Author Topic: Hop stand for increased flavor/aroma  (Read 5809 times)

Offline fightdman

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Re: Hop stand for increased flavor/aroma
« Reply #15 on: November 12, 2009, 11:35:31 AM »
I remember the discussion about DMS from the other thread about this. Isn't it much of a concern--letting the wort sit for 80 minutes hot? Have any of you that have tried this noticed any negative results other than blatz's cloudy beer?

This would be my concern as well.  Maybe an experiment is in order.
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Offline tom

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Re: Hop stand for increased flavor/aroma
« Reply #16 on: November 12, 2009, 11:44:10 AM »
I remember the discussion about DMS from the other thread about this. Isn't it much of a concern--letting the wort sit for 80 minutes hot? Have any of you that have tried this noticed any negative results other than blatz's cloudy beer?
The DMS from malts is only a worry in pale-colored malts like pilsner malt.
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Offline roffenburger

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Re: Hop stand for increased flavor/aroma
« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2009, 01:40:11 PM »
I remember the discussion about DMS from the other thread about this. Isn't it much of a concern--letting the wort sit for 80 minutes hot? Have any of you that have tried this noticed any negative results other than blatz's cloudy beer?
The DMS from malts is only a worry in pale-colored malts like pilsner malt.

I realize this, and thus the need for 90 minute boils with high percentages of less modified malts like pilsner, but then why is there such stress on cooling your wort rapidly with other grain bills? I know for a fact that I don't use pilsner malt in many of my brews. What are the other benefits of cooling quickly other than a shorter brew day? I'm playing devil's advocate....
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Offline narvin

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Re: Hop stand for increased flavor/aroma
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2009, 03:18:16 PM »
I remember the discussion about DMS from the other thread about this. Isn't it much of a concern--letting the wort sit for 80 minutes hot? Have any of you that have tried this noticed any negative results other than blatz's cloudy beer?
The DMS from malts is only a worry in pale-colored malts like pilsner malt.

I realize this, and thus the need for 90 minute boils with high percentages of less modified malts like pilsner, but then why is there such stress on cooling your wort rapidly with other grain bills? I know for a fact that I don't use pilsner malt in many of my brews. What are the other benefits of cooling quickly other than a shorter brew day? I'm playing devil's advocate....



- Cold break formation
- Reduced chance of infection from standing at temperatures that favor bacterial growth.

Of course, there are people who do no chill methods too.  I can't really comment on that.
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Offline central_wa_brewing

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Re: Hop stand for increased flavor/aroma
« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2009, 09:49:09 PM »
Thanks for the link, Denny.
I might try cooling the wort down below 100F and hold it for a few.  I don't like the fact of leaving the wort out for a while before pitching, but what they hay.

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Re: Hop stand for increased flavor/aroma
« Reply #20 on: November 14, 2009, 09:41:46 PM »
I used lager malt and did not notice any DMS.  My boil was 90 minutes. I'm sending Blatz this beer so he has two different beers to give some educated feedback. No pressure Blatz. ;)

Offline tom

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Re: Hop stand for increased flavor/aroma
« Reply #21 on: November 14, 2009, 09:58:19 PM »
I remember the discussion about DMS from the other thread about this. Isn't it much of a concern--letting the wort sit for 80 minutes hot? Have any of you that have tried this noticed any negative results other than blatz's cloudy beer?
The DMS from malts is only a worry in pale-colored malts like pilsner malt.

I realize this, and thus the need for 90 minute boils with high percentages of less modified malts like pilsner, but then why is there such stress on cooling your wort rapidly with other grain bills? I know for a fact that I don't use pilsner malt in many of my brews. What are the other benefits of cooling quickly other than a shorter brew day? I'm playing devil's advocate....



- Cold break formation
- Reduced chance of infection from standing at temperatures that favor bacterial growth.

Of course, there are people who do no chill methods too.  I can't really comment on that.
Ditto.
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Offline a10t2

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Re: Hop stand for increased flavor/aroma
« Reply #22 on: November 14, 2009, 10:15:23 PM »
I realize this, and thus the need for 90 minute boils with high percentages of less modified malts like pilsner, but then why is there such stress on cooling your wort rapidly with other grain bills? I know for a fact that I don't use pilsner malt in many of my brews. What are the other benefits of cooling quickly other than a shorter brew day? I'm playing devil's advocate....

SMM can only be converted to DMS at relatively high temperatures (I think over ~160°F, but can't find it with a quick search). DMS boils at 99°F though, so there's still plenty of time for it to be driven off while chilling. BUT I think most people who do no-chill seal the wort roughly at boiling temperatures and leave it sealed. My guess is that with modern malts tending to have very low SMM levels to begin with, a normal 60 or 90 minute boil eliminates the vast majority. CO2 can also remove DMS during fermentation.

Also, it's good to keep in mind that almost all beers have DMS above the flavor threshold, although there's a lot of variation. In all but a few styles (British ales) the complete absence of detectable DMS would be a flaw.
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