Author Topic: The Secondary Topic Revisited  (Read 1779 times)

Offline davidgzach

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Re: The Secondary Topic Revisited
« Reply #15 on: April 18, 2012, 05:17:41 AM »
+1.  I think you are just inviting problems with secondary.....
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Offline a10t2

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Re: The Secondary Topic Revisited
« Reply #16 on: April 18, 2012, 06:54:22 AM »
I personally think secondarying in buckets is a terrible idea and I would completely advise against it. Totally surprised to see anyone with any brewing experience to have contrary views.

I'm sure it's at least partly environmental too. Acetobacter can't get in the beer if it isn't in the air to begin with. Even if it is in the air, I don't see how the risk would be greater in a bucket than it is in any other unsealed vessel. Proper sanitary procedures can minimize the risk.
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Offline nateo

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Re: The Secondary Topic Revisited
« Reply #17 on: April 18, 2012, 08:16:19 AM »
I'm sure it's at least partly environmental too. Acetobacter can't get in the beer if it isn't in the air to begin with.

I think you're on to something. I never had any weird infections when I lived in CO. The air was a lot drier there. In MO mold is everywhere, and I recently had a beer infected with what is probably mold.
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Offline majorvices

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Re: The Secondary Topic Revisited
« Reply #18 on: April 18, 2012, 08:19:39 AM »
I'm still not sure I agree 100% that it can't get in there over time only due to my experience. Granted, I aged most of my beers in a pretty damp basement.  I don;t understand why the case would be that buckets would get it, or beers that lost airlock water, but not those in carboys or secondary carboys with sealed airlocks (besides the obvious fact that it lost co2 blanket). And in the case of buckets I'm talking about those that sat around for weeks after fermentation was over. But even if it can't get in there "per se" I'm pretty sure none of us are following sterile brewing practices, even you, sean.  ;)

co2 is the most important part of keeping a beer fresh, any contact with air lessens the amount of time that beer will retain it's freshness, and acetobacter seems to be one of the easiest infection for people to get and it can't grow in a co2 environment. But even if you brew in a sterile environment and have no worries with infection a bucket that sits around for a month after fermentation is finished will be much more likely to suffer the effects of oxidation that one in a sealed carboy or better yet stainless corny.

I just think it's a bad idea all together. Can't help myself from disapproving.  ;)
« Last Edit: April 18, 2012, 08:21:52 AM by majorvices »
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Offline majorvices

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Re: The Secondary Topic Revisited
« Reply #19 on: April 18, 2012, 08:33:00 AM »
Acetobacter can't get in the beer if it isn't in the air to begin with. Even if it is in the air, I don't see how the risk would be greater in a bucket than it is in any other unsealed vessel. Proper sanitary procedures can minimize the risk.

By the way, you are underlining my point right there. First off your are dumping beer into a bucket that is full of air and undoubtably trace amounts of bacteria. Then you "seal" the bucket but it isn't really sealed very well, it is o2 permeable (and don;t get me started on fruit flies and buckets because the lid doesn;t stop them). In a carboy at least the remaining co2 in solution fills the headspace and air can't get in, assuming you have an air lock.

I do agree that environment can help minimize the risk. I live in the middle of a damp bug filled forest so my chances of infection are certainly higher than many others.
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Offline chumley

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Re: The Secondary Topic Revisited
« Reply #20 on: April 18, 2012, 08:47:11 AM »
My basic procedure for lagers is to ferment until the beer turns bright (anywhere from 7 to 28 days), siphon into a keg, lager at 32-35°F (skip the silly d-rest, its just a waste of time), around week 3 or so of lagering jumper cable the beer into a new keg to get it off the settled yeast, force carb, then let the beer sit for another 3 weeks at the lagering temperature, adjust the carb level as necessary until its just right, as indicated on the pressure gauge.

That procedure gives me clear, perfectly carbed, delicious lager beer every time.