Author Topic: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)  (Read 1391 times)

Offline skyler

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1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« on: May 16, 2013, 11:00:37 AM »
I now have a craft brewery source for 1968, and want to use some for my next IPA. Though I usually prefer Chico for such a beer, I have noticed that my wife (a major hophead) tends to prefer IPA made by craft breweries who use English yeast. I am trying to brew "her perfect beer." I have put together a hop bill and malt profile that I think will get me where I want it, but I am curious about the mash temperature I should use because this is a zero-specialty grain IPA. How should I mash this one? I want it dry - something like 75-80% attenuation. My instinct says to mash at 148-150, but I thought I would pass it by the forum and see if anyone has had similar experience.

Purrbox IPA(Yes, a cat-related name to please the wife)
11 lbs 8 oz GW 2-row
3 lbs Gambrinus Vienna
1 lb Castle Wheat Malt
8 oz Rice Hulls

12g Summit     15%AA     60 min
30g Columbus  14.6%AA   30 min
90g Amarillo     8%AA      10 min
60g Simcoe      13%AA      0 min
60g Chinook     11%AA      0 min
20g Columbus  14.6%AA    dry
20g Amarillo     8%AA       dry
20g Simcoe      13%AA      dry
20g Chinook     11%AA      dry

OG ~1.070
IBU ~70
1968 Fermented at ~63º F

Offline hoser

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2013, 11:07:28 AM »
I'd mash in the 148-149F range for dryness.

If you are looking for 75-80% attenuation in an English strain, you may not get it base on WY1968 stats listed on their website.

What about WY1318 London Ale III, or my personal favorite WLP007 Dry English Ale? Both will get you closer, IMHO.

Offline morticaixavier

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2013, 11:12:11 AM »
you might want to include a little sugar if your after that high attenuation with 1968 and a 1.070 OG. could be wrong though. and yeah mash 148 for 90 minutes.

I wouldn't bother with the wheat either but that's just me. you've got a pretty good pallet so if you notice a big dfference from including it go for it.

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Offline skyler

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2013, 11:26:52 AM »
you might want to include a little sugar if your after that high attenuation with 1968 and a 1.070 OG. could be wrong though. and yeah mash 148 for 90 minutes.

I wouldn't bother with the wheat either but that's just me. you've got a pretty good pallet so if you notice a big dfference from including it go for it.

I had considered a little sugar. I may do that. For some odd reason I am loathe to use sugar in most beers. I have nothing against the practice, but I always seem to avoid it. But this is probably a good example of when sugar can be helpful in a beer recipe.

As for the wheat, I like a little protein in my hoppy beer and I know she does too. A good head really brings out the hoppy aroma. I am not using it for the flavor it imparts, just for the added body and head retention. I actually discussed it a little bit here in more detail: http://brewinginlawschool.blogspot.com/2013/04/remembering-lost-recipe-old-school-ipa.html.

Offline erockrph

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2013, 11:49:10 AM »
Mash low and long. I don't think sugar is a necessity if you ferment low, then rouse and ramp up. Emphasis on rouse. If you take care of it I think you can hit the 1.012-1.016 range with 1968. It may not be single-digits Pliny-dry, but it will be plenty good for a beer like this (especially with no crystal malt).

I'd be tempted to throw in a little Biscuit or Victory just so that there's something else going on in the malt bill to provide a little balance to the hops.
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Offline blatz

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2013, 12:16:49 PM »
1968 is weird.  its a great yeast, but i guess you have to learn its fickle nature.  I've not used it in a few years, but I've had it attenuate only 70% and then on repitch pushed 80%.

Cigar City uses it as their house and gets 75-80% attenuation. 

I would make your beer without sugar, but mash lower first time around and see how it turns out. 
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Offline jeffy

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2013, 12:26:44 PM »

Cigar City uses it as their house and gets 75-80% attenuation. 
 

The stopped using it because it took too long to drop bright.  When you're in production and there's a big demand, you have to look for efficiency.  I think they use 1056 for most of their ales now.
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Offline davidgzach

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2013, 12:27:28 PM »
Sounds to me like a recipe you may fine tune over time.  Therefore I'm in the no sugar, low mash temp camp.  If it does not get where you want it, try some sugar in round #2.  Also a great project for you and your wife to tinker with together until you both think it's perfect.  Win/win!

I like the wheat addition and the fact that you have no crystal.

Dave
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Offline denny

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2013, 12:35:00 PM »

Cigar City uses it as their house and gets 75-80% attenuation. 
 

The stopped using it because it took too long to drop bright.  When you're in production and there's a big demand, you have to look for efficiency.  I think they use 1056 for most of their ales now.

Around here Ninkasi uses it, but they started centrifuging their beers to clear them.
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Offline dak0415

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2013, 12:36:30 PM »
If you want it THAT dry, mash at 146 for 90 min, then pitch it like a lager.  Ferment at 62-64 for 4 days then let it rise to 68-70 for 7 days.  The trick is to get it to finish before it flocks out.  Crash to 34 for 7 days and it will drop bright!
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Offline blatz

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #10 on: May 16, 2013, 12:36:49 PM »

Cigar City uses it as their house and gets 75-80% attenuation. 
 

The stopped using it because it took too long to drop bright.  When you're in production and there's a big demand, you have to look for efficiency.  I think they use 1056 for most of their ales now.

wow - thats news to me.  I hung out with Josh and Matt at the tasting room back in February and they told me 002 (white labs equivalent of 1968 or maybe it was the other way around).  maybe the switch is why i actually really liked the Jai Alai I got when visiting my mom last weekend (canned on 5/8/13) previously I've been so-so about it.
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Offline Joe Sr.

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2013, 12:53:41 PM »
1968 is weird.  its a great yeast, but i guess you have to learn its fickle nature.  I've not used it in a few years, but I've had it attenuate only 70% and then on repitch pushed 80%.

Cigar City uses it as their house and gets 75-80% attenuation. 

I would make your beer without sugar, but mash lower first time around and see how it turns out.

I get attenuation in the 80s using it for my old ale.  It get's repitched from a bitter and I use sugar to boost the gravity of the old ale so maybe those two things are helping my attenuation.

Looking at the notes I have here, one of the batches has gone from 1.082 down to 1.012.  My recollection is that batch may not have been 1968, but the 1968 only finished a few points higher.  Maybe 1.016 or so.
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Offline troybinso

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2013, 12:54:29 PM »
I wouldn't try to ferment this yeast that cold. As soon as the fermentation starts to slow down, the yeast start to drop out quickly. I like 1968, but I like it to start it at 66 degrees or so and then after about 2 days of fermentation ramp it to 70. It gets a little more estery, but they are good esters in my book, and they blend well with a fruity IPA.

Offline hoser

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2013, 12:58:03 PM »
Go back and maybe listen to Matt from Firestone on CYBI when he is discussing Union Jack?  He recommended the White Labs equivalent and they do a modified step mash at 144-146F and then raise to 158F, I believe.  He also gives their fermentation profile and I am pretty sure their attenuation gets close to your desired goal.  It may be worth visiting.  It's been awhile since I listened to that episode, so don't remember it exactly...
« Last Edit: May 16, 2013, 01:02:42 PM by hoser »

Offline skyler

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Re: 1968 in No-Crystal AIPA (Mash Temp Help)
« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2013, 01:27:42 PM »
I start cold (~63º F) and then I ramp up. Usually I let beers I brew with 1968 spend a day at high krausen around (~64º F), then I raise the temp to 66 the following day, then 68 the next, then 70 when it looks about done. I always give my beers a little longer than I think they need, especially with English yeast strains.

Ninkasi, Deschutes (Portland Pub beers, not year-round), Firestone-Walker, and Hopworks are all breweries with non-dry English yeast strains whose IPA's have met her seal of approval (though she also likes plenty of Chico-yeast IPA's). She actually hates Lagunitas (who uses 002, I believe).

This yeast will be harvested from a pale ale I brewed last weekend, in which I pitched some fresh slurry the brewery (Altamont) harvested from their Left Coast Session IPA.

I think I will go with ~149ºF for 60-90 min with no sugar and adjust it if the beer comes out too sweet. Williams has 6oz bags of Simcoe and Chinook pretty cheap right now, so I can just buy another couple of those if I want to try out this beer again soon. There can never be too many kegs of IPA in my home in the summer, as my wife is teacher (summer vacation) and her favorite beverage is IPA.