, VA
    • View Profile
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2012, 08:28:31 AM »
Something doesn't sound right here.  One tablespoon of honey is about 3/4 of an ounce.  Honey is somewhere around 35 points per pound per gallon.  So that one tablespoon in one gallon is only going to bump the gravity up by a point and a half or so.  Yet you say your gravity bumped from 1.026 up to 1.034?  I'm confused.
Joe

Offline firedog23

  • Brewer
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
  • Just taking it one brew at a time!
    • View Profile
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2012, 08:34:05 AM »
That's what the reading was after three separate readings with a hydrometer.

The 1.026 was the fg out of the fermenter and the 1.034 was the reading of the secondary prior to the yeast  with the honey mixture in it.
In the fermenter:


Up coming brews:
First boil in a bag

Offline dimik

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 238
    • View Profile
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2012, 09:44:39 AM »
1026 FG is WAAAAAY TOOOO HIIIIIGH. That's higher than sweet stouts finish at! Actually it's so high that some table beers have 1026-29 OG. I think you need to let it sit longer and let finish. Add fresh active yeast maybe. Especially for a Belgian this is WAY too high.
Was this an extract brew? Even if it was, it still should finish nowhere near 1026...
Check out BKYeast for my yeast ranching adventures and home lab!

Primary: Braggot, Petite Saison, Porter, Herbal IPA

On Tap: RyeIPA

Offline firedog23

  • Brewer
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
  • Just taking it one brew at a time!
    • View Profile
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2012, 09:54:38 AM »
1026 FG is WAAAAAY TOOOO HIIIIIGH. That's higher than sweet stouts finish at! Actually it's so high that some table beers have 1026-29 OG. I think you need to let it sit longer and let finish. Add fresh active yeast maybe. Especially for a Belgian this is WAY too high.
Was this an extract brew? Even if it was, it still should finish nowhere near 1026...

No, this was AG. it was in the fermenter for two weeks with no action the last few days.  Any chance the yeast wore out being it started high? 
In the fermenter:


Up coming brews:
First boil in a bag

Offline euge

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 7658
  • Estilo Casero
    • View Profile
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2012, 10:44:24 AM »
I'm not sure what you are trying to accomplish here. I don't think you'll get much out of the s-05 even with a re-ferment.
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. -Richard P. Feynman

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 14113
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • View Profile
    • Dennybrew
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2012, 10:50:29 AM »
No, this was AG. it was in the fermenter for two weeks with no action the last few days.  Any chance the yeast wore out being it started high?

Did you make a starter?
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

Offline tubercle

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1639
  • Sweet Caroline
    • View Profile
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #7 on: March 24, 2012, 11:04:58 AM »
Have you calibrated the hydrometer with water?
Sweet Caroline where the Sun rises over the deep blue sea and sets somewhere beyond Tennessee

Offline firedog23

  • Brewer
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
  • Just taking it one brew at a time!
    • View Profile
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2012, 11:05:34 AM »
I am not trying to do anything in particular, more of an experiment and a lot of curiosity.

No starter. I am not set up for a anything more than straight liquid yeast or hydrated dry yeast but I am getting frustrated with my limited capabilities. A stir plate is up next in the equipment purchase as I want to be better with yeast and not run into the issues I ran into this time.
In the fermenter:


Up coming brews:
First boil in a bag

Offline firedog23

  • Brewer
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
  • Just taking it one brew at a time!
    • View Profile
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #9 on: March 24, 2012, 11:06:05 AM »
Have you calibrated the hydrometer with water?

No I have not.
In the fermenter:


Up coming brews:
First boil in a bag

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 14113
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • View Profile
    • Dennybrew
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #10 on: March 24, 2012, 11:18:21 AM »
No starter + 1.086 OG = poor fermentation...all it takes to make a starter is a gal. jug and some DME.  No fancy flask or stir plate necessary.  I'd recommend you make a starter for anything over 1.040.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

Offline mabrungard

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1467
    • View Profile
    • Bru'n Water
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #11 on: March 24, 2012, 11:24:44 AM »
No starter + 1.086 OG = poor fermentation...all it takes to make a starter is a gal. jug and some DME.  No fancy flask or stir plate necessary.  I'd recommend you make a starter for anything over 1.040.

Yah, the yeast pooped out in that high gravity wort due to limited ability to replicate in that wort.  A larger yeast population was needed at pitching to avoid relying on excessive replication.  Don't do big beers without a starter. 
Martin B
Carmel, IN

BJCP National
Foam Blowers of Indiana (FBI)

Brewing Water Information at:
https://sites.google.com/site/brunwater/

Like Bru'n Water on Facebook for occasional discussions on brewing water and Bru'n Water
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Brun-Water/464551136933908

Offline firedog23

  • Brewer
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
  • Just taking it one brew at a time!
    • View Profile
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2012, 11:36:22 AM »
Thanks guys for the info. I am going to add the starter addition to my process. 

I do have some dme and will be using it next time.

So I guess the gallon carboy could work out as it has new healthier yeast in it.
In the fermenter:


Up coming brews:
First boil in a bag

Offline morticaixavier

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 7517
  • Underhill VT
    • View Profile
    • The Best Artist in the WORLD!!!!!
Re: point/counter point yeast experiment.
« Reply #13 on: March 24, 2012, 01:38:09 PM »
Thanks guys for the info. I am going to add the starter addition to my process. 

I do have some dme and will be using it next time.

So I guess the gallon carboy could work out as it has new healthier yeast in it.

Yeah, it might, you might also want to rehydrate and pitch another pack of us05 to the main batch.
"Creativity is the residue of wasted time"
-A Einstein

"errors are [...] the portals of discovery"
- J Joyce