Author Topic: Black IPA Questions  (Read 1537 times)

Offline nicosan1

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Black IPA Questions
« on: August 18, 2013, 08:18:48 AM »
This will only be my third all grain recipe. My girlfriend wanted me to brew a Black IPA, Ive not done black IPA but have been reading Mitch Steele's book as well as get ideas about Black IPAs I like like Self Righteous and Black IPA. I have some Amarillo Hop pellets I though I could use but wanted to get your thoughts on this recipe.

Could you guys give me your thoughts? Want to get the malt and character that dont interfere too much with amarillo, and perhaps citra.  Do you have recommendations?


Batch Size (fermenter): 5.00 gal Boil Size: 6.52 gal
Boil Time: 60 min
End of Boil Volume 5.98 gal Final Bottling Volume: 4.60 gal Fermentation: Ale,
Two Stage Taste Notes:

Equipment: Pot and Cooler ( 5 Gal/19 L) - All Grain Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency 74.8 %
Taste Rating(out of 50): 30.0

Measured Original Gravity: Measured Final Gravity: 1.010 SG Actual Alcohol by Vol: 4.7 % Calories: 151.6 kcal/12oz
Mash Profile
Total Grain Weight: 14 lbs 14.0 oz

13 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM)
8oz Carafa III (525.0 SRM)
8oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 80L (80.0 SRM)
8oz Naked Oats, Flaked (1.0 SRM)
6oz Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM)

1oz Chinook [13.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min
1oz Chinook [13.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min
1oz Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min

1oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 5.0 min
1oz Citra [12.00 %] - Boil 0.0 min
American Ale II (Wyeast Labs #1272) [124.21 ml]


1 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days
1 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days

Beer Profile
Est Original Gravity: 1.069 SG Est Final Gravity: 1.016 SG Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 7.1 % Bitterness: 73.7 IBUs
Est Color: 30.2 SRM
Mash Name: Single Infusion, Medium Body, Batch Sparge
1.046 SG

Online hopfenundmalz

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2013, 10:52:12 AM »
You probably know that you want the dehusked carafa III special to minimize roast/burnt flavor. Some like midnight wheat as it also is husk less.
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Offline erockrph

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2013, 12:14:01 PM »
You probably know that you want the dehusked carafa III special to minimize roast/burnt flavor. Some like midnight wheat as it also is husk less.

+1 - I've had the "dammit!" moment where I realized that the Carafa III I got wasn't the dehusked type - as I tasted the way-too-roasty amber I brewed with it.

Depending on how much roast character you want in the finished beer, I'd also recommend cold-steeping some (or all) of the roasted grains to keep the roasted character minimized. Hop bill looks good to me.
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Offline nicosan1

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2013, 12:18:12 PM »
I'll make sure to check that the Carafa III at my LHBS is dehusked, didnt realize there were two versions. They might also have Midnight Wheat so that could be an alternative. I though of switching out a pound of 2 row for a pound of Rye malt, ala Wookey jack. 

Offline GolfBum

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2013, 02:40:01 PM »
I recently made a few black IPA's and the one that turned out great was pale malt, chocolate, rye and I believe crystal 120 with some toasted oats. It was a good amount of black, little roasty/coffee notes and some chocolate. Paired well with the magnum, cascade and amarillo hops I used. If you want I can get my notes out and post the grain bill.

Offline nicosan1

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2013, 03:15:20 PM »
Quote
I recently made a few black IPA's and the one that turned out great was pale malt, chocolate, rye and I believe crystal 120 with some toasted oats. It was a good amount of black, little roasty/coffee notes and some chocolate. Paired well with the magnum, cascade and amarillo hops I used. If you want I can get my notes out and post the grain bill.

Would be much appreciated Golfbum.

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2013, 04:33:35 PM »
+1 to dehusked Carafa.  I like some pineyness in a Black IPA, from Chinook or Columbus as dry hops - I think it compliments the style. But it'll be good as is. Nice job.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2013, 06:43:12 PM by HoosierBrew »
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Offline mabrungard

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #7 on: August 19, 2013, 05:17:31 AM »
I'm curious about the use of oats in the recipe.  I reviewed Michael Lewis' book on Stout last week and noted his finding that oats don't provide flavor or texture improvements in stouts.  Instead, he and his tasting panel found the flavor was grainy and the texture tended to be astringent.  Hardly the creamy, oily texture that is often cited.  This was reportedly for a stout they crafted with 30% oats.  I assume this was to better assess the effect of oats in beer.  Typical recipes use less oat content, but the result does raise the question about using oats.

I have to admit that I find some of those characteristics when I use flaked barley, so I'm not terribly surprised with Lewis' finding.  I do like the use of flaked wheat in recipes though.  It does provide a body improvement with only minor graininess.
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Offline denny

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #8 on: August 19, 2013, 08:08:48 AM »
I recently made a few black IPA's and the one that turned out great was pale malt, chocolate, rye and I believe crystal 120 with some toasted oats. It was a good amount of black, little roasty/coffee notes and some chocolate. Paired well with the magnum, cascade and amarillo hops I used. If you want I can get my notes out and post the grain bill.

You could put the whole recipe in the recipe wiki so it would be archived....http://wiki.homebrewersassociation.org/BeerRecipes
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Offline nicosan1

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2013, 09:13:19 AM »
In regards to the Naked Oats, I thought to add them because I had added them to a Coconut Brown Ale I did. Steele's book mentioned adjuncts in Black IPAs, I thought about maybe adding a bit of corn sugar, just for a bit of dryness, maybe 1/2 pound.

Do folks add any adjuncts or is pretty simple 2-row, Caramel or Munich and Carafa/MidWheat?

Offline kylekohlmorgen

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2013, 09:50:10 AM »
I'm curious about the use of oats in the recipe.  I reviewed Michael Lewis' book on Stout last week and noted his finding that oats don't provide flavor or texture improvements in stouts.  Instead, he and his tasting panel found the flavor was grainy and the texture tended to be astringent.  Hardly the creamy, oily texture that is often cited.  This was reportedly for a stout they crafted with 30% oats.  I assume this was to better assess the effect of oats in beer.  Typical recipes use less oat content, but the result does raise the question about using oats.

I have to admit that I find some of those characteristics when I use flaked barley, so I'm not terribly surprised with Lewis' finding.  I do like the use of flaked wheat in recipes though.  It does provide a body improvement with only minor graininess.

I recently had an astringent, almost plastic character in an oatmeal stout, which I attributed to the 17% oats in the grist (3 lbs in a 5.5 gallon batch). If you chew on a small handfull of the stuff you get the same unpleasant flavor.

I do believe oats (and flaked barley) can improve texture, but more isn't always better. 3-5% Should do.

The quality/freshness may also play a role in off-flavor contribution.
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Offline gmac

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2013, 12:57:05 PM »
I suggest you brew a regular IPA and tell her to drink it with her eyes closed.

Offline dannyjed

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2013, 03:10:01 PM »
I'm going to use Carafa III and CandiSyrup 180 in my next Black IPA for the color.  The last time I used Chocolate and Black Prinz - it was too roasty and clashed with the citrusy hops.
Dan Chisholm

Offline erockrph

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2013, 06:05:57 PM »
I'm going to use Carafa III and CandiSyrup 180 in my next Black IPA for the color.  The last time I used Chocolate and Black Prinz - it was too roasty and clashed with the citrusy hops.

It may not be roasty, but the D-180 will bring quite a bit of flavor with it. That's not necessarily a bad thing (I've used it with excellent results in a hoppy Belgian I brewed last year), but if you're looking for something that adds color without flavor you're probably best off sticking to the dehusked malts.
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Offline dannyjed

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Re: Black IPA Questions
« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2013, 07:35:55 PM »
I'm going to use Carafa III and CandiSyrup 180 in my next Black IPA for the color.  The last time I used Chocolate and Black Prinz - it was too roasty and clashed with the citrusy hops.

It may not be roasty, but the D-180 will bring quite a bit of flavor with it. That's not necessarily a bad thing (I've used it with excellent results in a hoppy Belgian I brewed last year), but if you're looking for something that adds color without flavor you're probably best off sticking to the dehusked malts.
I've used CandiSyrups a number of times and like the flavors as well, but I've never tried it with a Black IPA.  I think it would add a nice dimension to a Black IPA balancing out the hops.
Dan Chisholm