Author Topic: Bicarbonate HCO3  (Read 645 times)

Offline klickitat jim

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3056
    • View Profile
Bicarbonate HCO3
« on: November 26, 2013, 06:33:50 PM »
?

My Ward report shows Bicarbonate 130ppm. When I use brewers friend it shows that number in red, too high.
If that a major problem? Anything I can do to fix it or should I just ignore and push on?

Offline michaeltrego

  • Cellarman
  • **
  • Posts: 32
    • View Profile
Re: Bicarbonate HCO3
« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2013, 06:43:21 PM »
I believe that level of HCO3 will be fine for darker styles, but you will likely want to reduce it by dilution for lighter styles.  What did the rest of the Ward Labs report reveal?

Offline klickitat jim

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3056
    • View Profile
Re: Bicarbonate HCO3
« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2013, 07:06:15 PM »
It's on the Post Your Water thread. All low numbers but that one. PH 7.8

Offline hopfenundmalz

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 4768
  • Milford, MI
    • View Profile
Re: Bicarbonate HCO3
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2013, 07:15:19 PM »
The alkalinity is what you want to pay attention to, and more than that the mash pH, not water pH.

Getting more Ca as in gypsum or CaCl2 will help drive the mash pH down.

One better alternative is to dilute with RO/distilled waster. Or use acid, or acidulated malt. Or lime to remove the Carbonates, but that takes some understanding.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2013, 01:00:47 AM by hopfenundmalz »
Jeff Rankert
Ann Arbor Brewers Guild, AHA Member, BJCP Certified
Home-brewing, not just a hobby, it is a lifestyle!

Offline klickitat jim

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3056
    • View Profile
Re: Bicarbonate HCO3
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2013, 07:21:50 PM »
I'm working my recipes for the next brew day. I think I'm on it. I was just curious about that bicarbonate number.

Offline klickitat jim

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3056
    • View Profile
Re: Bicarbonate HCO3
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2013, 07:44:55 PM »
Here's my numbers so you don't have to go looking

PH 7.8
TDS 125
Sodium 8
Potassium 2
Calcium 17
Magnesium 10
CaCo3 84
Nitrate .3
Sulfate, chloride, carbonate all 0
Bicarbonate 130
Total alkalinity 107
Total phosphorus .08
Total iron 0

So using brewers friend...
IPA, 14# grain, 13 SRM
I'll be adding 10g gypsum, 12g CaCl2 to the 7 gallon mash. And 1/2 tsp lactic to 4.5 gallon sparge. At the bottom all green stars and says it will be bitter. I assume that's hop forward.

Am I doing it right?
Should I just not worry about the bicarbonate number?

Offline klickitat jim

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3056
    • View Profile
Re: Bicarbonate HCO3
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2013, 07:48:25 PM »
Using light hoppy profile BTW

Offline HydraulicSammich

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 126
  • Logan, UT
    • View Profile
Re: Bicarbonate HCO3
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2013, 08:18:32 PM »
So Jim, what does your spreadsheet tell you the estimated mash pH is and the estimated sparge pH?  If your pH is in range, it should be taking care of your bicarbonates
AHA Member 900001775

Offline repo

  • Brewer
  • ****
  • Posts: 326
  • San Diego CA
    • View Profile
Re: Bicarbonate HCO3
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2013, 08:26:20 PM »
I'll just give you the numbers I look for when making an Ipa. In ppm

Mash ph 5.3-5.5  The ph is the most important number.
Calcium- 50 -100  My 2nd most important, it's needed throughout the life of the beer.
Sulfate 150-300    This is for the hops, so lets have lots
Chloride 0-50       This is for the malts, so usually Ipa not so much

It's all about getting the the mash ph, then its straight flavoring in the kettle if necessary. If the ph is right you are basically just flavoring to taste. Calcium though is necessary so its always above 50

Offline klickitat jim

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3056
    • View Profile
Re: Bicarbonate HCO3
« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2013, 08:31:45 PM »
So Jim, what does your spreadsheet tell you the estimated mash pH is and the estimated sparge pH?  If your pH is in range, it should be taking care of your bicarbonates

Yes. I'm not looking at it right now, but I used the advanced water calculator and it estimated my mash PH at 5.4 IIRC.

Offline HydraulicSammich

  • Assistant Brewer
  • ***
  • Posts: 126
  • Logan, UT
    • View Profile
Re: Bicarbonate HCO3
« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2013, 08:35:01 PM »
Okay, I agree with repo on the pale ale numbers.  Your pH is in range.  Do your final numbers look within repo range?
AHA Member 900001775

Offline klickitat jim

  • Official Poobah of No Life.
  • *
  • Posts: 3056
    • View Profile
Re: Bicarbonate HCO3
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2013, 08:44:53 PM »
I believe so. I'll double check next time I run it.
Thanks guys