Author Topic: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?  (Read 3208 times)

Offline mwhammer99

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Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« on: March 07, 2013, 07:02:21 PM »
Hi guys, I'm going to be brewing a 1 gal. batch of Dead Ringer IPA (1.064) this weekend.  Anyone think I need a yeast starter, or can I pitch it dry?
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Offline tygo

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2013, 07:16:31 PM »
What yeast are you using?  If you're using a dry yeast then no need to make a starter.  Just rehydrate the appropriate amount of yeast and pitch it.

If you're using a liquid yeast then yes, you should make a starter.  Check out http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html for the right sized starter.
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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2013, 07:55:37 PM »
If it's only a 1 gallon batch you don't need a starter for liquid yeast at that gravity.
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Offline tygo

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2013, 08:18:10 PM »
Ah, I missed the 1 gallon part.
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Offline gmac

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2013, 09:33:28 PM »
At 1 gallon it IS a starter. Well almost.

Online dmtaylor

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #5 on: March 08, 2013, 07:08:53 AM »
At 1 gallon it IS a starter. Well almost.

^^^ This! ^^^  Skip the starter, it basically IS a starter.
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Offline reverseapachemaster

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #6 on: March 08, 2013, 12:33:50 PM »
At that size I wouldn't bother with a starter if you are pitching new yeast but if you're pitching from harvested yeast then the yeast will benefit from a small starter to get the yeast reactivated. I find pitching washed yeast without a starter results in delayed fermentation even at the one gallon level.
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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2013, 12:46:54 PM »
Definitely no starter for dry yeast. At that volume/gravity, I'd pitch 2-3 g (1/4 pack) rehydrated.
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Offline mwhammer99

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2013, 07:53:18 PM »
Good deal. Thanks guys!

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Offline agates2114

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2015, 12:10:50 PM »
At that size I wouldn't bother with a starter if you are pitching new yeast but if you're pitching from harvested yeast then the yeast will benefit from a small starter to get the yeast reactivated. I find pitching washed yeast without a starter results in delayed fermentation even at the one gallon level.

^^^^^^^
I am wanting to use some washed yeast for a 2.5 gallon batch, should I make a starter and how do I know how big of a starter to make?

Offline Werks21

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2015, 12:43:26 PM »
At that size I wouldn't bother with a starter if you are pitching new yeast but if you're pitching from harvested yeast then the yeast will benefit from a small starter to get the yeast reactivated. I find pitching washed yeast without a starter results in delayed fermentation even at the one gallon level.

^^^^^^^
I am wanting to use some washed yeast for a 2.5 gallon batch, should I make a starter and how do I know how big of a starter to make?

Check out https://www.wyeastlab.com/com-yeast-harvest.cfm. I dont believe it answers your question exactly but it helped me understand and better implement re pitching. As far as a starter for 2.5 gallons goes I would probably just use a half quart of 1.040 or less and pitch a two ounces of slurry (about 70billion in a 50/50 mix). In the article it tells you how to estimate cells in a slurry by observing the ratio of liquid to yeast before mixing. So you can use a starter calculator (Mr. Malty, Beersmith or whatever) and determine exactly what you need to add to your starter to end up with the cell count you want for that volume/gravity. It seems many people like to over pitch when the yeast is available and get good results but I'm starting to pay more attention to cell counts hopefully to aid in consistency batch to batch.
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Offline S. cerevisiae

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2015, 12:46:59 PM »
I find pitching washed yeast without a starter results in delayed fermentation even at the one gallon level.

Besides being a less than optimal process from a biological stability point of view, rinsing yeast with and storing it under boiled water results in accelerated glycogen store depletion.  Rinsing and storing yeast under boiled water is a home brewer-only procedure that is steeped more in myth than in science.

http://www.fermentis.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/2010_TT_EN_HD.pdf

"Recovering yeast after fermentation and repitching is possible if the cell count is controlled to give the correct yeast pitching levels. In order to control them, laboratory equipment will be needed. In the same way and using the same equipment, bacteria can be removed by acid washing in carefully controlled conditions. In case of repitching, yeast must not be stored out of beer for long periods, even at low temperatures, as yeast glycogen levels will fall causing slow fermentations. Yeast mutation occurs rapidly in brewing environments, repitching can be a delicate operation and may cause beer quality problems in terms of flavour, yeast settling, diacetyl absorption. Effects of repitching can be seen in as few as 3 to 5 brews especially  concerning diacetyl reabsorption. For ale beers that are generally more flavoursome diacetyl levels are less critical."
« Last Edit: February 23, 2015, 12:48:35 PM by S. cerevisiae »
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Offline Werks21

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #12 on: February 24, 2015, 12:49:07 PM »
I find pitching washed yeast without a starter results in delayed fermentation even at the one gallon level.

Besides being a less than optimal process from a biological stability point of view, rinsing yeast with and storing it under boiled water results in accelerated glycogen store depletion.  Rinsing and storing yeast under boiled water is a home brewer-only procedure that is steeped more in myth than in science.

http://www.fermentis.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/2010_TT_EN_HD.pdf

"Recovering yeast after fermentation and repitching is possible if the cell count is controlled to give the correct yeast pitching levels. In order to control them, laboratory equipment will be needed. In the same way and using the same equipment, bacteria can be removed by acid washing in carefully controlled conditions. In case of repitching, yeast must not be stored out of beer for long periods, even at low temperatures, as yeast glycogen levels will fall causing slow fermentations. Yeast mutation occurs rapidly in brewing environments, repitching can be a delicate operation and may cause beer quality problems in terms of flavour, yeast settling, diacetyl absorption. Effects of repitching can be seen in as few as 3 to 5 brews especially  concerning diacetyl reabsorption. For ale beers that are generally more flavoursome diacetyl levels are less critical."


Ok, great infromation regarding washing and repitching but some of this kind of muddies the water for me. However I think I can draw some conclusions using this and other info I have come across.
1. Cell count is crucial, work to make the most accurate cell count possible for any given pitch
2. Skip the washing of yeast.
3. just store yeast in the beer from which it was harvested
4. Dont push the number of repitches when lager is involved

Given what I have read on the forums I know many will disagree with #1,2 and 3 but Im hoping
S. cerevisiae will set me straight, and expand upon his thoughts where needed for better or worse...
Jonathan W.
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Offline S. cerevisiae

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2015, 01:31:48 PM »
Ok, great infromation regarding washing and repitching but some of this kind of muddies the water for me. However I think I can draw some conclusions using this and other info I have come across.
1. Cell count is crucial, work to make the most accurate cell count possible for any given pitch
2. Skip the washing of yeast.
3. just store yeast in the beer from which it was harvested
4. Dont push the number of repitches when lager is involved

Given what I have read on the forums I know many will disagree with #1,2 and 3 but Im hoping
S. cerevisiae will set me straight, and expand upon his thoughts where needed for better or worse...

For sub-16 Plato batches, one should attempt to keep the cell count to within a couple of multiples of the calculated pitch rate.

I do not know who started the yeast rinsing craze, but it is a poor practice that is not grounded in science.  Brewers have been repitching yeast for hundreds of years without rinsing it with boiled water.  The whole rinsing yeast with and storing it under boiled water movement is based on a faulty application of research performed by the ATCC that was designed to store small amounts of yeast under autoclaved distilled water at room temperature.  The critical step in this process is to remove all traces of nutrient via centrifugation.

Given the choice between storing yeast under green beer and storing it under boiled tap or distilled water, one should always choose green beer.

Finally, I would say one should not push the number of generations with any bottom-cropped culture.  Experience with bottom cropping in one's brewery is the best teacher.
Mark V.

Just say "no" to yeast rinsing
https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=19850.msg252492#msg252492

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Offline flbrewer

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Re: Yeast Starter for 1 Gallon Batch?
« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2015, 07:53:27 AM »

At 1 gallon it IS a starter. Well almost.
Can I jump in? What about sub 5 gallon batches? Using WLP001 on a 3 gallon pale ale. Starter?