Author Topic: Whiskey  (Read 16397 times)

Offline Joe Sr.

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #60 on: December 13, 2013, 02:49:15 PM »
Tennessee Sour Mash... you get the point.  There's a ton of good whiskey and nasty scotch out there to explore. 

Tennessee whiskey = bourbon distilled in Tennessee + marketing.

Activated charcoal filtration? Done elsewhere, too.

Sour mash?  Ubiquitous in the making of whiskey.

But your overall point I agree with.  Not sure I agree with Canadian whiskey, but I've never really been forced to explore it.  Rye whiskey is good stuff, but I don't think rye is entry level.  It can be sharp.  But good rye is good stuff.  And it makes the BEST Manhattan.

Maybe buy a couple different half pints and try them side by side?  Maybe a good starting point is several of the mass market "decent" whiskeys in half pints.  That way, your investment isn't too much and you've got some for side by side.  Can you get half-pints of Makers? You certainly can't get Basil Hayden's in half pints.

As you can see, we all (or several of us) have strong opinions on whiskey.

Major - How about Black Maple Hill?  That's some good stuff, too. 

I'm starting to sound like a rummy.
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Offline euge

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #61 on: December 13, 2013, 03:08:41 PM »
I went by my local and their prices tend to be at least a couple bucks more but the convenience is worth it. The Maker's was $26/fifth. The Ancient Age bourbon was $14. Most of the good stuff was in the high 20's and 30's...

I opted for the J.T.S. Brown at $11 per. Sipping some now.. Big difference from the Dickle. Now this is entry level!

Quite good.
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Offline majorvices

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #62 on: December 13, 2013, 03:09:38 PM »
Actually, Tennessee whiskey must be charcoal filtered to be considered Tennessee whiskey as well as being made in Tennessee.

Haven't had the black maple hill. Will look for it.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2013, 03:12:00 PM by majorvices »
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Offline majorvices

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #63 on: December 13, 2013, 03:11:06 PM »
I opted for the J.T.S. Brown at $11 per. Sipping some now.. Big difference from the Dickle. Now this is entry level!


Oh well. Can't say I didn't try to steer you right. I tried.
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Offline Pinski

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #64 on: December 13, 2013, 03:17:10 PM »
I opted for the J.T.S. Brown at $11 per. Sipping some now.. Big difference from the Dickle. Now this is entry level!


Oh well. Can't say I didn't try to steer you right. I tried.
You can't help someone that doesn't want to be helped.   ;D     I kid Euge.
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Offline punatic

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #65 on: December 13, 2013, 04:24:28 PM »
Sour mash?  Ubiquitous in the making of whiskey.

Not true.
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Offline euge

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #66 on: December 13, 2013, 04:40:40 PM »
I opted for the J.T.S. Brown at $11 per. Sipping some now.. Big difference from the Dickle. Now this is entry level!


Oh well. Can't say I didn't try to steer you right. I tried.
You can't help someone that doesn't want to be helped.   ;D     I kid Euge.

Quote from: euge
Even though I knew better- I did it anyway...

Nah the bourbon is fine. Just what I was looking for to get some sort of baseline going. I'll price the Weller and Maker's at SPECs.
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. -Richard P. Feynman

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Offline Pinski

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #67 on: December 13, 2013, 04:45:52 PM »
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Offline Joe Sr.

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #68 on: December 13, 2013, 05:06:44 PM »
Perhaps "ubiquitous" is overstating it. But it's not confined to Tennessee whiskey.

Edit: BTW, Chuck Cowdery who is something of an expert in bourbon claims here that all the major distilleries employ the sour mash technique: http://chuckcowdery.blogspot.com/2011/02/buffalo-trace-demonstrates-another-way.html?m=1

Which would make it ubiquitous and at the least nothing particularly out of the norm.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2013, 05:17:58 PM by Joe Sr. »
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Offline punatic

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #69 on: December 13, 2013, 06:44:43 PM »
I must be using another definition of ubiquitous.

A couple of things about the article:
not all American distilleries use sour mash fermentation techniques.  Particularly if they are not making sour mash whiskey.

1:3 or 1:4 use of backset will inhibit fermentation:  at that application rate you will be attempting to start fermentation with a pH level in the high 2s.    20% (1:5) is the highest level of backset addition that I have found to be sustainable over repeated iterations.  Although, I think there is something else in the backset that inhibits yeast growth, in addition to acidification.  The inhibition effect intensifies with successive iterations, even when the pH is adjusted to an optimal range.   
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Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #70 on: December 13, 2013, 06:49:17 PM »
According to Bruce Willis in The Seige, M16s are "ubiquitous". I always wondered what that meant, but now I know it means "from Tennessee" .

Offline Joe Sr.

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #71 on: December 13, 2013, 06:59:02 PM »
I must be using another definition of ubiquitous.

No.  I doubt it.  Like I said, I may have overstated, but to my knowledge (not gleaned from first person visits or interviews) sour mash is a common practice in the production of bourbon which you are more likely than not to find.  Pretty much everyone employs it, though not all.  Even the local distiller I am most familiar with produces whiskeys that cannot be bourbon (grain bill) they employ (IIRC after a night of sampling) a sour mash in making their various whiskeys.

I can't speak to the ratios. Nor to anything related to actually producing whiskey.  Other than what I've learned from observation, reading, etc.

Nor am I suggesting that producers of Scotch whisky or Canadian whiskey employ this technique.  I have no idea.  My comments were restricted to the production of commercial bourbon.

My larger point was that there is nothing that Jack Daniels is doing in producing Tennessee Whiskey that is different from bourbon production.  Neither sour mash nor charcoal filtration is limited to Tennessee nor do they produce something that is not bourbon.  JD is bourbon.  The Tennessee Whiskey appellation is a marketing gimmick.  Even if they succeed in getting DOC status, which I seem to recall they were going for with respect to the European market.
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Offline HoosierBrew

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #72 on: December 13, 2013, 07:03:20 PM »
Just wanna say, after talking up the merits of single malts all day, I'm enjoying the hell out of some Knob Creek tonight. Good whiskey beats beats bad whiskey, bourbon or malt.       ;)
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Offline Pinski

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #73 on: December 13, 2013, 07:15:20 PM »
Just wanna say, after talking up the merits of single malts all day, I'm enjoying the hell out of some Knob Creek tonight. Good whiskey beats beats bad whiskey, bourbon or malt.       ;)
Cheers to that! Two fingers please.
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Offline thebigbaker

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Re: Whiskey
« Reply #74 on: December 13, 2013, 07:18:28 PM »
According to Bruce Willis in The Seige, M16s are "ubiquitous". I always wondered what that meant, but now I know it means "from Tennessee" .

Well, then as big fan of Alabama football, I hate anything that's "ubiquitous!"
Jeremy Baker

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