Author Topic: Noob judge observations  (Read 3376 times)

Online hopfenundmalz

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #15 on: April 06, 2014, 04:01:55 PM »
We all have met Denny somewhere in the Homebrewing continuum. Jim, you will too someday.
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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #16 on: April 06, 2014, 04:18:22 PM »
I had little idea of what to expect for quality or scores. After 8 or so Stouts, 10 or so Porters, and a dozen American Ales, (a large enough number to get a feel) I found most were fairly well made. Only three or four had serious issues. None were gag reflex undrinkable.  The numbers were what struck me. I didn't keep a tally but most were mid to high 20s. Only about 10% broke the 40 mark. I think our highest was 42. So I now think 35 and up is something to be happy with. I suppose it depends on your level of skill and experience though.

I personally believe that brewers should be happy to receive any score above 29.  A 30 beer is a beer that is good enough to sell.  The difference between a 30 beer and a 40 beer is usually style guideline related, not beer quality related.

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Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #17 on: April 06, 2014, 04:47:50 PM »
I tend to agree with this. Actually there are many fairly well known beers on the market that are great but don't fit the guidelines super well.

The scoring is unique compared to the rest of the world. It seems like 30 of 50 would be low. That's a 60%, which in the real world is a D, and one point over failure.  But the point spread definition at the bottom of the page puts it in perspective. Anyway, it was a great experience

Offline dbeechum

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #18 on: April 06, 2014, 09:06:19 PM »
We all have met Denny somewhere in the Homebrewing continuum. Jim, you will too someday.

Some of us, more than we'd like! :)
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Offline udubdawg

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #19 on: April 07, 2014, 06:11:44 AM »
I had little idea of what to expect for quality or scores. After 8 or so Stouts, 10 or so Porters, and a dozen American Ales, (a large enough number to get a feel) I found most were fairly well made. Only three or four had serious issues. None were gag reflex undrinkable.  The numbers were what struck me. I didn't keep a tally but most were mid to high 20s. Only about 10% broke the 40 mark. I think our highest was 42. So I now think 35 and up is something to be happy with. I suppose it depends on your level of skill and experience though.

I personally believe that brewers should be happy to receive any score above 29.   A 30 beer is a beer that is good enough to sell.  The difference between a 30 beer and a 40 beer is usually style guideline related, not beer quality related.

I started to disagree, but then realized that is only because I am a judge.  I'm sure someone's going to take this the wrong way, but with a few exceptions I view a 30 on one of my beers as a waste of an entry fee.  My personal goal for some time has required a 36 to be satisfied.  But then, people use so little of the scale perhaps I need to adjust.  So, long story short, I sort of agree.

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Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #20 on: April 07, 2014, 07:10:03 AM »
I think "realistic" exists somewhere between "woo hoo I didn't get a 13" and "damn it, that was a 49 beer! "

Offline tschmidlin

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #21 on: April 07, 2014, 08:40:30 AM »
I just don't think you can make rules like a certain score means a certain thing.  Too many things that are beyond the control of the brewer influence the scores .  I've had the same beer get a 45 and a 23 in competition, and the latter entry was not a bad bottle.  Based on the judges comments, it finished both dry and cloying, with a specialty flavor both overwhelming and absent, depending on which score sheet you read.  That's an extreme case, however not all judges score the beers the same way.  I tend to run a few points higher than most people I judge with, so a 33 from me could be a 28 from another judge.  That doesn't mean the beer in their cup is 5 points worse.
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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #22 on: April 07, 2014, 09:15:59 AM »
We all have met Denny somewhere in the Homebrewing continuum. Jim, you will too someday.

To me, meeting other homebrewers is the best part of the hobby.  No, really!
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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #23 on: April 07, 2014, 09:16:32 AM »
We all have met Denny somewhere in the Homebrewing continuum. Jim, you will too someday.

Some of us, more than we'd like! :)

Hey now!  ;)
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #24 on: April 07, 2014, 10:54:47 AM »
I just don't think you can make rules like a certain score means a certain thing.  Too many things that are beyond the control of the brewer influence the scores .  I've had the same beer get a 45 and a 23 in competition, and the latter entry was not a bad bottle.  Based on the judges comments, it finished both dry and cloying, with a specialty flavor both overwhelming and absent, depending on which score sheet you read.  That's an extreme case, however not all judges score the beers the same way.  I tend to run a few points higher than most people I judge with, so a 33 from me could be a 28 from another judge.  That doesn't mean the beer in their cup is 5 points worse.

The couple beers that I judged to be more than 5 points lower than tye other judges were beers that I detected both phenolic and oxydation. So when I read the scoring guide at the bottom, where it says "off flavors" plural, more than one... I was thinking that two off flavors would limit it to a score between 14-20. They explained that the score guide isn't the rule, and if tye off flavors are minor it could score higher. IIRC I adjusted up to 22 and they came down a couple.

I dont know what that has to do with anything, but im curious for thoughts on how much the Score Guide should be followed.

Offline jaftak22

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #25 on: April 07, 2014, 04:20:42 PM »
That's pretty cool man. Hope to get into judging after the Army moves me to Ft Lewis.  Good to see your wife get involved with everything. Did you have to twist her arm or she just that kind of person?

Offline klickitat jim

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #26 on: April 07, 2014, 07:03:13 PM »
We do everything together. Hence the avatar. But yes, it meant the world to me that they accepted her and she super enjoyed it. She was even light heartedly annoyed by the cellar master, cuz he was telling people she was head steward.

Edit:
Literally everything. Even at work she's telling me where to go, who to talk to... or constantly asking me what I'm doing.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2014, 07:43:36 PM by klickitat jim »

Offline garc_mall

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #27 on: April 07, 2014, 10:14:54 PM »
That's pretty cool man. Hope to get into judging after the Army moves me to Ft Lewis.  Good to see your wife get involved with everything. Did you have to twist her arm or she just that kind of person?

Ft Lewis actually has a rather large homebrew competition sponsored by the MWR. They are always looking for judges, so you shouldn't have a problem with it.
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Offline jaftak22

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #28 on: April 08, 2014, 06:50:36 AM »
That's pretty cool man. Hope to get into judging after the Army moves me to Ft Lewis.  Good to see your wife get involved with everything. Did you have to twist her arm or she just that kind of person?

Ft Lewis actually has a rather large homebrew competition sponsored by the MWR. They are always looking for judges, so you shouldn't have a problem with it.

That's good to hear. I knew that there would be a homebrew scene up there. It was either that or germany. Wife didn't wanna go

Online hopfenundmalz

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Re: Noob judge observations
« Reply #29 on: April 08, 2014, 07:51:01 AM »
That's pretty cool man. Hope to get into judging after the Army moves me to Ft Lewis.  Good to see your wife get involved with everything. Did you have to twist her arm or she just that kind of person?

Ft Lewis actually has a rather large homebrew competition sponsored by the MWR. They are always looking for judges, so you shouldn't have a problem with it.

That's good to hear. I knew that there would be a homebrew scene up there. It was either that or germany. Wife didn't wanna go

My wife agreed to go, had the time of her life.

Business assignment for me, not military.
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