Author Topic: 1st round NHC results  (Read 27819 times)

Offline tomsawyer

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #30 on: April 26, 2012, 03:31:00 PM »
I passed on NHC in Chicago to judge for a friend in StL.  Shorter drive too.  Don't get me wrong, I'm going to travel for judging whether theres a stipend or not.  But it does add up when you do it five or more times a year. I could also see the stipend tied to BJCP rank.  We all like to see a National judge tasting our babies.
Lennie
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Offline a10t2

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #31 on: April 26, 2012, 04:01:12 PM »
We all like to see a National judge tasting our babies.

Not me. Less-experienced judges like my beers a lot more. ;)
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Offline tschmidlin

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #32 on: April 27, 2012, 12:29:23 AM »
I just don't think I can be in favor of stipends for judges.  I could see a raffle and gifts for judges, but stipends just sound like added complications for competition organizers.
Tom Schmidlin

Offline skyler

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #33 on: April 27, 2012, 02:01:46 AM »
Scores are relative. Some flights score higher than others. I had a beer score a 38 that didn't place or advance in a relatively small competition once. I had another beer that scored a 32.5 in a mid-sized category (porters) and took first. I have known judges who won't score anything lower than 30 if it isn't godawful and others who seem morally opposed to giving a 40. That's why I care more about the comments made on my scoresheets than the numbered score. Although I do get unreasonably angry when a judge writes something like "use less crystal malt" in a beer that has no crystal malt. And don't get me started on the phantom diacetyl that some judges seem to detect....

I haven't received my scoresheets yet, but it seemed like the Northern California region was an severely understaffed this time around. I will be surprised if I get them all back anytime soon. Several other competitions occurring around the same time had to be part of the problem, but the fact that the only drop point (and location of the judging) was an hour southeast of San Francisco and 30-45 minutes southeast of Oakland made it very inconvenient to engage in the competition. I am sure there must have been reasons to put the comp out in the boonies, but for the life of me I can't understand how nobody just vetoed that idea off the bat. I know it kept me from volunteering to steward or anything, and I am sure the same is true for a lot of guys in my club.

Offline brewmichigan

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #34 on: April 27, 2012, 06:37:47 AM »
I just don't think I can be in favor of stipends for judges.  I could see a raffle and gifts for judges, but stipends just sound like added complications for competition organizers.

I agree. At the comp I helped judge here in Michigan a few months ago, there were prizes. Every judge left with something. It might have only been a t-shirt and a mug but it was something. You could have won a stainless steel pot, 40 qt I believe.
Mike --- Flint, Michigan

Offline brewmichigan

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #35 on: April 27, 2012, 06:45:39 AM »
I have also had a Pils that was over 40 first round, but was given a kind score of 28 in the second round, as I got hurried in the bottling, and it had Diacetyl, as did the control bottle  That prompted me buy a beer gun.

I don't understand why a beer gun would prevent diacetyl.
Precursor exposed to air = diacetyl.  Beergun has the CO2 purge feature. It was a Pilsner, nothing to hide behind.

Edit: toured Bells at an AHA rally in 2008. Their bottling line does a double purge with CO2 before filling.

Ah, makes sense. I've been using the wand in the picnic tap for all my bottles recently and haven't had any issues. I only use it for beers that won't be aging for more than a month or two. I tried doing a CO2 purge once and didn't notice any difference. The big thing to remember is cap on foam. The foam seems to clear the head space of most of the oxygen. I did it once without cap on foam and within 3 weeks, very noticeable oxidation notes.
Mike --- Flint, Michigan

Offline micsager

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #36 on: April 27, 2012, 07:30:53 AM »
Quote
Doubtful a score like that will advance, but maybe??

I think you would already know if your beer advanced by the scoresheet. Look at the "Place Awarded" box on the cover page. If there is a 1st, 2nd, or 3rd there, then you advanced...
If not, better luck next time!

Well, in the "place awarded" box was nothing but empty space.  So I didn't advance with those scores.  Bummer.  I'll be stewarding the afternoon session of the final round.  Hope I get to taste some of the Ambers that DID advance. 

I guess I've got a year to fine tune that recipe for next year.  I just tapped a session IPA that's pretty tasty.  If you're coming to Seattle, look for it at the WAHA booth. 


Offline markaberrant

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #37 on: April 27, 2012, 07:43:09 AM »
There are always lots of things that can happen to your beer by the time it gets to the judges, and of course judges can just be off that day, or fatigued, or skewed by a really good or bad sample before yours.  We all know this and accept that competitions and judging are not perfect.

However, as a judge and as an entrant, I particularly like that a whole bunch of pale ales or stouts or pilsners all get judged together.  Good judges can easily pick out the flaws in this format, anything slightly off will stand out, which as a brewer/taster you don't always notice when sampling your beer on its own.  I have personally entered some really good beers that don't win in the Canadian Qualifier - I am sometimes able to taste the medal winning beers against mine after the judging session is over, and it is usually quite obvious that mine is indeed inferior.

This is also why I like doing themed tasting events, usually with a mix of commercial beers and homebrews.  Recently did a large RIS tasting, doing a lambic/flanders red tasting tomorrow night.  It gives you an excellent opportunity to see the variety/creativity within a style, and also brings the flaws to the forefront, and is a great way to sperate the men from the boys so to speak when you taste a whole bunch of "world class examples."
« Last Edit: April 27, 2012, 07:47:45 AM by markaberrant »

Offline marty

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #38 on: April 27, 2012, 08:11:38 AM »
Well, in the "place awarded" box was nothing but empty space.  So I didn't advance with those scores.  Bummer.  I'll be stewarding the afternoon session of the final round.  Hope I get to taste some of the Ambers that DID advance. 

I guess I've got a year to fine tune that recipe for next year.  I just tapped a session IPA that's pretty tasty.  If you're coming to Seattle, look for it at the WAHA booth.

those boxes aren't always filled out

Offline cryogen

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #39 on: April 27, 2012, 08:21:15 AM »
Is the mini-BOS box checked on the front page?  you have to score in the 30s to make it to mini BOS.  I wouldn't really worry to much if its not checked because most stewards don't know that they are supposed to check that box.
 

One of the things I do as Competition Organizer for the San Francisco region is go back through all of the flight summary sheets and mini best of show sheets and make sure that the checkbox for "advanced to Mini B.O.S. is checked" on every scoresheet.  Yes it's a lot of extra work, but it can certainly tell the brewer their beer achieved a higher calling than just their score :-)

-- Jon Koerber
« Last Edit: April 27, 2012, 08:57:13 AM by cryogen »
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Offline brewmanator

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #40 on: April 27, 2012, 08:48:03 AM »
I can't say this enough times.  Do not get rid of your reserve bottles until after the Official Announcement is made in May.  This excludes beers that scored lower than 30 or beers you plan to brew again in time for the second round judging.

The cover sheet is not official and sometimes does not get filled out correctly.  In past NHC competitions I've had beers with the Place Awarded filled out and found out later it was just for the flight and not entire category.  I've also had beers that did not have the Place Awarded filled out and found out later that it moved on to the second round.   We judges and organizers are human and make mistakes...

- Mike

Offline cryogen

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #41 on: April 27, 2012, 08:51:52 AM »
...I haven't received my scoresheets yet, but it seemed like the Northern California region was an severely understaffed this time around. I will be surprised if I get them all back anytime soon. Several other competitions occurring around the same time had to be part of the problem, but the fact that the only drop point (and location of the judging) was an hour southeast of San Francisco and 30-45 minutes southeast of Oakland made it very inconvenient to engage in the competition. I am sure there must have been reasons to put the comp out in the boonies, but for the life of me I can't understand how nobody just vetoed that idea off the bat. I know it kept me from volunteering to steward or anything, and I am sure the same is true for a lot of guys in my club.

Skyler,  I am the organizer for the San Francisco region, and I wanted to respond personally to your post. 

The competition for our region ended just this past Sunday, 4/22/2012.  And I can tell you for sure, we were very WELL staffed.  We had approximately 65 judges per session with 4 full sessions.  We had plenty of stewards and even an extra person on the cellar staff this year.  Moving the competition from Lodi (of which we had great times) actually was a boon to the competition this year, as it was much closer to the larger concentration of judges and stewards needed to run a massive competition like NHC.  Lodi would be considered "out in the bonies" by some, while Pleasanton (our drop-off and judging location) is very close to San Jose, San Francisco, Oakland, the tri-vallety area, and all of the other East Bay communities.  It is about as metropolitan as you can get.  We certainly can't be close to everyone's location, but it was my decision to move the competition to an area that would greatly ease the challenges of staffing this huge competition.  And I can tell you by our staffing issues from prior years, that decision was a huge success.

Additionally, my staff and I received more compliments this year than I can remember in any prior year: "great job keeping all flight sizes to 7 beers or less", "this judging location was so roomy and comfortable, I want to judge here every year", "this was the most well organized competition I have ever attended...", and many other kind compliments.

From your comments, you mentioned not even participating as a volunteer in the competition, so I find it hard to believe you would have any sense of the "staffing" shortfall you mentioned.  We had judges and stewards drive out from Reno, Las Vegas, San Luis Obispo, Redding, Santa Barbara, and even San Diego.  Some of those are 8, 9, or more hours away.  We must be doing something right to attract people from that far ;-)

As to your scoresheets...  Even though our competition only ended 5 days ago, the scoresheets are mailing out this morning!!!  That amazing feat can be attributed once again to a staff of 12 volunteers that helped me work last night to match all of the scoresheets up by number to the brewers names, and then stuff the hundreds of envelopes with sometimes as many as 36 entries.  I personally was up at 2:30am this morning after the scoresheet sort, labeling, stuffing cover letters, licking and processing all of these score sheet mailers.  I am exhausted, but proud to have organized what I feel is one of the best run competitions in the area.

You should have your score sheets within 1 to 2 days.  Good luck on your entries!

-- Jon Koerber, San Francisco Region Organizer
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Jon Koerber
San Francisco Region Organizer
"If it ain't one thing, it's another... and if it ain't that, then it's something else"  -- JK

Offline markaberrant

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #42 on: April 27, 2012, 09:44:20 AM »
Great summary Cryogen of all the advance work, planning, coordination and post-competition work that goes into running a successful large comp.

The amount of hours put in for this year's Canadian Qualifier was staggering, but we had a ton of people step up and flat out TAKE CARE OF BUSINESS.  It is was a privelege to work with all the volunteers and judges, and I am extremely proud to have been part of it.  And it sure feels good when the out of towners give you compliments and feedback on running an oustanding event, certainly makes you feel like all your effort was worthwhile.

Offline Janis

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #43 on: April 27, 2012, 09:53:56 AM »
Hear, hear Jon and Mark!

Thanks to all of the organizers who put in a TON of work to set up and then run these competitions like clockwork!  You guys put in a ton of work to get everything together for the judging, and then put in 2 TONS of work to get the results out to the entrants and to file the organizers report with the BJCP!  I can't thank you enough for the job you guys do.

My hat is off to you!

Cheers,
    Janis
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Offline marty

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Re: 1st round NHC results
« Reply #44 on: April 27, 2012, 10:32:46 AM »

As to your scoresheets...  Even though our competition only ended 5 days ago, the scoresheets are mailing out this morning!!!  That amazing feat can be attributed once again to a staff of 12 volunteers that helped me work last night to match all of the scoresheets up by number to the brewers names, and then stuff the hundreds of envelopes with sometimes as many as 36 entries.  I personally was up at 2:30am this morning after the scoresheet sort, labeling, stuffing cover letters, licking and processing all of these score sheet mailers.  I am exhausted, but proud to have organized what I feel is one of the best run competitions in the area.



I hope that guy won something, it's almost 5% of the total entries for the region!