Author Topic: Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss  (Read 2156 times)

Offline elephantrider

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Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« on: December 06, 2012, 09:06:00 PM »
Since I started kegging IPAs the hop flavor and aroma drops off very quickly, like a week or so. I leave in primary for 10 days, cold crash for 3 days and then dry hop in the keg for about 7 days. When I carb, I turn the psi to around 20 for 3 days and then turn down to about 7ish for serving. The last IPA I used 9 ounces total, a blend of Simcoe and Centenial. All of my more malty beers seem to turn out very good. Btw, my hop schedules are usually 40 ibus for my 60 minute addition, a big addition at 15 minutes, a nice hop stand addition and then dry hop. Can anyone offer any insight? Thanks.

Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2012, 07:35:52 AM »
Try to keep O2 out of the process, purge the keg with CO2. Keep it cold. That is all I've got on this.
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Offline blatz

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Re: Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2012, 08:10:39 AM »
are you dryhopping at the cold crash temps or at ferm temps? 

7PSI for serving (assuming high 30's serving temp) is a bit low in carbonation IMO for American IPA.  You do need some signficant carb to push out those hop aromas in your glass. i try to carb and serve at 11-13PSI at 38 degrees.

what are the actual hop stand, 15min and dryhop amounts?  Some people's idea of 'big' is pretty weak from what i've seen.
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Offline elephantrider

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Re: Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2012, 10:02:20 AM »
are you dryhopping at the cold crash temps or at ferm temps? 

7PSI for serving (assuming high 30's serving temp) is a bit low in carbonation IMO for American IPA.  You do need some signficant carb to push out those hop aromas in your glass. i try to carb and serve at 11-13PSI at 38 degrees.

what are the actual hop stand, 15min and dryhop amounts?  Some people's idea of 'big' is pretty weak from what i've seen.

I dry hop at basement temp, so I would say low 60s.

I will change psi and see if that improves things.

On the most recent IPA I used 1.5 oz of Simcoe and .75 oz of Centennial at 15 minutes so maybe "big" wasnt the right word there. I used 2 oz of Simcoe and 1.25 oz of Centennial for a 30 minute hopstand after boil and then 2 oz of Simcoe and 1 oz of Centennial for dry hop. This is for a 5 gallon batch.

Serving temp is anywhere from high 30s to low 40s. I use a Johnson Control temp controller for this.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2012, 10:21:49 AM by elephantrider »

Offline rjharper

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Re: Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2012, 10:15:24 AM »
If you're over pressurizing the keg to quick carb, then venting it before you serve, you're probably purging out a ton of hop aroma. Better to rack to the keg, toss in the dry hops, set it to serving pressure and wait a week.

Offline majorvices

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Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2012, 05:00:09 PM »
are you dryhopping at the cold crash temps or at ferm temps? 

7PSI for serving (assuming high 30's serving temp) is a bit low in carbonation IMO for American IPA.  You do need some signficant carb to push out those hop aromas in your glass. i try to carb and serve at 11-13PSI at 38 degrees.

what are the actual hop stand, 15min and dryhop amounts?  Some people's idea of 'big' is pretty weak from what i've seen.

Interesting. I find lower end carbonation lends better aroma for me. High Co2 lends to a weird harshness in aroma and flavor.

I also agree with the 02 comments. Seems like even low levels of oxidation has a detrimental affect on hop flavor and aroma..
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Offline majorvices

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Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2012, 07:51:33 PM »
If you're over pressurizing the keg to quick carb, then venting it before you serve, you're probably purging out a ton of hop aroma. Better to rack to the keg, toss in the dry hops, set it to serving pressure and wait a week.

Another good suggestion.
Keith Y.
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Offline elephantrider

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Re: Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2012, 09:07:30 PM »
Just wanna say thanks for the responses guys.

Offline blatz

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Re: Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2012, 07:12:29 AM »

Interesting. I find lower end carbonation lends better aroma for me. High Co2 lends to a weird harshness in aroma and flavor.

I agree with you - high carbonation does lend a metallicy 'weird' aroma and bite in the flavor, but to get that its usually 15+PSI at 38 - 11-13 seems just the right balance for my tastes.
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Re: Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #9 on: December 10, 2012, 01:54:32 PM »

Interesting. I find lower end carbonation lends better aroma for me. High Co2 lends to a weird harshness in aroma and flavor.

I agree with you - high carbonation does lend a metallicy 'weird' aroma and bite in the flavor, but to get that its usually 15+PSI at 38 - 11-13 seems just the right balance for my tastes.
CO2 dissolves as carbonic acid, so it would make sense that more carbonation = more carbonic acid = more acidic flavor, right? Acidity could affect the aroma too I imagine.
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Offline mabrungard

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Re: Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #10 on: December 10, 2012, 03:06:32 PM »
I get a loss over time, but I don't think its to the degree mentioned here. 

I take it that the beer is nice initially, but fades?  Do you brew with really low alkalinity water like rainwater or RO water?  Colin Kaminski reports that hop expression is muted if the beer pH is too low. 
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Re: Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #11 on: December 10, 2012, 03:11:22 PM »
If you're over pressurizing the keg to quick carb, then venting it before you serve, you're probably purging out a ton of hop aroma. Better to rack to the keg, toss in the dry hops, set it to serving pressure and wait a week.

Another good suggestion.

Even if you're not venting, I've noticed that when my beers are over-carbed/over foamy I will get a strong hop flavor/aroma in the head that is not there in the beer.  Like all the hops got blasted out.
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Offline elephantrider

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Re: Quick Hop Aroma and Flavor Loss
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2012, 10:15:50 AM »
I get a loss over time, but I don't think its to the degree mentioned here. 

I take it that the beer is nice initially, but fades?  Do you brew with really low alkalinity water like rainwater or RO water?  Colin Kaminski reports that hop expression is muted if the beer pH is too low.

Yes, starts out really nice and after a week or so, a dramatic drop off. I honestly know nothing about my water. I plan on sending out a sample to Wards in the very near future so I can start playing with my water in the spring.