Author Topic: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?  (Read 1991 times)

Offline vista

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #15 on: October 01, 2013, 02:34:28 PM »


The OP says he roused it twice...

That's what she said

In that case, I doubt that warming it will do any good.

Better than cold crashing it...


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Offline Joe Sr.

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #16 on: October 01, 2013, 02:38:05 PM »
To the op, you say you've run into this problem multiple times over the last year with big beers.

Kinda makes me wonder about oxygenation of the wort...

IME, you need a good does of O2 and a big healthy pitch of yeast for big beers to attenuate well.  With both of those, I've been able to get 1968 to do it's job on a big old ale of +/- 1.098.
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Offline gmac

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #17 on: October 01, 2013, 02:45:07 PM »
I hate 002.  Stalled for me several times. Just sayin'...

Offline dmtaylor

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #18 on: October 01, 2013, 02:45:48 PM »
To the OP, you mashed way too warm at 153 F for an OG 1.100 beer to expect good attenuation.  Next time if you want your FG to get down into the 1.020s, mash at friggin 148 F, especially if using a low attenuating high flocculating yeast like WLP002.

It's done fermenting.

The only thing you could try now is krausening with an obscenely large yeast "starter", maybe a full gallon, of highly attenuative yeast such as US-05 or maybe even a saison yeast (I like Belle Saison).  With either of those, it won't produce a lot of flavor anymore given that fermentation is 80% done, but it should finish the job for you.  And keep it warm, around 70-ish or maybe even 72-73 F.
Dave

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Offline gmac

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #19 on: October 01, 2013, 02:54:07 PM »
To the OP, you mashed way too warm at 153 F for an OG 1.100 beer to expect good attenuation.  Next time if you want your FG to get down into the 1.020s, mash at friggin 148 F, especially if using a low attenuating high flocculating yeast like WLP002.

It's done fermenting.

The only thing you could try now is krausening with an obscenely large yeast "starter", maybe a full gallon, of highly attenuative yeast such as US-05 or maybe even a saison yeast (I like Belle Saison).  With either of those, it won't produce a lot of flavor anymore given that fermentation is 80% done, but it should finish the job for you.  And keep it warm, around 70-ish or maybe even 72-73 F.

Yeah...what he said!

Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #20 on: October 01, 2013, 02:55:32 PM »
To the OP, you mashed way too warm at 153 F for an OG 1.100 beer to expect good attenuation.  Next time if you want your FG to get down into the 1.020s, mash at friggin 148 F, especially if using a low attenuating high flocculating yeast like WLP002.

It's done fermenting.

The only thing you could try now is krausening with an obscenely large yeast "starter", maybe a full gallon, of highly attenuative yeast such as US-05 or maybe even a saison yeast (I like Belle Saison).  With either of those, it won't produce a lot of flavor anymore given that fermentation is 80% done, but it should finish the job for you.  And keep it warm, around 70-ish or maybe even 72-73 F.
+1.  I mash a big quad (or similar) sub-150, like 148 or 9, to get the attenuation and drinkability I like.  Extra oxygen and ramping up are pretty much mandatory to get 1.100 down to a fairly low number.
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Offline morticaixavier

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #21 on: October 01, 2013, 03:41:27 PM »
To the OP, you mashed way too warm at 153 F for an OG 1.100 beer to expect good attenuation.  Next time if you want your FG to get down into the 1.020s, mash at friggin 148 F, especially if using a low attenuating high flocculating yeast like WLP002.

It's done fermenting.

The only thing you could try now is krausening with an obscenely large yeast "starter", maybe a full gallon, of highly attenuative yeast such as US-05 or maybe even a saison yeast (I like Belle Saison).  With either of those, it won't produce a lot of flavor anymore given that fermentation is 80% done, but it should finish the job for you.  And keep it warm, around 70-ish or maybe even 72-73 F.
+1.  I mash a big quad (or similar) sub-150, like 148 or 9, to get the attenuation and drinkability I like.  Extra oxygen and ramping up are pretty much mandatory to get 1.100 down to a fairly low number.

I don't think extra o2 is needed. I have never used o2 and I have had 1.100+ beers finish in the 1.020-1.010 range when all malt and using british yeast and in the 1.010-1.000 range when a healthy dose of simple sugar is added. bringing the temp up though can be quite helpful.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #22 on: October 01, 2013, 03:57:48 PM »
Actually I normally use a mix-stir for most beers, but for 1.090+ beers I've always felt that some added O2 was helpful, as compared to not using it. But your results speak for themselves. Definitely agree totally on the added sugar (added incrementally sometimes) helping to attenuate.
Jon H.

Offline erockrph

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #23 on: October 01, 2013, 05:05:31 PM »
To the OP, you mashed way too warm at 153 F for an OG 1.100 beer to expect good attenuation.  Next time if you want your FG to get down into the 1.020s, mash at friggin 148 F, especially if using a low attenuating high flocculating yeast like WLP002.

This will certainly vary depending on your system, but I never mash below 153 (unless I miss my strike temp by a degree or two) and my big beers attenuate just fine. You just need to make sure you mash long enough. When I target 153 for my mash temp I'm usually in the 147-148 range after 90 minutes. It's all conjecture, but I feel like the extra few degrees gets better alpha amylase activity early on without denaturing the beta amylase to a great extent. This way as the temp starts to drop the alpha amylase has already done its thing and the beta has more to chew on.

This is why I've never used 1968 for a big beer though. That yeast is just a weird bugger. If I really wanted the 1968 flavor in a barleywine I'd pitch and hold it at 68F for a few days, then toss in a couple of packs of US-05 to finish up the job. When I use 1968 it's usually because I want a beer with a little less attenuation. Obviously it can be done based on everyone else's results, but I don't have the time or degree of temp control to want to try that with this strain.
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Offline majorvices

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #24 on: October 01, 2013, 06:02:25 PM »

The OP says he roused it twice...

Hey, I missed that! ;)
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Offline mainebrewer

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #25 on: October 02, 2013, 06:16:49 AM »
I use 002 on a regular basis.
As noted in previous posts, it flocs real easy, and is a real bear to rouse using most homebrewing equipment.
Back in my extract days when I had a stuck ferment, I found the only reliable way to get the beer to finish was to warm it up into the mid 70's, swirl the carboy to resuspend the yeast and add 1/2 tsp amylase enzyme per 5 gal.
Keep it in the mid 70's for a couple of weeks.
I know some have some horror stories using amylase but I never did using the 1/2 tsp per 5 gal dose.
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Offline BrewingRover

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #26 on: October 02, 2013, 06:23:12 AM »
My experience with 1968/WLP002 is that you need to oxygenate well and pitch about 2X what the calculators say in order to get it to finish before it drops.  3 days at 62 then up to 68-70 to finish.
I've been doing this with 1968 and it's been working great. I think the key is to ramp up around 3-4 days while there is still yeast in suspension.
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Offline reverseapachemaster

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #27 on: October 02, 2013, 07:23:28 AM »
I'd also strongly recommend calibrating/checking your thermometer. If you are using one of the typical homebrewing floating thermometer then it's highly likely it is way, way off. Mine is like 6-8 degrees low around mash temperatures.
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Offline redbeerman

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #28 on: October 03, 2013, 05:59:15 AM »
All the things said here about this yeast are true.  I don't personally recommend using this yeast for anything above 1.060.  It finishes its job and falls out in a pile of goop.  Nearly impossible to rouse successfully on a homebrewing scale, although I have.  It's a great yeast for a low gravity beer that you want to finish with some body and maltiness, like a mild, bitter or ESB.  On a beer staring at 1.100, finishing at 1.040 is not too bad.
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Offline BP79

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Re: Poor WLP002 attenuation: raise temp to fix?
« Reply #29 on: October 03, 2013, 06:46:08 AM »
Rousing it was like mixing caramel with a plastic straw.  I ended up taking the day off from work, took a trip to my LHBS, and made another starter last night.  I'll check back later next week let you know how things work out. 

FWIW, the temp stayed at 153 over the course of mash... but that's probably in jeopardy given my thermometer accuracy.  I usually use 001/007, but given I've had this happen before, I think I need to do some serious homework before my next big brew.