[yso191]

Great conversation!  Thanks to everyone.  I am brewing a Baltic Porter with Lager yeast sometime around Christmas, so this is particularly timely.  I am also having a Navy reunion at my house next July, and one of the beers I want to have on tap is a Kolsch, so again very timely.

Steve

[gmac]

didn't mean any offense or to be snarky, but I feel there is a myth that circles around out there that lagers need FOREVER to be ready and for a dunkel, pils, vienna etc. it simply isn't the case.  Now doppel...

No worries.  That's the beauty of having a forum like this.  If everyone thought the same thing we'd only need Denny
I can see where my comment could imply you need six months, like I said, I was just trying to say you need to plan ahead. 

My three main points for new brewers that want to keep up are:
1.  Plan ahead and know what you want and when you need to have it ready
2.  Learn to re-pitch so you have lots of healthy yeast ready and work it into your brewing schedule
3.  Brew more often than you think you need to

To the OP.  I make a lot of Kolsch and that is one yeast that takes a long time to drop clear.  Even with gelatin finings I often don't get it crystal clear for several weeks.  For your navy reunion, I'd make a good starter and get started about 8 weeks ahead of your event.  If I want 5 gals of nice clear Kolsch for an event, I do two 5 gal batches and leave them sit and then fill a clean 5 gal keg with the top 1/2 of each batch (and then I drink the other 5 gals myself).  That keeps me from accidentally bringing in yeast again.

[Joe Sr.]

There are those that use plate filters (primarily intended for wine) and even some brewers who run their beer through whole-house filters. Reports are quite positive and encouraging concerning the effectiveness of the 5 micron house filters.

It's my understanding, although I have no direct experience, that filtering will also take out some of the hop flavor.  Though I suppose you may also get that with fining.  I don't know if one or the other has a greater impact.

[majorvices]

I am truly brewing lagers now with the intent that they won't get drank until June.  That's the reality of lagers. 

I disagree with that.  Average gravity lagers can be turned around only 2-3 weeks longer than an ale.  I make a lot of lagers and primary them for 3 weeks and lager around 4 then off to the taps.  (most pros are 2 primary, 2 lagering, then packaging or less).

And not bragging, but to illustrate it ain't just my tastebuds that think so, I just got a 43.5 and a bronze medal for my oktoberfest at the Sunshine Challenge with 774 total entries and that beer was lagered for only 3 weeks and was on tap for 2 before I bottled some off the tap and sent.

that is, unless of course you want the oxidized flavor that many folks confuse for maltiness since that's what they taste in imports.  in that case, yeah, you'll need to wait 6 months or so 

+1. Even big doppelbocks don't need that kind of aging. Lighter lagers need only 2-4, maybe 6 weeks tops.

[reverseapachemaster]

A lot of this idea that you need to take 3-5 weeks in primary followed by weeks and weeks in the bottle is interwebs myth perpetrated and perpetuated to convince new brewers who are rushing the process to slow down and to make those who don't follow proper procedures (e.g. pitching rate, aeration, etc.) give their beer time to hopefully clean up off flavors on their own. The problem is at some point that somewhat reasonable advice became a mantra that proper brewing procedures don't matter as long as you take months to brew, you must take months before you even taste a beer and no matter how bad of a job you did with a beer more time always fixes it. None of those are categorically true.

[erockrph]

As far as long-term lagering goes, I think some of the issue is that a lot of homebrewers get caught in the trap that if something is done a certain way by pros, or has been done traditionally for hundreds of years, then they think they need to replicate that. In reality, you're going to get you beer cleaned up a heck of a lot faster in a fridge in the low-to-mid 30's than you would in a 50-degree cave.

[nateo]

I'm kinda lazy, so I don't always transfer or bottle in a timely manner.

I've noticed some beers, like weizens, seem to peak very young (like when they hit terminal gravity), and some have longer shelf-lives than others. I've got about 40 bottles of Belgian blonde I made this summer and forgot about, and they're not nearly as good as they were a couple months ago. I also have an imperial stout from two summers ago that has gotten a lot better.

So it seems alcohol is the big factor in cellarability. What other factors affect that?

[malzig]

I've noticed some beers, like weizens, seem to peak very young (like when they hit terminal gravity), and some have longer shelf-lives than others. I've got about 40 bottles of Belgian blonde I made this summer and forgot about, and they're not nearly as good as they were a couple months ago. I also have an imperial stout from two summers ago that has gotten a lot better.

So it seems alcohol is the big factor in cellarability. What other factors affect that?

I'm not a fan of long lagering, and I usually lager for as long as it takes to drop the yeast and no longer.  2 weeks, maybe 3 for an occasional stubborn yeast.  For my taste, long lagering can go too far toward rounding off the bright and fresh hop and malt flavors that I associate with great beer in Germany.

But a big dark beer, like an Imperial Stout can age really well.  I think it is partly the alcohol and partly the dark malt, which supposedly acts as an anti-oxidant.  I just opened a 4 year old 13% Bourbon Stout over the weekend, and it was spectacular.  Not much hop flavor left, but big round malt flavors, little heat, and no obvious oxidation. 

[ynotbrusum]

I can drink them in 6 weeks, if pitched big.  4 weeks primary at 49F,  2 weeks at 32 on CO2 @12 psi.  But I prefer 8 weeks total for the milder lagers.  I will be making a pilsner for the SuperBowl this Saturday and have my Christapils lagering on CO2 in the garage for Christmas that I made in late October.

Cheers!