Author Topic: Flanders Red Carbonation Level  (Read 3547 times)

Offline kylekohlmorgen

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1163
    • View Profile
    • The South House Pilot Brewery
Flanders Red Carbonation Level
« on: May 31, 2013, 05:44:51 PM »
All you BJCP judges,

I've got a Flanders Red from 2011 that tastes GREAT, but the carbonation level is excessively high (foam over on opening).

Would I get majorly dinged for this in a competition? BJCP guidelines says low to medium carbonation.
@southhousebrew

Indianapolis, IN

Recipes, Brett/Bacteria Experiments:
http://southhousepilotbrewery.blogspot.com/

Offline santoch

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 25
  • North Bend, WA
    • View Profile
    • WAHA
Re: Flanders Red Carbonation Level
« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2013, 10:12:34 PM »
Gushers certainly don't help. The carbonic acid will probably be a bit hidden under the lactic and acetic acids, though it is possible it might lend a bit of harshness that wouldn't show if the beer was properly carbonated.  In short, I don't think it would be the end of the world if a FR is over carbonated, but it probably won't get top marks, either.

my .02-
Mt. Si Brewing Society
Washington Homebrewer's Association (WAHA)
BJCP GM D0799

Offline jamminbrew

  • Brewmaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 800
  • theAntipunk
    • View Profile
Re: Flanders Red Carbonation Level
« Reply #2 on: June 06, 2013, 10:40:35 PM »
On a scoresheet, carbonation falls under "mouthfeel" category. That's only 5 points out of 50, and there are several factors for mouthfeel, like Warmth, creaminess, astringency, and body, not just carbonation. A good judge will only ding you a few points, maybe 2 or 3 for over carbonated beer. More important is the aroma, flavor, and over all impression. If you are accurate on these points, you should score fairly well.
However, carbonation does affect other qualities, like body and hop aroma.
But, carbonation only matters for a few points. You may not take gold for an over-carbonated beer, but if it is brewed well, and to style, you should score well.
« Last Edit: June 06, 2013, 10:43:59 PM by jamminbrew »
Member, AHA
Member, Brew Brothers of Pikes Peak
BJCP judge# D1248
In caelo cerivisiae nil, hic igitur bibimus.

Offline kylekohlmorgen

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1163
    • View Profile
    • The South House Pilot Brewery
Re: Flanders Red Carbonation Level
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2013, 12:11:55 PM »
Entered this beer in a local comp. Had two very respected judges evaluate the beer.

Scored a 35, which is disappointing (the same beer scored in the low 40's a year ago).

Both judges agreed the carbonation level was too high, but I think their low marks on flavor may have been influenced by the aggressive carbonation.

Interestingly enough: their biggest problem with the beer was acetic acid level. However, one judge believed there is too much acetic, the other not enough.

Go figure.
@southhousebrew

Indianapolis, IN

Recipes, Brett/Bacteria Experiments:
http://southhousepilotbrewery.blogspot.com/

Offline redbeerman

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1713
  • On the banks of the mighty Susquehanna
    • View Profile
Re: Flanders Red Carbonation Level
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2013, 01:04:13 PM »
Judging is subjective.  I have had beers that one judge said was too hoppy, the other not hoppy enough.   On the Flanders red carbonation note, many of the bottled commercial examples I've had were aggressively carbonated.  On tap , they were less so.  The BJCP guidelines say low to medium carbonation, but I would have to disagree.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2013, 01:11:30 PM by redbeerman »
CH3CH2OH - Without it, life itself would be impossible.

[441, 112.1deg] AR

Jim

Offline morticaixavier

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 5656
  • Davis, CA
    • View Profile
    • The Best Artist in the WORLD!!!!!
Re: Flanders Red Carbonation Level
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2013, 01:18:45 PM »
Judging is subjective.  I have had beers that one judge said was too hoppy, the other not hoppy enough.   On the Flanders red carbonation note, many of the bottled commercial examples I've had were aggressively carbonated.  On tap , they were less so.  The BJCP guidelines say low to medium carbonation, but I would have to disagree.

I see what you mean. with a style like this where the carbonation could well increase with time in the bottle it is hard to put a limit on it.
"Creativity is the residue of wasted time" - A. Einstein

Jonathan I Fuller

Offline kylekohlmorgen

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1163
    • View Profile
    • The South House Pilot Brewery
Re: Flanders Red Carbonation Level
« Reply #6 on: July 03, 2013, 06:27:54 AM »
Most of my bottle-conditioned sours end up being over-carbonated. I also find this in a lot of commercial examples.

I enjoy most sours at lower carb levels, and I'll normally allow a bottle to gas off a bit (and pour into a big glass). I doubt many competitions go through the trouble.

I'm not giving up on it yet. Bottle conditioning really pulls the flavors together, I just need to get my technique down. The Beer Gun is a big help. And mixing the priming solution in a keg will allow me to more accurately measure the beer volume, cut down on O2 pickup, and evenly mix.
@southhousebrew

Indianapolis, IN

Recipes, Brett/Bacteria Experiments:
http://southhousepilotbrewery.blogspot.com/