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astringency

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beersk:

--- Quote from: nateo on January 02, 2013, 09:16:19 AM ---

If you're batch sparging with water that's 180*+, it'll raise the temp of the grain bed, so I doubt your run-off is actually over 170*F.

--- End quote ---
This is what I was thinking, which led me to think he's over sparging.  But he did say that he took temperature readings of 175F+.

redzim:

--- Quote from: tygo on January 02, 2013, 08:22:04 AM ---
--- Quote from: hopfenundmalz on January 02, 2013, 06:36:36 AM ---Red - I acidify may sparge water to 5.5 or so.

--- End quote ---

Same here and I think this could be your problem.  The combination of high temperature and relatively high alkalinity is what causes tannin extraction.  If your sparge water is below 5.7 or so the temperature is less important.

I had the exact same astringency issue awhile back and it went away once I started acidifying my sparge water.  I routinely sparge at temperatures greater than 170F.

--- End quote ---

So how do I acidify sparge water? I've never done that... any tips on formulas & chemicals would be appreciated... my tap water is around 7.5-7.8 pH, but on some brews I use 50% or more (up to 100%) distilled water with some minerals added in....  I guess the pH of that water will still be at least 7 or more though, as distilled water has pH of 7, right?

redzim:

--- Quote from: beersk on January 02, 2013, 09:20:39 AM ---
--- Quote from: nateo on January 02, 2013, 09:16:19 AM ---

If you're batch sparging with water that's 180*+, it'll raise the temp of the grain bed, so I doubt your run-off is actually over 170*F.

--- End quote ---
This is what I was thinking, which led me to think he's over sparging.  But he did say that he took temperature readings of 175F+.

--- End quote ---

Ok so how do I stop "oversparging"....  try to balance my first run-off and 2nd run-off?

For instance on the Altbier I'm drinking right now, which got me thinking about this, I ran off 6.0 gal, then sparged to collect another 11.5gal to reach 17.5 gal, which I needed because I wanted to do a 75 minute boil....  I guess that is pretty unbalanced, and I could mash a lot thinner to get that balanced out (I doughed-in at 1.5 qts/lbs, then did an step infusion to get my sach rest, this left the mash at 2.15 qts/lbs, then I did a decoction mashout). 

My 2012 Oktoberfest was more balanced in the run-offs; I collected 7 gal first, then sparged 9 gal more to get 16 gal total which is all I needed for a 60min boil.  Still had a mildly unpleasant astrigency about it....

beersk:
Why are you collecting so much if you're only ending up with 11 gallons in the fermenters? Do you have a ridiculous boil off rate?

hopfenundmalz:

--- Quote from: redzim on January 02, 2013, 09:25:34 AM ---
--- Quote from: tygo on January 02, 2013, 08:22:04 AM ---
--- Quote from: hopfenundmalz on January 02, 2013, 06:36:36 AM ---Red - I acidify may sparge water to 5.5 or so.

--- End quote ---

Same here and I think this could be your problem.  The combination of high temperature and relatively high alkalinity is what causes tannin extraction.  If your sparge water is below 5.7 or so the temperature is less important.

I had the exact same astringency issue awhile back and it went away once I started acidifying my sparge water.  I routinely sparge at temperatures greater than 170F.

--- End quote ---

So how do I acidify sparge water? I've never done that... any tips on formulas & chemicals would be appreciated... my tap water is around 7.5-7.8 pH, but on some brews I use 50% or more (up to 100%) distilled water with some minerals added in....  I guess the pH of that water will still be at least 7 or more though, as distilled water has pH of 7, right?

--- End quote ---

I use lactic or phosphoric acid, check with the pH meter. If distilled absorbs CO2, you get carbonic acid that drops the pH.

Brunwater can do the calculations.

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