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First Wort Hopping question

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malzig:

--- Quote from: alcaponejunior on February 04, 2013, 09:55:42 AM ---
--- Quote from: denny on February 03, 2013, 04:24:59 PM ---
--- Quote from: denny on February 03, 2013, 04:22:39 PM ---I use FWH in most of my beers, from APA/AIPA to pils and even tripels.

--- End quote ---

It gives me a nice hop flavor and adds a bit of smooth bitterness.  I start by deciding how much hop flavor I want, then adding the appropriate amount of FWH....usually 1-2 oz.  I count the bitterness from them as a 20 min. addition.  After having some beers analyzed, that seems like a pretty accurate guess.  Then I add enough hops at 60 to get the bitterness I'm going for.

--- End quote ---

Curious.  Beersmith II counts FWH as giving more bitterness units than a 60 minute addition.  .75 of bravo at 60 gives me 37.9 IBUs, .75 of bravo at FWH gives me 41.7.  Any ideas?

--- End quote ---
That sounds about right.  FWH can give about 10% more IBUs than a 60' addition, but less bitterness.

denny:

--- Quote from: alcaponejunior on February 04, 2013, 09:55:42 AM ---
--- Quote from: denny on February 03, 2013, 04:24:59 PM ---
--- Quote from: denny on February 03, 2013, 04:22:39 PM ---I use FWH in most of my beers, from APA/AIPA to pils and even tripels.

--- End quote ---

It gives me a nice hop flavor and adds a bit of smooth bitterness.  I start by deciding how much hop flavor I want, then adding the appropriate amount of FWH....usually 1-2 oz.  I count the bitterness from them as a 20 min. addition.  After having some beers analyzed, that seems like a pretty accurate guess.  Then I add enough hops at 60 to get the bitterness I'm going for.

--- End quote ---

Curious.  Beersmith II counts FWH as giving more bitterness units than a 60 minute addition.  .75 of bravo at 60 gives me 37.9 IBUs, .75 of bravo at FWH gives me 41.7.  Any ideas?

--- End quote ---

My own lab analysis showed that FWH beers measured about 10% more IBU.  But generally we taste beer, not measure it!  In a blind tasting, FWH beers were generally found to taste less bitter despite the increased measured IBU.

And that brings up a point about Beersmith and all other brewing software.....they're tools to help you brew the way you want to brew, not instructions on how to brew.  Don't automatically assume that any defaults are correct for you and your system.  For example, Promash comes set to default to evaporation as a %.  But the writer of it says you should reset that to gal./hr.

alcaponejunior:
LOL I decided to FWH my bravo/munich smash today.  The difference in IBUs on beersmith is low, only 48 for FWH verses 45 for a 60 minute addition.  No biggie, right?

Except that somehow the process of deciding to FWH my beer led my mind into believing that a half an ounce was equal to 28 grams.  D'oh!  :o

Turns out half an ounce is still fourteen grams.   ::)

And my beer will be about 30 IBUs higher than I planned.  They were bravo hops, high AA.  So it went from APA to IPA just like that.  8)

It will still be good tho.  I can feel it.  ;D

Pi:
Guess I'm a little confused about IBUs. I always thought international bittering units was a measurement of bitterness- something that is quantifiable. So how can a beer with higher IBUs have less bitterness but more flavor? I agree with Denny that beer should is best enjoyed tasted and not measured, but when working with FW hopping and dry hopping (especially using a new hop) it is hard to know how much and how long. Is there a way of measuring how much flavor/aroma a hop will impart based on Alpha acid or some other metric?

AmandaK:

--- Quote from: Pi on February 19, 2013, 08:47:21 AM ---Guess I'm a little confused about IBUs. I always thought international bittering units was a measurement of bitterness- something that is quantifiable. So how can a beer with higher IBUs have less bitterness but more flavor? I agree with Denny that beer should is best enjoyed tasted and not measured, but when working with FW hopping and dry hopping (especially using a new hop) it is hard to know how much and how long. Is there a way of measuring how much flavor/aroma a hop will impart based on Alpha acid or some other metric?

--- End quote ---

There are different qualities of bitterness. A coarse bitterness that measures at 50 IBU will seem/taste more bitter than a refined bitterness that measures at 50 IBU. If you read the new Hops book, you will see that flavor and aroma are only barely understood.

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