[Jimmy K]

I don't believe it.  If true, that would be revolutionary information.  Millions of people have been taught that lager yeast is a different species from ale yeast.  Related, but different species. 

Hardly revolutionary in biology to reclassify organisms - either deciding that two species are the same or splitting strains into distinct species. It happens all the time. Just look at dogs if you want to see the diversity that can come from a single species. Or humans - some can't digest certain things (like lactose) and some can.

So lactose-intolerant folks are the ale yeast of humans?

I guess so

[erockrph]

From wikipedia:

As S. pastorianus is a hybrid of Saccharomyces bayanus (or, as recently proposed, Saccharomyces eubayanus [3]) and Saccharomyces cerevisiae, finding a degree of phenotypic and genomic similarity between the two species is not surprising.[4] The hybrid nature of S. pastorianus also explains the genome size, which is up to 60% larger than that of S. cerevisiae, as it includes large parts of the two genomes.[5] There is growing evidence, however, that S. pastorianus has inherited most of its genetic material from S. bayanus.[5] Indeed the mitochondrial DNA[6] and ribosomal DNA[5] of S. pastorianus appear to be derived from S. bayanus rather than S. cerevisiae.

[troybinso]

From wikipedia:

As S. pastorianus is a hybrid of Saccharomyces bayanus (or, as recently proposed, Saccharomyces eubayanus [3]) and Saccharomyces cerevisiae, finding a degree of phenotypic and genomic similarity between the two species is not surprising.[4] The hybrid nature of S. pastorianus also explains the genome size, which is up to 60% larger than that of S. cerevisiae, as it includes large parts of the two genomes.[5] There is growing evidence, however, that S. pastorianus has inherited most of its genetic material from S. bayanus.[5] Indeed the mitochondrial DNA[6] and ribosomal DNA[5] of S. pastorianus appear to be derived from S. bayanus rather than S. cerevisiae.

Phew! that clears it up.

[morticaixavier]

"In today's news, FLBrewer discovered there is no difference between lagers and ales...craft beer fans are outraged"


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to me the big difference is temperature tolerances. while you can ferment an ale or a lager yeast at say 65 you can ferment a lager yeast at 45 and the vast majority of ale yeasts would not be able to be active at those temps. As I understand the current genetic info on these yeasts the new world S. eubayanus contains those genes conferring the abilitity to be active at a lower temps.

[denny]

So what is the difference? Other then I can't drink most lagers.


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The difference is the genetics of the yeast.

[klickitat jim]

Isnt science all about discovering truth and accepting it over the dogma of the masses? No offense Dmtaylor, but id go with what Wyeast says over what millions of peoole have been taught. But I reserve the right to change my mind if the masses show up with torches and pitchforks.

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[klickitat jim]

"In today's news, FLBrewer discovered there is no difference between lagers and ales...craft beer fans are outraged"


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This is the funniest thing I've heard all day. Well done sir

[hopfenundmalz]

So what is the difference? Other then I can't drink most lagers.


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Can you explain why you can't drink most lagers?

[HoosierBrew]

+1. Way too many different styles of lagers (or ales) to generalize. I get that from some of my family directed at ales in general, too. It's fun to serve them one where they have to eat their words and admit they really like it.

[flbrewer]

So what is the difference? Other then I can't drink most lagers.


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Can you explain why you can't drink most lagers?

I can, it's just that in general, I don't like the taste of most lagers. Although I do like some commercial lagers like Samuel Smith Organic Lager.

[hopfenundmalz]

So what is the difference? Other then I can't drink most lagers.


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Can you explain why you can't drink most lagers?

I can, it's just that in general, I don't like the taste of most lagers. Although I do like some commercial lagers like Samuel Smith Organic Lager.

There is a world of lagers that most don't know. Explore lagers more. There are some truly great ones in Germany that either don't make the trip over, or suffer from the travel.

Sort of like someone saying I don't like beer. They haven't found the one they like.

[dmtaylor]

Okay... so... Wyeast is the only friggin webpage on the planet that says lager yeast and ale yeast are the same species.  I Googled and Googled and couldn't find one single news article or Wiki-anything telling me that the two species had been combined.  Go ahead and look, and let me know if you can find an independent source of the information that has two of its own legs to stand on.  Ready, set, go!

[klickitat jim]

I see torches and pitchforks.... screw Wyeast! I think they are totally different!

[euge]

I've brewed with both enough now and think you can use recipes interchangeably with either type, but lager yeast results in brews that simply taste different than ale yeast. Could they be confused for each other at times? Yes. Perhaps.

I recall an article that lager yeast share ancient dna found in yeast trapped in prehistoric amber.

[majorvices]

So what is the difference? Other then I can't drink most lagers.


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Can you explain why you can't drink most lagers?

I can, it's just that in general, I don't like the taste of most lagers. Although I do like some commercial lagers like Samuel Smith Organic Lager.

There is a world of lagers that most don't know. Explore lagers more. There are some truly great ones in Germany that either don't make the trip over, or suffer from the travel.

Sort of like someone saying I don't like beer. They haven't found the one they like.

+1 - I've heard this comment before from craft beer drinkers "I don't like lagers" and it means they just haven't really become familiar with lagers from around the world. There are so many great lager beers out there. Start with bocks, for instance.

Problems is, ales are so easy to brew and turn around and that is what you find most American craft breweries focusing on.

As far as differences go, lager yeasts can ferment some sugars ale yeast can't. They leave behind a much slimmer ester profile so are much, much cleaner tasting and lend a particular smoothness and refinement that ale yeasts can't achieve - although some, such as WY1007, can get very close to.