Author Topic: Bru'n Water help  (Read 1355 times)

Offline booboo

  • 1st Kit
  • *
  • Posts: 5
    • View Profile
Bru'n Water help
« on: April 15, 2013, 08:11:29 PM »
I am having trouble figuring out how to use this spreadsheet.  I have read the instructions and water knowledge but still am having troubles.  If you look at the attachments in order for me to get the mash PH correct at 5.4 I had to acidify so much that the RA is now -15 where ideal is 82.  Why are these so far apart?





Offline garc_mall

  • Brewmaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 795
  • [1892.9, 294.9deg] AR Lynnwood, WA
    • View Profile
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #1 on: April 15, 2013, 10:06:35 PM »
So, I am not completely sure what your question is here, but I believe you are doing fine. The important thing is that you are within mash range, and then secondarily that your Cl/SO4 ratio is in line with what you want to taste. In this case both is correct. I wouldn't worry too much about RA.
In a Keg: Flanders Red Ale, Rye Altbier, Cascade/Topaz Pale
Fermenting: Flanders Red, Saison

Offline narvin

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1232
  • Baltimore
    • View Profile
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2013, 05:11:22 AM »
The RA needed in your water to hit a given pH depends on the acidity of the grist.  Even though you're making a dark beer, some malts (like crystal) have more acidity per color unit than others (like roast).  So you may need more acidity in your water than is expected.

You could also target pH 5.5 in the mash and you may get a result more in line with the suggested water profile.
Please do not reply if your an evil alien!
Thanks
Chris S.

Offline mabrungard

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1097
    • View Profile
    • Bru'n Water
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2013, 06:49:44 AM »
The RA shown for a water profile is a 'first guess' as to what your water MIGHT need for producing a decent mash pH.  There is no 'ideal' RA that you are aiming for.  The only thing that matters is the resulting mash pH.  Given your very alkaline tap water, the acidification is not surprising.  The other thing that you are doing is adding a dose of calcium chloride that is adding hardness and further depressing the RA.  It doesn't appear that that much CaCl is needed, but its your choice. 

As Narvin mentions, allowing a slightly higher target mash pH is another option.  That bump to 5.5 can help extract a little more color and fullness from the roast components.  I like the slightly high mash pH for my darker beers since I feel it softens the flavors.
Martin B
Carmel, IN

BJCP National
Foam Blowers of Indiana (FBI)

Brewing Water Information at:
https://sites.google.com/site/brunwater/

Like Bru'n Water on Facebook for occasional discussions on brewing water and Bru'n Water

Offline booboo

  • 1st Kit
  • *
  • Posts: 5
    • View Profile
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2013, 07:45:00 AM »
On a light beer I am diluting with 50% RO.  On the sparge acidification and adjustment summary it appears it is not being taken into consideration.  How do I figure out how much acid to add to the sparge when diluting with RO?  What about spraging with 100% RO?

Back to the dark beer, So the mash PH is the key and only use the desired RA as a starting point.  If it is off don't worry about it.  How does this look?  I have removed most of the salts, just enough to make the malty profile.

« Last Edit: April 16, 2013, 08:23:21 AM by booboo »

Offline mabrungard

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1097
    • View Profile
    • Bru'n Water
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2013, 09:15:33 AM »
Accounting for the dilution is fairly easy.  With your water properly entered on the input sheet, go to the Water Adjustment sheet and dial in 50 % dilution with RO.  That will report what the new alkalinity of that Diluted Water Profile is.  Enter that alkalinity on the Sparge Acidification sheet and you are ready to go. 

Its easier than that on the supporters version of Bru'n Water.  The sparge acidification sheet has a dilution calculator built into it and the alkalinity of the tap water from the input sheet is automatically brought over.
Martin B
Carmel, IN

BJCP National
Foam Blowers of Indiana (FBI)

Brewing Water Information at:
https://sites.google.com/site/brunwater/

Like Bru'n Water on Facebook for occasional discussions on brewing water and Bru'n Water

Offline booboo

  • 1st Kit
  • *
  • Posts: 5
    • View Profile
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #6 on: April 16, 2013, 03:25:27 PM »
Its easier than that on the supporters version of Bru'n Water.  The sparge acidification sheet has a dilution calculator built into it and the alkalinity of the tap water from the input sheet is automatically brought over.

How do you become a supporter?


Offline millstone

  • 1st Kit
  • *
  • Posts: 11
    • View Profile
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2013, 05:43:04 AM »
Its easier than that on the supporters version of Bru'n Water.  The sparge acidification sheet has a dilution calculator built into it and the alkalinity of the tap water from the input sheet is automatically brought over.

How do you become a supporter?

see last entry,  ---->   http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=15434.msg195278#msg195278
AJ says: 5.2 works great for brewers that don't check pH and doesn't work at all for those that do check.

Offline booboo

  • 1st Kit
  • *
  • Posts: 5
    • View Profile
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2013, 08:40:58 AM »
Any idea of what an appropriate donation is?  I don't want to be cheap but I am also not rich.


Its easier than that on the supporters version of Bru'n Water.  The sparge acidification sheet has a dilution calculator built into it and the alkalinity of the tap water from the input sheet is automatically brought over.

How do you become a supporter?

see last entry,  ---->   http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=15434.msg195278#msg195278

Offline millstone

  • 1st Kit
  • *
  • Posts: 11
    • View Profile
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #9 on: April 17, 2013, 09:40:28 AM »
I sent $5

tom
AJ says: 5.2 works great for brewers that don't check pH and doesn't work at all for those that do check.

Offline mainebrewer

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 128
  • Palermo, Maine
    • View Profile
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #10 on: April 18, 2013, 11:08:48 AM »
The cost of a brewing program like ProMash or Beersmith is $20-$25.
This program provides, IMO, at least as much value as programs like them.
Not saying you have to contribute $20-$25., just that if you did, you'd still be getting your money's worth.
 
"If stupidity got us into this mess, then why can't it get us out?" Will Rogers

Offline booboo

  • 1st Kit
  • *
  • Posts: 5
    • View Profile
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2013, 06:49:19 PM »
The cost of a brewing program like ProMash or Beersmith is $20-$25.
This program provides, IMO, at least as much value as programs like them.
Not saying you have to contribute $20-$25., just that if you did, you'd still be getting your money's worth.

I gave $20.  Money well spent. 

Offline troybinso

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 189
    • View Profile
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2013, 07:26:09 AM »
When adding salts to the sparge, do you add them to the hot liquor tank or the mash tun?

Offline mabrungard

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1097
    • View Profile
    • Bru'n Water
Re: Bru'n Water help
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2013, 09:23:39 AM »
When adding salts to the sparge, do you add them to the hot liquor tank or the mash tun?

I prefer adding the sparging minerals to the HLT so that they are added in proportion to the water amount.  This also helps me assure that they are dissolved.  Gypsum typically takes a few minutes of stirring to get it all into solution.  The other minerals are quite soluble.
Martin B
Carmel, IN

BJCP National
Foam Blowers of Indiana (FBI)

Brewing Water Information at:
https://sites.google.com/site/brunwater/

Like Bru'n Water on Facebook for occasional discussions on brewing water and Bru'n Water