Author Topic: Homebrew Competition Rules  (Read 688 times)

Offline Rief Artisan Ales

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Homebrew Competition Rules
« on: March 25, 2014, 07:48:15 PM »
Should judges be allowed to enter beer in the same competition that they are judging in? I feel that there may be an opportunity for bias among judges in the competition. I would like to hear opinions regarding this... ???

Offline Steve in TX

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2014, 07:59:28 PM »
Comps that I have judged or stewarded in were sure to keep judges off of flights they were entered into. I think banning judges from the entire competition will limit the number of judges willing to volunteer their time.

Offline Rief Artisan Ales

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2014, 08:14:10 PM »
Comps that I have judged or stewarded in were sure to keep judges off of flights they were entered into. I think banning judges from the entire competition will limit the number of judges willing to volunteer their time.

I kinda thought that might a deterrent for the judges.  What about a tiered system for competitions?  Where the entrants have their brews judged in a separate class.  Non-judges, judges, etc.

Offline tschmidlin

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2014, 11:12:46 PM »
Seems like a waste of time to me.  I don't know of any competitions that prevent judges from entering, but they all make sure that judges do not judge styles they enter.
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Offline ynotbrusum

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2014, 03:57:23 AM »
I'm not a judge, but I am sure adequate safeguards are in place to prevent bias.  Judges should be allowed to enter competitions for no charge as payback for - but not even close to the value of - their time volunteered. 
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Offline AmandaK

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2014, 04:48:26 AM »
Seems like a waste of time to me.  I don't know of any competitions that prevent judges from entering, but they all make sure that judges do not judge styles they enter.

+1
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Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2014, 05:02:49 AM »
If one competes enough, one realizes the competition would not happen without judges, so one becomes a judge. That does not stop one from competing. The system has processes that keeps the judge from judging his beer. One needs to also know that the beers are judged blind. The only situation that comes up occasionally is when a unique beer comes up, and a judge may say I think I know that beer, and excuses themselves from judging the beer. Examples are a unique beer that the judge tasted at a club meeting.

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Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2014, 05:12:47 AM »
Lets see, learn to brew well, buy equipment,  ingredients, invest a month, pay entry fee, pay shipping, become a judge, attend competition, weasel way into your beers flight, get lucky enough to judge your own beer and pick it out of the group, somehow convince others that it should go to BOS, get on BOS judging panel, convince others your beer is best, accept medal. Or... just go buy a medal.

Online Jimmy K

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2014, 06:27:49 AM »
I kinda thought that might a deterrent for the judges.  What about a tiered system for competitions?  Where the entrants have their brews judged in a separate class.  Non-judges, judges, etc.
Since entrant classes are usually based on ability (like amateur vs pro), I think this would create the impression that judges are by definition better brewers than non-judges. This isn't necessarily true.
 
But there are some practical reasons not to worry. Rewards for judging are low - judges are spending money on gas/tolls to spend a long day thinking really critically about beer (not quite as much fun as you'd think) usually in exchange for lunch and an experience point. This tends to weed out anyone who doesn't have a highly altruistic sense of service to the homebrewing hobby. 
 
Also, if someone wants to game the system, it's going to be really hard to stop them with rules. Again, we really depend on judges having a sense of service and honesty. And if you work at any competition of decent size, you'll get a sense that it would be hard to give a particular beer a boost. Out of hundreds of entries, a judge has a low chance of being on the flight with one particular entry. And that entry would still have to make it through mini-BOS and BOS to win.
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Offline udubdawg

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2014, 06:38:11 AM »
I kinda thought that might a deterrent for the judges.  What about a tiered system for competitions?  Where the entrants have their brews judged in a separate class.  Non-judges, judges, etc.
Since entrant classes are usually based on ability (like amateur vs pro), I think this would create the impression that judges are by definition better brewers than non-judges. This isn't necessarily true.
 

and if it WERE true I would find it silly that the the non-trained judges would be judging the best beers while the actual BJCP judges would be judging the inferior beers.



Offline micsager

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2014, 07:47:32 AM »
Lets see, learn to brew well, buy equipment,  ingredients, invest a month, pay entry fee, pay shipping, become a judge, attend competition, weasel way into your beers flight, get lucky enough to judge your own beer and pick it out of the group, somehow convince others that it should go to BOS, get on BOS judging panel, convince others your beer is best, accept medal. Or... just go buy a medal.

LOL

Online kramerog

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2014, 07:48:47 AM »
Lets see, learn to brew well, buy equipment,  ingredients, invest a month, pay entry fee, pay shipping, become a judge, attend competition, weasel way into your beers flight, get lucky enough to judge your own beer and pick it out of the group, somehow convince others that it should go to BOS, get on BOS judging panel, convince others your beer is best, accept medal. Or... just go buy a medal.

You forgot some steps: somehow convince others that it should go to mini-BOS, get on mini-BOS judging panel, convince others your beer is best in mini-BOS!
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Offline denny

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2014, 08:34:42 AM »
Should judges be allowed to enter beer in the same competition that they are judging in? I feel that there may be an opportunity for bias among judges in the competition. I would like to hear opinions regarding this... ???

Of course.  as long as they don't judge their own beer, what's the issue?  I have entered in many of the comps I've judged.
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Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2014, 09:13:55 AM »
It should also be pointed out that software used for many of the comps has the entry section, and a section to sign up to judge. The software also will exclude the judge from the being on the flights entered when assignments are made. If there is a glitch and a judge is assigned to a category she or he has entered, then the judge has to talk to the judge wrangler/coordinator saying they can't be at that table. I had to excuses myself from one flight a few years back, so another judge was swapped out with me.
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Offline braufessor

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Re: Homebrew Competition Rules
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2014, 04:21:55 PM »
Seems like the type of rule that would make it impossible (instead of just being difficult) to attract enough quality judges to pull off a decent size competition.  I think judges should not judge a category they enter - which seems pretty standard.  Beyond that, they should absolutely be able to participate as anyone else would.